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Old 04-22-2004, 07:20 AM
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Pontiac Oil pump question- HELP !!!

71 350 Pontiac Lemans

A friends car had been held hostage in another shop for 30 months. The motor was in pieces. He brought it over for me to assemble. I'm a chevy guy, and he is not a motor guy. Anyways , we assembled the motor, and dropped it in. We went to drop the oil pump drive shaft and it appears to be 1" short !?! It was a Sealed Power Pump, and we didn't have the original to compare it to. Does Pontiac make different length drives or did the builder give him the wrong pump? I'm loading the baseball bat as I type...

Please help !?!?!

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Old 04-22-2004, 04:53 PM
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Well for one thing, the oil pump shaft goes on the oil pump when the pump is put in on Pontiacs. Pontiac only used one length of pump shaft on all engines from the 326 up to the 455. I've always used the Melling pump in all my Pontiac engines and had alot of success with them. What is the number on the Sealed Power pump that you used?
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Old 04-22-2004, 11:16 PM
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Normally the shaft is attached to the pump and then the pump is set in place. There are two dimples on the drive shaft rod that prevents it from coming loose from the pump and sliding out the distributor hole. The dimples require that the rod be installed from the bottom of the engine. For those of us that forget to install the pump shaft at the correct time, the dimples can be ground smooth and the pump rod set in from the top through the distributor hole. Only problem is you have to be more careful not to pull the rod out of the oil pump when removing the distributor. If you did try and install the rod from the top with the dimples still there, it probably would miss connecting with the oil pump by about an inch.
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Old 04-23-2004, 06:57 AM
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Yep, you guys are absolutely right. I screwed up when assembling it. Last night I ground off the nibs and set it down on the oil pump. Kind of tricky, but I got it after about 30 tries. Scarey, too. The first time it wasn't on, and it dropped way down, but I was able to grab it with a magnet I'm glad thats over ! This thing has been a pain. Seems that a bunch of the parts were legitamitly wrong. Push rods that were 3" too short, rocker arms that wouldn't fit the head studs. Gaskets for a motor without D shapd ports. I just assumed this was another one. My bad! For what this guy has into the motor PARTS, he could have bought a 400 horse crate motor (Chevy) that would be 100# lighter. Should have "Fire in the hole" by Sunday, provided we don't have other parts issues.
How do you guys deal with the headers? What a pain to install that one bolt , and slide it back. I thought SBC were bad. The headers we are using are Hookers. Are hedmans the same?
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Old 04-23-2004, 12:24 PM
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All makes of headers are basically the same PITA to install on a Pontiac. The easiest are Doug's Headers, and they actually have enough room to get a box end wrench on the bolts - but you still get to stand on your head while installing them. I've found that some Hooker Headers can be helped by blending the corners of the large hole about a 1/4" along the slot before you begin. It's not always necessary, but doesn't hurt to do it beforehand. Look the bright side - one painful afternoon and all the sparkplug changes for the life of the engine are simple, and no burned sprakplug wires either. I also would put the weights of the engines within 40 pounds of each other. And while it's true that Chevy parts are cheaper, isn't that like a steady diet of McDonald's every night?
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Old 04-23-2004, 02:03 PM
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More like Burger King. Same stuff, but you can have it your way ! Poncho plugs are DEFINATELY easier to get to than on a SBC ! Some pluses, some minuses. Just tough to convert under the gun when you have just a Haynes manual and Chevy experience, if you know what I mean. I haven't finished my Chevelle or my shop, and he was at my doorstep. Oh well.
You'd drool over this car. All original, NO work EVER done to it. Its starting to get surface rust. This guy has had it since 75. Stored inside for last 20 years. No winters,except 75,76,77. Some fresh paint, new vinyl top (hard), and is ready for the car shows.
Thanks again guys !
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Old 04-23-2004, 04:11 PM
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Been any way we can help we will. Both Lust and I are both members of a Pontiac board plus longtime Pontiac owners. Hey besides what is this board for, make friends and help each other out. All of us have run into problems before and it doesn't hurt to ask. Anything erlse we can do for you just holler and one of us will be here to help. Have a good one and keep us informed on the Chevelle. Alan
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Old 04-26-2004, 06:53 AM
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Frustrating Weekend #2

1.) The heads used were off a 68 400ci motor. Guess what. There are only 4 accessory holes and the 71 heads had 6. Bet you can't guess which 2 holes I needed. One is for the alternator pivot/power steering and the other is for the second power steering mount. Time to buy '68 Alternator and P/S mounts from Year One, I guess.

2.) The intake gaskets that the engine "builder" sent with the motor were the permatorques. Can't use them on the Edelbrock, so had to order printoseals.

3.) Carb that was sent was also the wrong one. It was a Edelbrock Quadrajet 901 (Chevy only application). Heat riser won't work, needs a electric choke for this application. Also needs an adapter for the throttle cable. Wrong inlet side, etc. Grrrr.

There's more, but it's Monday, so......
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Old 04-27-2004, 03:41 AM
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Been, if I could afford it I'd take a week off and come up and give you a hand. As far as intake gaskets I only use the Mr.Gasket intake gaskets as they have the small openings for the heat crossovers and I always use the blockoff plates. I've had problems in the past with both Victor and FelPro intake gaskets as far as getting the right ones. If you can find a Q-jet from an Olds, Buick or Pontiac and have it rebuilt it will be better than everything you'll have to go throught getting the Edelbrock to work. Also the Edelbrocks are calibrated for Chevy applications and would have to be tuned to the Pontiac. I con't have the brackets you need that I could send you right now but know where to get them so if you can't get what you need drop me a personal mail. Hopefully this week will be better and remember keep ing.
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Old 04-27-2004, 06:43 AM
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Alan,
I have it under control now (I think). Its been a battle of trying to save the guy cash vs. what he already spent. I told him to buck up and order what we needed. He gave Year one and Summit a call along with a trip to the parts store.
Just seems that every time you THINK you have what ya need, the needs change.
I ended up using the printoseals. I've had great luck with them on SBC's.
Last night he ordered/picked up: Battery tray, radiator rubbers, tall valve covers, carb linkage adapter (They had one!) battery,new starter, alternator, banjo bolts, fuel/vacuum line, pcv valve, check valve for power head, power steering line (got the wrong one the first time), new collectors to match the new exhaust, and a slew of other parts. We did about $2,000 worth of damage to his visa in the last 2 weeks. But, I see the light at the end of the tunnel. Theres a pic of it in my gallery "Ralph's Revenge".
Here's the GOOD NEWS !! I'll be flying out Thursday AM to meet "Dinger" on Friday. We're going to Gene Winfield's seminar on English wheel, hammer welding and a bunch of other cool stuff. I'll be taking TONS of pics to upload. FIVE GLORIOUS DAYS AWAY from the "project from he!!". LOL Gene Winfield was the guy in charge of sectioning and chopping the 54 Chevy on Monster Garage. The only episode where the people actually did something constructive ! Ill keep you updated !
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