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Old 10-23-2010, 05:49 PM
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Which primer over POR 15?

I have read that some primers cause problems over POR 15. I know they have a tie coat for POR but I have read that some primers dont work over that either. What steps have you used to apply paint over POR without any adhesion problems?

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Old 10-24-2010, 08:15 PM
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I just sand the por 15 like primer, then I shoot Urethane Primer, or Spray Can Primer over it. Then I sand the surface, then shoot the base coat/clearcoat on there.

I haven't had any problems yet, and I haven't heard of any... of course I'm sure there may be some though.
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Old 10-24-2010, 08:45 PM
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I read some people haveing trouble with primers lifting because they werent compatible.
I bought there Tie coat because your supposed to have more topcoating options after spraying that.
I think I am going to do a test panel with epoxy primer.
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Old 10-24-2010, 10:50 PM
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Personally, I would stick to real automotive products.

There is a place for Por15 there really is. But if you are going to be mixing it with real automotive primers why not skip it? Where exactly do you plan on using it?

Brian
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Old 10-25-2010, 06:31 PM
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Myself I would use epoxy primer to seal it off and then paint over that
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Old 10-26-2010, 08:22 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by stevenf
I have read that some primers cause problems over POR 15. I know they have a tie coat for POR but I have read that some primers dont work over that either. What steps have you used to apply paint over POR without any adhesion problems?

Not true, "some primers have a problem", any primer does!

Better get a tech sheet, because, I don't care if you sand it with a 24 grit grinder, nothing is going to stick without a tie coat.

Buy a tech sheet!
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Old 10-26-2010, 08:28 AM
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por15 works great................... on my plows and farm trailers. no place for it on a car .
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Old 10-26-2010, 09:13 AM
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Actually POR15 is great for cars... like the undersides with slight surface rust, or between hard to reach body panels. It should never be used as a substitute for primer(entire car), because it's only a rust converter. And no, Etching primer is not a rust converter.

Also, Primer (Any kind) should also never be used in place of Por15 or any part that needs rust converting. This doesn't mean that you should put this stuff over rust that needs to be cut out. It should also not be used on the outside body panels.

The reason everybody uses POR15 is because they don't want rust between body panels or the undersides of their cars in small places. Primer just will not cut it on some of these parts, because only a brush will reach them.
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Old 10-26-2010, 09:16 AM
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yeah , they said the same thing about undercoating 50 years ago. worst idea ever. never put anything on a car that can not be removed and never hide or cover up rust. there is no such thing as rust converting.
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Old 10-26-2010, 09:44 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by shine
yeah , they said the same thing about undercoating 50 years ago. worst idea ever. never put anything on a car that can not be removed and never hide or cover up rust. there is no such thing as rust converting.
I'm not hiding or covering up rust. I'm just putting it in places that primer won't go. What do you suggest putting on the bottoms of cars, or in these tight places?
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Old 10-26-2010, 10:08 AM
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you dont paint over rust. in the paint world that is called building a rust motel. it is better left exposed to dry . slight surface rust can be painted with good epoxy but nothing converts rust. rust holes are created by dirt behind a panel holding moisture , just like por will. then it sets and grows.
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Old 10-26-2010, 12:29 PM
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I chose POR15 for the underside of the Pantera. I chose it for it's tenaciousness and durability. I sandblasted each section at a time brushing on POR15 when I was done.

To accept primer I had to sand it; and it was a lot of work. Once sanded POR15 accepted primer fine but it cost me a huge amount of time.

The bond between POR15 and sandblasted metal is second to none. Rocks that penetrate paint are not likely to penetrate the POR15. The bond between the sandblasted metal and POR15 makes them almost at one with each other. POR15 is both hard but sanding and grinding on it, it becomes soft from the heat. I don't recommend more then one coat. POR15 recommends 2 but then it becomes more like undercoating.

There is no UV protection so it needs to be top coated. Top coating requires a lot of stinkin sanding to prepare it for primer. I also suggest letting it sit for a fairly long time to harden. I am slow so it's no issue with me.

I am glad I played with it, it was a good experiment but having to do it all over again I would not. The work to do it far exceeds the benefits for these type of cars. If I did it again, I would blast and epoxy. I would have saved a tremendous amount of time and work.






This painted section is one full day of sandblasting, cleaning and POR15:








Painted BC/CC flat:



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Old 10-26-2010, 01:30 PM
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Well, with this glaring endorsement, it has not been tested yet. (driven)

You have already done two things wrong, blasted and put over clean metal.
Needs to be rust or seasoned metal (see tech sheet)

See tech sheet on either using an "acid etch" first or a "tie coat" before applying another product.

http://www.por15.com/Data%20Sheets/P...cationInfo.pdf

Your in for a treat, when you get this car on the road as I saw personally a Monte Carol done the same way after 3 weeks of driving in WV.
This will be the test, not setting on a rotisserie.

Let me make it clear, I could care less, if you used it or not, only responding so no one else makes the same mistake and not reading the tech sheet.

By the way, UV's do not bend.
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Old 10-26-2010, 03:25 PM
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i can put epoxy anywhere you can put por15.
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Old 10-26-2010, 04:34 PM
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I did not have time earlier but let me explain the Monte Carlo deal.

I was visiting a PPG jobber friend a few years (3-5) back in WV, this guy comes in want to kill the jobber, he had a late 70 to 80 Monte, not sure year but nothing of real value.
Car had sat in field and he put in engine and they sandblasted the outside of body, he pored it and next day shot K38 over it and painted at home, it was his 4th paint job, looked pretty good.

Well three weeks later paint starts to bubble and he knew it was the PPG primer because the primer was coming off in spots and the por was coming off in spots, so he knew the PPG caused a reaction.

Jobber knew nothing about the por and I said I think you need to use it over rust and I know you need a tie coat.
Long story short, he was not buying and called por from the store, they said, for sand blasted metal, spray with water and let set a week and they said you must use our tie coat for the PPG to stick.

Even he said, why would I blast a car to spray water on it to make it rust.

Funny part, is jobber gave him two 9" 24 grit grinding disc's and said, this is PPG's contribution.

Maybe they changed the stuff but good luck with it.
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