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Old 07-25-2010, 06:32 AM
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Power Steering Box from a '75 Firebird is it

Is the power steering box from a '75 Firebird the same as a '76 LeMans??
Thanks!

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Old 07-25-2010, 08:36 AM
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I got this number off the steering box 7806688.. Just a very small leak overnight, but enough to see a spot in the a.m. Any ideas fellers or tricks to be able to spot exactly where the leak is coming from.. Car is 34 years of age and as one might imagine, a load of grease/dirt/ etc down there to make it difficult, eh.. Have a Firebird '75 steering box out back but no numbers off it just yet..
Thanks for listening!!
T.
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Old 07-25-2010, 09:29 AM
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Its easier and faster to fix the leak on the box on the car.I wouldnt bother changing it just for a leak. Gm make 2 steering boxes. one has a 1 inch pitman shaft and one has a 1 and 1/8 shaft. Since the firebird piman ARM is different than the lemans you will have to pull it to use on the other box provided the pitman shaft diameter is the same. If you going that far just knock the pitman off with the box on the car and yank the seal and replace it.
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Old 07-26-2010, 05:42 AM
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Thanks for the info.. Where is the Seal on the steering box causing this leak? After I park the LeMans, I can see a bit of PS fluid on the lowest part of the steering unit where I got the number from. Can't see any bolts down there to get to the seal..
Showing me ignorance eh, but I appreciate your help.
Thanks!!!
T.
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Old 07-26-2010, 07:44 AM
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there is a seal in the box at the pitman arm. you know the lever looking thing that moves left and right when you turn the steering wheel. It is held on with that big *** nut . you will need to rent a puller to pull it off once you get the nut off becuase of the interferencs fit of the shaft to the arm. After you get the arm off the rest is pretty simple. Clean out the crud from inside there and you will see a snap ring. Remove the snap ring. Now heres the trick... once the snap ring is out of the way put a drain pan under the box and get in the car start the engine and turn the steering wheel all the way left or right. Turn it very abruptly and the pressure developed should push the seal out into the pan.I have done it that way for years . No need to drill a hole etc.the hardest part will be the uller on the arm. if you get it tightened down good and you get no action smack the end of the tool ( the part where you turn with the socket) with a good size hammer. Smak it a couple times then see if you can turn the screw some more . it should turn and finish the pull.
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Old 07-26-2010, 11:02 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by opelitis5
Is the power steering box from a '75 Firebird the same as a '76 LeMans??
Thanks!
Physically, probably- but the internal stops will likely be different, this can cause wheel scrubbing or an insanely large turning radius.

The nut is on there TIGHT! If the nut's 1-5/16" the torque is 180 ft/lb as an example! I've always removed them w/an impact wrench. Use a pittman arm puller and not a "pickle fork". The one shown is $12 @ WalMart:



Once you get the puller on, put as much tension as you can on it and if the arm still doesn't budge, give the side of the arm a solid *whack* w/a 3 pound hammer. It will pop right off. I'm not saying to just wail hell out of it, just a good shock is all that's needed.

The code you want to look for is a two letter code- like "XE" or "WX", etc. Should be on the aluminum cover, IIRC.
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Old 07-26-2010, 07:24 PM
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that s right they did make a close ratio box also but travel stop to stop should be the same. the close ratio gets there with less turns of the wheel.That puller in the picture is bareley a pittman arm puller.but it may work.
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Old 07-26-2010, 07:26 PM
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the 500" box they call ( I guess) is the same pittman shaft size as the manual box. The 700 box ( whatever) is the box with the larger pittman shaft.
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Old 07-26-2010, 08:04 PM
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Not sure it is coming from the seal at the Pittman arm.. Gonna spray some Gunk down and about the area and see where the fluid is starting from..
It is puddling a bit on the aluminum cover which is the lowest point then slowly oozing from there.. Gotta remember it is a 34 year old beast, eh!!
Will get back Gennelmen!!
T.
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Old 07-27-2010, 07:41 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by latech
that s right they did make a close ratio box also but travel stop to stop should be the same. the close ratio gets there with less turns of the wheel.That puller in the picture is bareley a pittman arm puller.but it may work.
Actually, that would be a quick ratio. 1969-'76 Camaro as well as 1964-'76 Chevelle, Malibu and Monte Carlo could be had w/an optional quick ratio 12.7:1 box.

The photo of the puller is representative, although should be plenty sufficient for a one time use- if the local parts store loaner is a pos.

As for the internal stops, instead of cutting and pasting, the OP can read it at http://www.442.com/oldsfaq/ofstr.htm but the bottom line is there is a distinct possibility that the tires will rub w/a swap like the OP first mentioned.

Quote:
the 500" box they call ( I guess) is the same pittman shaft size as the manual box. The 700 box ( whatever) is the box with the larger pittman shaft.
The steering boxes in question is hopefully the Saginaw 605 or 800 series steering box and not a 525 w/small pittman- or some other box. An 800 box has a cover w/four bolts securing it, the 605 units use a single snap ring that holds a round cover into the top of the housing.

This is a partial list of boxes:

1964-'76 AMC
1961-'76 Cadillac, including
1963-'76 Eldora do
1964-'76 Buick and Pontiac full-size cars and Riviera
1973-'76 Regal
1975-'76 Skyhawk, Seville, Monza and Starfire
1965-'76 Chevrolet full-size cars
1967-'76 Camaro and 1968-'76 Nova
1964-'76 Chevelle, Cutlass, GTO, Grand Prix, Lemans, Ventura and Tempest
1971-'76 Vega and 1975 Pontiac Astre
1960-'76 Oldsmobile full-size cars including 1966-'76 Tornado
1971-'76 Jeep Cherokee, Wagoneer, Gladiator and J-series pickups
1972-'75 International Scout and Traveler

I would suggest that if the OP doesn't have a 800 box already, that he get one if he's going to do a swap anyway. Get a quick ratio if his isn't is another option. There are swap fittings to mate the earlier cars pumps to later boxes. The rag joint size may or may not differ, depending on what box he's starting out with.

The ink stamp is located on the end cap opposite the steering shaft, not stamped as I said before. The stamp can get rubbed off over time but will often still be legible.

"YA" is the quick ratio box used on 1983-'88 Monte Carlo, 1983-'84 Hurst Olds, 1985-'87 Olds 442, and 1984-'87 Buick Grand National or T-Type, among others. If a swap is going to be made, might as well get a quick ratio box to replace whatever you now have- unless it already is a quick ratio box- in which case I'd just replace the seal and call it done.

Last edited by cobalt327; 07-27-2010 at 11:46 AM.
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Old 07-27-2010, 07:03 PM
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thats good info right there cobalt. Did not know exact name/number for all these boxes.Definetly can stop one from leaking but have not spent enough time studying the particualers of different boxes. Some noteworthy changes from box to box especially some of the f body ones that effect turning radius. I wish I had more time for hotroddin and had to spend less time working to live.
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Old 07-27-2010, 07:12 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by latech
thats good info right there cobalt. Did not know exact name/number for all these boxes.Definetly can stop one from leaking but have not spent enough time studying the particualers of different boxes. Some noteworthy changes from box to box especially some of the f body ones that effect turning radius. I wish I had more time for hotroddin and had to spend less time working to live.
Tell me about the time deal... I wonder quite often if the project I'm on will be my last...

At least my current position forces me to live in front of a monitor and affords me an opportunity to go online often. Trust me- w/o the internet, info like on the steering boxes would be hard to come by for me. I do have a ton of GM service manuals from a previous life, but sifting through data like that is mind-numbingly tedious.

But anyway, please do not think I know that info by memory. I "cheated", plain and simple.
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Old 07-27-2010, 07:41 PM
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No problem. I appreciate the info. Believe me anything I learn will make my life easier. I am still reading the old faq you posted as I have a box I going to put in my 64 lemans as soon as I get the time.I got my info (about boxes from a pontiacmuscle car guide salvage yard buyers guide and I can tell you it is not as detailed as the article you posted.I got a box from a guy on e bay who pulled his off of a 70 gto.Should be a straight swap for my manual box. I do have a period correct 64 pump and brackets. I will need to scrounge up hoses.I havent even had time to check pump and box for pressure fitting type and size. I spent saturday and sunday putting an engine and transmission in a neighbors truck for him and I worked today. I cant afford to take time off with this economy.Plus i gotta get busy putting a heating system in my house before winter.Might be next year before much of anything gets done.
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Old 07-28-2010, 09:16 AM
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Cobalt327 and latech! Did the Gunk cleaning, and the fluid is not leaving tracks coming from Pitman arm where it goes onto the box.. Still have a drop or two puddling on the end of the steering box where the part number is with the raISED numbers 7806688..
Gonna take a pic of the Firebird and the LeMans steering units..

As an aside Cobalt327, do you have the definitiver part number for the 1969 H-O Qjet?? Have read that the line code has to be RJ with Julian dates in the first four months of '69??

Again will take pics of the offending area and the F'Bird box for your viewing
pleasure..
Thanks for listening Cobalt and latech..
Ted
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Old 07-28-2010, 09:52 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by opelitis5
As an aside Cobalt327, do you have the definitiver part number for the 1969 H-O Qjet??
I sure don't, sorry.
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