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View Poll Results: Do you pledge or not ?
Yes I do 23 95.83%
No I do not 1 4.17%
Voters: 24. You may not vote on this poll

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Old 11-28-2012, 06:32 PM
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Pledge of Allegiance

For all who love this country...
I pledge allegiance , to the flag
Of the United States of America
And to the republic for which it stands
One nation , Under GOD , indivisible, with liberty and justice for all

For all who love this country vote yes if you pledge to the flag, vote no if you do not.

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Last edited by LATECH; 11-28-2012 at 06:39 PM.
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Old 11-28-2012, 06:40 PM
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I wouldn't have it any other way..
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Old 11-28-2012, 08:00 PM
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Yes for me. Too many lives have been lost keeping our way of life. And even though some would bail the minute the going got rough, I'd still fight to protect them, at least as long as they stayed by my side and didn't run away. I'm not trying to sound heroic, just being pragmatic.
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Old 11-28-2012, 09:08 PM
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I wonder where atheists fall on this poll.
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Old 11-28-2012, 10:08 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Supercharged03 View Post
I wonder where atheists fall on this poll.
Don't know, but I AM sure I could not care less. But I'd still defend their right to be one, however misguided I might think them to be.
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Old 11-29-2012, 12:21 AM
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I vote yes, even if the board won't let me yet..
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Old 11-29-2012, 07:52 AM
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The State of Massachusetts wants to take Under God out of the Pledge as announced this week. I'm not particularly religious, but that's one of the tenets that this US of A most of us live in was founded on. I don't intend on making this a political rant, but take a look at the direction our country's leadership is moving and organizations the ACLU are protecting.
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Old 11-29-2012, 08:00 AM
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Originally Posted by Irelands child View Post
The State of Massachusetts wants to take Under God out of the Pledge as announced this week. I'm not particularly religious, but that's one of the tenets that this US of A most of us live in was founded on. I don't intend on making this a political rant, but take a look at the direction our country's leadership is moving and organizations the ACLU are protecting.
Kinda funny how when God WAS part of this country we was leading the world and many ways.. Now they want to take him out and the country is going to h***... Kinda makes you wonder...

I think they are making a big mistake if they do..
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Old 11-29-2012, 08:05 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Irelands child View Post
The State of Massachusetts wants to take Under God out of the Pledge as announced this week. I'm not particularly religious, but that's one of the tenets that this US of A most of us live in was founded on. I don't intend on making this a political rant, but take a look at the direction our country's leadership is moving and organizations the ACLU are protecting.

organizations the ACLU are protecting

^^ here is the problem... and if you say boo.. about it your a racist..
thats who funded that little b_tch that was going to Boston College A CATHOLIC college by the way.. to remove the pictures of Jesus from the school.. the school asked the little lady. if she didn't understand that she applied to a catholic school.. and she said yes.. they do this crap on purpose..
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Old 11-29-2012, 05:12 PM
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Im writing this because some seem to think the Addition of "under God" has always been in the pledge!

"Louis A. Bowman (1872–1959), an attorney from Illinois, was the first to initiate the addition of "under God" to the Pledge. The National Society of the Daughters of the American Revolution gave him an Award of Merit as the originator of this idea. He spent his adult life in the Chicago area and was Chaplain of the Illinois Society of the Sons of the American Revolution. At a meeting on February 12, 1948,Lincoln's Birthday, he led the Society in swearing the Pledge with two words added, "under God.


The Pledge of Allegiance was written in 1892 by Francis Bellamy (1855–1931), who was a Baptist minister, a Christian socialist, and the cousin of socialist utopian novelist Edward Bellamy (1850–1898). The original "Pledge of Allegiance" Did not contain the word GOD and was published in the an issue of the popular children's magazine The Youth's Companion as part of the National Public-School Celebration of Columbus Day, a celebration of the 400th anniversary of Christopher Columbus's arrival in the Americas.

The event was conceived and promoted by James B. Upham a marketer for the magazine, as a campaign to instill the idea of American nationalism with an add campaign to sell flags to public schools and magazines to students.

In 1952, Holger Christian Langmack wrote a letter to President Truman suggesting the inclusion of "under God" in the Pledge of Allegiance. Mr. Langmack was a Danish philosopher and educator who came to the United States in 1911. He was one of the originators of the Prayer Breakfast and a religious leader in Washington, D.C. President Truman met with him along with several others to discuss the inclusion of "under God" and "love" just before "liberty and justice".[citation needed]

At the suggestion of a correspondent, Representative Louis C. Rabaut of Michigan sponsored a resolution to add the words "under God" to the Pledge in 1953. The phrase "under God" was incorporated into the Pledge of Allegiance June 14, 1954, by a Joint Resolution of Congress!

The introduction of "under God" in the mid 1950s was done during the Cold War, as a way to differentiate the U.S. from the concept of communist state of atheism. A political move!

When I was a boy I said the pledge every day in public school with no God in it, and at Catholic Catechism ( like a Sunday school) I had to say it with the word God! It was weird to me having to say it 2 different ways back then? as young as I was! It was really cool when the whole country accepted the Christian pledge to the flag I didn't have to say it 2 different ways anymore!!!!! I was very young and didn't understand why the religious groups like Jehovah Witness were the first to fight its adaption in the courts!!

Under God being included or not has little difference, its a pledge to a flag! Written and designed for children by a Baptist Minister and socialist, that was smart enough not to include the word God, then was printed to sell a product, and adapted with the words "under God" for political reasons!

I say it and being a vet solute the flag, And been doing it for so long its indoctrinated into my skull LOL As a child it was just something I had to memorize 2 different ways and didn't pay much attention to what I was saying I would rather have played in the sand box But after being in combat it has much more of a real meaning that swells up in my heart! Not the words "under God" but seeing the flag waving proudly!

This Country was taken during the revaluation for basic freedoms from a Monarchy England! And one of those freedoms is peoples freedoms of religion or non religion! Not a nation founded under God!


__________________________________________________ _______________

John Adams, Second President of the United States, wrote in his 1788 "A Defense of the Constitutions of Government of the United States of America" that:

"Thirteen governments [of the original states] thus founded on the natural authority of the people alone, without a pretense of miracle or mystery, and which are destined to spread over the northern part of that whole quarter of the globe, are a great point gained in favor of the rights of mankind....

The United States of America have exhibited, perhaps, the first example of governments erected on the simple principles of nature; and if men are now sufficiently enlightened to disabuse themselves of artifice, imposture, hypocrisy, and superstition, they will consider this even an era in their history.

Although the detail of the formation of the American governments is at present little known or regarded either in Europe or in America, it may hereafter become an object of curiosity. It will never be pretended that any persons employed in that service had interviews with the gods, or were in any degree under the influence of Heaven, more than those at work upon ships or houses, or laboring in merchandise or agriculture; it will forever be acknowledged that these governments were contrived merely by the use of reason and the senses... ""It is true that during the Constitutional Convention a minority favored some recognition of Christianity in the Constitution. Those views were rejected, and the Constitution was adopted as a completely secular document."

The phrase "In God We Trust" did not become the official U.S. national motto until after the passage of an Act of Congress in 1956.

__________________________________________________ _______________


The founding fathers were thought to be agnostics and some would even say atheists, regardless of this, it's clear in a lot of their writings that they believed in a secular state, so no, it wasn't founded upon God.
For example a quote from the Treaty of Tripoli would easily suggest the secular views of the founding fathers:

"As the Government of the United States of America is not, in any sense, founded on the Christian religion; as it has in itself no character of enmity against the laws, religion, or tranquillity, of Mussulmen; and, as the said States never entered into any war, or act of hostility against any Mahometan nation, it is declared by the parties, that no pretext arising from religious opinions, shall ever produce an interruption of the harmony existing between the two countries."

There are plenty more quotes, particularly from Thomas Jefferson, that can be found pretty easily on the internet to show the secular and possibly atheistic views of the founding fathers themselves.
__________________________________________________ _______________
Regardless of this, American politics today is extremely heavily influenced by religion!!

Ronald Reagan, 40th U.S. President, in his Feb. 3, 1983 Proclamation 5018, which declared 1983 as "The Year of the Bible," stated:

"The Bible and its teachings helped form the basis for the Founding Fathers' abiding belief in the inalienable rights of the individual, rights which they found implicit in the Bible's teachings of the inherent worth and dignity of each individual. This same sense of man patterned the convictions of those who framed the English system of law inherited by our own Nation, as well as the ideals set forth in the Declaration of Independence and the Constitution."

__________________________________________________ _________________

It seems to me the United states is returning slowly to religion run politics!

I say let Christians put up their nativity scenes on our government buildings lawns, and parks, as long as there is room left for every other group to put up any thing they want!

Freedom for one freedom for all!

I'm a Christian, I am patriotic, and a combat vet of war, I also believe in the government of the United States, and God was not in the pledge, it was added years later and if its taken back out the pledge will go back the way it was meant to be, life will go on just as it always has! And its a couple of more words kids don't have to memorize! By the way we used to salute the flag during the pledge with arms straight out Like Hitler who adopted it from us and the writer of the pledge (it was called the "Bellamy Salute")!

Jester

This might shock some> about our pledge of allegiance.And its author!!

Last edited by painted jester; 11-29-2012 at 05:24 PM.
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Old 11-29-2012, 05:28 PM
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Originally Posted by Supercharged03 View Post
I wonder where atheists fall on this poll.
Sadly, you must die to find out
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Old 11-29-2012, 05:30 PM
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A definite YES for me, however, I don't think that a thread with Religion and Politics will last long before the fur starts to fly. Just MHO
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Old 11-29-2012, 05:38 PM
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Wow Jester, possibly your best post ever! Very insightful. we forget one of the reasons why this coutry was started, it was to escape religous persecution.

I am against any religion in government, it opens too many avenues of discrimination. At the same time, I agree with you, let people choose what they wish to portray, as long as all can do the same. It does piss me off to no end when the gov't says you can't use the word God or symbols of christianity at the holidays on public property. I think they forget what public property is, property owned by the citizens of this country. If something offends you, don't look or participate. It's not porn for gosh sake. I don't partake in Muslim, Buddhist, Mormon, etc. activities but I will defend their right to do so.

I was pretty much a hippie sh** in the 60's and early 70's, hated government interference, the authority, protested the war, did all the things I believed in. I still said the pledge of allegiance and believed in it. We have placed our heads in the sand for far too long in the last 30 years, it is time to start taking a stand. The government has taken too much away from us in the inerest of protecting us from ourselves, it ain't a perfect world but if you're over the age of 18 you should be able to make most of the decisions for yourselves. We can listen to cursing on most every TV show after 9 p.m. but we are offended by the word God? Get real and leave us alone, govnrment nay sayers. Time for some protesting again, maybe get a few folks to carry some nativity scenes down to te local government offices and let our feelings be known. Recite the pledge of allegiance while doing this. Where are todays hippies?
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Old 11-29-2012, 06:06 PM
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[QUOTE=dinger;1617192]Wow Jester, possibly your best post ever! Very insightful. we forget one of the reasons why this coutry was started, it was to escape religous persecution.





Thanks Dinger: We had a nativity scene here ( A small town) that was never vandalized in a park here for years and last year a group put up something that wasn't acceptable to the churches and it was the Christians that vandalized it!!!! I would have thought the atheist group would have done that! But the atheists actually respected the rights of the churches!!! It was the Christians that didn't respect the atheists rights!!!!! And its the Christians that want their symbolism displayed they don't want any one else having the same rights even though they spout all the hypocrisy about this country being founded under God! They don't follow its laws themselves!

Jester
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Old 11-29-2012, 06:17 PM
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The pledge is fine. Nothing wrong with it.
What IS wrong is that our government is 100% corrupt.

There is a government behind our government that pulls the strings. An elite ruling class. A bloodline. An aristocracy of purpose.
The "people" no longer have representation.
The 1% movement is actually on the right track, but the truth is more like 5%.

5% takes it all, and locks-out the other 95%.
Elite bloodlines who have wealth and power want to ensure they will maintain the wealth and control. They own banks, corporations, media conglomerates, oil companies, AND..... you guessed it: the political system.

What you see on TV is controlled by them. Most of what you read in newspapers is controlled by them. We live in a filter-bubble.

The awakened ones, refer to "them" as THE PTB. ( Powers That Be )
They are evil, corrupt psychopaths bent on deception, greed, and enslaving the masses.

Look up BILDERBERG GROUP. also look into BOHEMIAN GROVE.
The world you "think" you live in.... is an illusion.
An illusion that has been carefully designed by highly intelligent thinkers who work for the "masters".

ALSO remember this: NOTHING happens by chance or coincidence.
Nothing is a random accident. Everything is part of their master plan.
Think about that for awhile.

You think I am a conspiracy nut? Sure... that's exactly what "they" want you to think. Don't believe a word I say. Do your own research. Question everything. Look deeper.
Most people don't. They totally accept whatever lies they are spoon-fed by the mass-media propaganda machine.
Live your lives in ignorant bliss if that is your choice.
Many people can't handle the truth. It is what it is.
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