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Old 01-30-2011, 04:10 PM
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questions on boxing in a '32 ford sedan frame!

Hello to everyone,

I am a student at Wyotech in Sacramento,CA. My instructor asked me to do a little research project on boxing in a '32 ford sedan frame. I have to find out what materials (both consumables and raw) would be needed to box in a '32 ford sedan frame (a.k.a. sanding discs/grinding discs/ welding wire ext.). I also have to figure out the cost of these materials and Which metal cutting process should be used and why. The length of the weld that is required. Also needed is an estimate of the hours necessary to complete each step of the project. Any help on this assignment would be greatly appreciated. The assignment is due this Wednesday, Feb 2nd, 2011. I have school Monday thru Friday from 6 A.M. til 4:10 P.M. which makes contacting shops fairly difficult. Thank you for reading this, again any help would be appreciated.
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Old 01-30-2011, 04:37 PM
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Deuce has a wealth of info, here's a link: Deuce

I suggest a search, here on this site, also Google will turn up a host of info. Boxing a frame whether it's a 32 or a 42, is like picking out new underwear, some like this, some like that. It can be simple for function, it can be complex for show purposes. In other words, ask 10 guys here, you will probably get 4 or 5 different opinions. Deuce, Centerline, Cboy enter my mind, any or all of these guys can answer any questions you might have. And I have probably forgot another 20 members that can fill you in.
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Old 01-30-2011, 07:41 PM
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The first thing you'll need is some kind of flat frame table to check the rails to make sure they're straight and not warped or twisted BEFORE you weld any boxing plates in place.



Once you're sure your rails are true you can cut flat sheet to fit the inside frame rail. As you can see in the pic below I used 1/8" sheet cut in three pieces to box each rail. You can cut the sheet with a good band saw, plasma cutter or even a torch, although a torch probably would make extra work finish grinding the cuts before welding.



I used a MIG welder and stitch welded (about 3" segments) both top and bottom of the entire length of the boxing plates so I eventually wound up with a complete weld top and bottom, front to back. The welds were then dressed with a flap wheel grinder. You can see a section in the pic below.



At this point you can set the rails up on the frame table and continue to weld in all the crossmembers and suspension attachment points. What you see in the pic below are my rails set up following the blue prints before any of the crossmembers have been welded in place.



The completed frame with all crossmembers and suspension mounting points welded in place (front suspension is assembled as well).



My boxing plates were designed only to add strength and not for "show". The method I used also is not representative of the only way or even the right way to do this.... just the way I did it.

Good luck.

Centerline
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Last edited by Centerline; 01-30-2011 at 07:49 PM.
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Old 01-31-2011, 06:54 PM
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Call Sacramento Vintage Ford, huge hot rod shop. They could probably answer some of the cost questions.
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Old 01-31-2011, 09:38 PM
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Nice try!

So now you want the board members to do your homework for you?
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Old 02-01-2011, 12:36 AM
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Skill level ... equipment and other factors all pay such a important role ... it is very difficult to estimate what you want to know.









I prefer to use a set of original frame rails. So that also means more time in getting them right and trimming off 70 plus years of age, abuse and most of the time ... not so great modifications. You do need to have a frame table ( JIG ) IMHO.

My frame is so very different than Centerlines ( in the cross members )
He prefers round tubing ... I find square tubing easier to work with and weld
and the rear suspension ... that the time involved could be a day or more in fab work. He has a buggy spring and mine has fabricated coli spring cans with a 4 bar. His front is hairpins, I prefer a 4 bar.



Both have narrowed 9 inch Ford rear ends ...
One is not necessarily better than the other ... it is just our different choices.
Which means different amounts of time to build

The more times you build a 32 frame ... the quicker you can get ... because you have already figured out what you want/need to do.

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Old 02-01-2011, 09:44 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Deuce
My frame is so very different than Centerlines ( in the cross members )
He prefers round tubing ... I find square tubing easier to work with and weld [/B] and the rear suspension ... that the time involved could be a day or more in fab work. He has a buggy spring and mine has fabricated coli spring cans with a 4 bar. His front is hairpins, I prefer a 4 bar.

Both have narrowed 9 inch Ford rear ends ...
One is not necessarily better than the other ... it is just our different choices.
Which means different amounts of time to build

The more times you build a 32 frame ... the quicker you can get ... because you have already figured out what you want/need to do.

Deuce ... Moderator
Randy does nice work! Comes from having a lot of practice.

There are a hundred different ways to build a Deuce chassis. Mine was consciously designed as an early style hot rod with a "built back in the early '60s theme" so that's why I chose the suspension I did. Deuce was building a comfortable cruiser and based on his front 4 bar and triangulated rear suspension system, I can guarantee his will ride a whole lot nicer than mine. He's even put in all that new fangled AC stuff and his transmission actually shifts all by itself.... what's up with that??



Actually what your looking at between Randy's chassis and mine is about 40 years of advancement in Deuce chassis and suspension design. The theme or "plan" of the build will dictate which direction you go and let me say this... don't attempt to build a car without a basic game plan. Nothing will be worse than a car that winds up being "confused". It won't look right, it won't perform right and chances are you won't be happy with it.

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Old 02-01-2011, 02:54 PM
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Thanks to all who responded...

Thank you to everyone who responded to my earlier thread... I am going to call that Ford hot rod place mentioned this afternoon. The only thing I am now having trouble finding happens to be a list of the welding consumables required to box in a 32 Ford sedan frame (and the respective prices pf these consumables.) I also have to estimate the hours necessary to complete each step of the process and document how these hours were calculated. What hourly shop rate I would charge and how much I would pay the technicians working on the vehicle. I'm supposed to create an Estimate sheet as though I really had a customer come into my shop and want this done. I don't know if anyone could offer any further assistance but it would be greatly appreciated.
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Old 02-01-2011, 02:58 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Centerline
Actually what your looking at between Randy's chassis and mine is about 40 years of advancement in Deuce chassis and suspension design.
In other words ... Centerline has a HOT ROD and I only have a street rod





Centerline and I both are friends and 32 Ford buddies. We hang out together at the larger shows we both happen to be at. His Deuce is built to look late 50's early 60's and my two Deuces are for a little later era. Mine have fenders and a more conservative look. HIS screams HOT ROD.

Each style requires a different style frame and components to be true to the era you are working towards.

That also makes a estimate more difficult.

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Old 02-01-2011, 03:18 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Deuce
.....Centerline and I both are friends and 32 Ford buddies. We hang out together at the larger shows we both happen to be at. His Deuce is built to look late 50's early 60's and my two Deuces are for a little later era. Mine have fenders and a more conservative look. HIS screams HOT ROD.

Deuce ... Moderator
That reminds me, Randy .... hope to see you at the Deuces Limited Reunion in September.

Hot Rod = Fast, uncomfortable, noisy, sexy.... not necessarily in that order.
Street Rod = Fast, modern, quiet, and built for the comfort of Curmudgeons.

Around town I'd drive mine because comfort is not a big concern, but out on the road for a few hours.... I'll ride with Randy.




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Old 02-01-2011, 03:22 PM
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Thanks again

Deuce... thanks again for your help. I just need an estimate for boxing in the frame... not creating a finished project. I understand there are different ways of doing this...thank you for pointing that out though. I believe if I stick with one way it would be fine... just asks me:

1.) Metal cutting process to be used on project and reason for choosing that cutting process?

2.) Total length of weld required.

3.)Itemized list of raw materials (metal) required including vendor name and price.

4.)Itemized list of welding consumables required including vendor name and price estimate; document how consumables were calculated.

5.)Itemized list of non-welding consumables including vendor name and price estimate; document how hours were calculated.

6.) Estimate hours necessary to complete each step of the project, document how hours were calculated.

7.)What hourly shop rate will you charge and why?

8.)What hourly wage will your technicians receive and why?

I have pretty much figured out what I would like to answer for steps 1-3... I am now trying to figure out 4-8. It's a bit difficult when I've never actually done something like this before to figure it out! Thank you for helping though.
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Old 02-01-2011, 04:40 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Centerline
That reminds me, Randy .... hope to see you at the Deuces Limited Reunion in September.
I booked the room at the Host Motel about two weeks ago
They said they only had a few rooms left.

Really looking forward to it ... should a REAL BLAST
All those D E U C E S
in one place.

Now I just have to decide which one to drive ... the roadster or the 3W ??
It is almost 1200 miles one way from here so the 3W is the better choice but I do LOVE driving that roadster.
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Last edited by Deuce; 02-01-2011 at 04:51 PM.
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Old 02-01-2011, 04:48 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Hockeylovinfool

4.)Itemized list of welding consumables required including vendor name and price estimate; document how consumables were calculated.

5.)Itemized list of non-welding consumables including vendor name and price estimate; document how hours were calculated.

6.) Estimate hours necessary to complete each step of the project, document how hours were calculated.

7.)What hourly shop rate will you charge and why?

8.)What hourly wage will your technicians receive and why?

I have pretty much figured out what I would like to answer for steps 1-3... I am now trying to figure out 4-8. It's a bit difficult when I've never actually done something like this before to figure it out! Thank you for helping though.
my #4 and #5 will not help you ... as I am in the South ...

6 ) it takes me about 20 hours ( but I am 62 years old and not as quick, dedicated and determined as I was years ago )

7 ) I am a HOBBYIST ... so no help but most shops here in my area are 75/85 dollars a hour.

8 ) Most of the workers get HALF ... of the shop rate.
That's because they can make that or more on welding fab jobs for bridge builders and steel erectors.
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Old 02-01-2011, 08:00 PM
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Well this is funny... DAMN funny. Anyways. Dude if you need answers you shouldve gone to Jesus. I did and Jesus gave me these links.


http://www.onlinemetals.com/merchant...ep=2&top_cat=1

http://wescottsauto.com/Body/bodylib...1932Bodies.pdf

http://store.cyberweld.com/

http://autoweldchassis.com/dimension.ivnu


Also go to Air gas with what materials you need and they will print you an estimate. Peter will be pleased. Oh and on a personal note I would go with plasma personally. Not only do I like plasma, but it makes the cuts more uniformed when done properly.
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Old 02-01-2011, 08:34 PM
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Oh & to all I am not having the board members do my homework for me. We're supposed to do a research project in which we ask around to find the answers. It's an extra credit assisgnment thank you very much. I have been on many sites, contacted many shops and spoken to many people....

Deuce...

Thank you for all of your help thus far. Your answers to 3, 4 and 5 would be greatly appreciated. In the assignment I have to state where I got the information from anyhow. Having your real name and city/ state information might be helpful for the assigment as well! Or I guess I could just say I received the information from 'Deuce' on the hotrodders.com forum!

Thanks!
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