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Old 07-20-2010, 09:57 PM
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radiant floor heat

I got my garage floor poured today . I tore out the old concrete and removed 28 cubic yards of sandy clay soil and dumped in 3/4 minus driveway crush and tamped it with a 1000lb. plate tamper.I put down 3" styro and 1/2" rebar on 16"centers. I hired a cement finishing company because I can,t get concrete flat in a frying pan. Finally I,ve got my garage back.
Now I will get a 40 gallon electric hot water tank and my plumbers will hook up the expansion tank and pump and we will see how this baby works Whooohoooo!
Clint

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Old 07-21-2010, 03:20 AM
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Did you figure a way to determine how much the elec. will cost you to heat the wtr and pump it during the winter?? or is it a ...I don't give a chit as long as I'm semi-warm laying on that floor....
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Old 07-21-2010, 07:01 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by price
I got my garage floor poured today . I tore out the old concrete and removed 28 cubic yards of sandy clay soil and dumped in 3/4 minus driveway crush and tamped it with a 1000lb. plate tamper.I put down 3" styro and 1/2" rebar on 16"centers. I hired a cement finishing company because I can,t get concrete flat in a frying pan. Finally I,ve got my garage back.
Now I will get a 40 gallon electric hot water tank and my plumbers will hook up the expansion tank and pump and we will see how this baby works Whooohoooo!
Clint
I'm going to follow this one real close cause I know lots who own em. And their like Alexander Keith Beer. "Those who like it like it a lot"

about half of them are in love with it and the other half say you can burn half the tar sands and still not be warm
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Old 07-21-2010, 11:36 AM
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radiant floor heat

Nowadays we rarely see -20 f. and I am hoping that if is real cold I can run the wood stove to top up the btu,s. The real issue is not getting the money back at the sale of the house or some such nonsense, it is being comfortable working on the project in the winter and burning the tires off it in the summer LOL
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Old 07-25-2010, 07:33 PM
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instead of a water heater get a insant hot water heater

used it at my old house and it work like a furnace faster responc and last longer on a closed system
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Old 07-25-2010, 07:37 PM
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Yeah I agree. An on demand water heater would be more efficient. It wouldnt have to heat the 40+ gallons to get warm,just what the loop and expansion tank requires. ( maybe 20 gallons)
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Old 07-25-2010, 07:47 PM
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water heater

thank g there is a home depot every where a good water heater is going to run about 500 -insta hat a cheap one and the core is stainless steel so a few dollars more but peace of mind and you can tap into the controls and use it progressevly the colder out side the hotter the water
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Old 07-25-2010, 07:54 PM
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water heater

they make a eltronic mixing valve that monitors outside temp soor about my spelling on the previos post
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Old 08-06-2010, 07:18 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by price
I got my garage floor poured today . I tore out the old concrete and removed 28 cubic yards of sandy clay soil and dumped in 3/4 minus driveway crush and tamped it with a 1000lb. plate tamper.I put down 3" styro and 1/2" rebar on 16"centers. I hired a cement finishing company because I can,t get concrete flat in a frying pan. Finally I,ve got my garage back.
Now I will get a 40 gallon electric hot water tank and my plumbers will hook up the expansion tank and pump and we will see how this baby works Whooohoooo!
Clint
Hi Clint,

I live down the road in Kelowna and poured a 2000 sq.' floor 3 weeks ago. I too installed the styro, rebar etc along with what seemed like 10 miles of tubing. I split the system in to 2 zones, one for the part of my garage where I will park my cars and the other for the 'shop' area.

One thing my plumber friend did before the pour was to lay about 6' of tubing (closed off at the end in the concrete) for an "in floor thermostat' in each zone. The open end is close to where the radiant heat tube manifolds are located. He did this so there will be an accurate temperature maintained in the floor instead of air temp. Sounded logical at the time. Another thing he said was to go the instant hot water route, thereby saving $$$$$$. There are some very good units on the market vastly improved recently.

I haven't decided on the unit I am going to install but will rely on the 'professionals' to guide me in the right direction. Let us know how you make out....congrats on your new garage.

ZAPPER
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Old 08-07-2010, 08:58 AM
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I am on my second circulating hot water heated floor. The first was mid 80s technology using solar panels and a tiny Paloma back-up heater. The present one is state of the art using a larger flow demand heater (propane fuel). I will be adding solar panels with a 60 gal reservoir. The solar panels will use a closed system that flows anti freeze through a heat exchanger coil inside the 60 gal tank. The water inside the tank is the water that circulates through the floor and is an "open" system in that it supplies the hot water for the sinks in the shop. The present large flow demand heater will become the back up since it will only come on when the water temp falls below 115*F. The shop is 2400 sq ft and I keep the thermostat on 50 which is comfortable to work in your shirt sleeves and my feet never get cold. When the solar panels are installed, I may kick it up to 55*. By the way, the first system was for my home which included a 26X26 garage and a 26X30 garage/work shop. The house had 3000 sq ft of living space plus a basement, all with circulating hot water heat. My heating bill was $45 per month, the minimum natural gas bill.

Trees
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Old 08-08-2010, 11:19 AM
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Being in the HVAC controls business I thought I may add a word or two on this one. Around here temps in the winter can drop below -40 we pay close attention to in slab heating control applications. There are two types of control systems one being DDC (direct digital control) the other is packaged electronic stuff that is far more common. Packaged controls,,, Usually the systems with multiple zones will have a set of common tubing manifolds with as many as 10 zones, the glycol mixed water manifolds on the return side coming from the slab have low voltage 2 position (open/closed) control valves with end switches. The local zone air temp thermostat will operate an associated control valve on the manifold. On a call for heat from any of the zone stats, the control valve opens, the end switch makes and sends a heat demand to the heating device be it a boiler, hot water heater what ever. Any of the end switches can make this happen. Each zone has its own pump referred to as secondary pumps, a relay activated by the same end switch starts the zone pump. Now on the supply side for each zone there is a 3 way mixing control valve (2 inlets 1 outlet) with a low voltage self contained temperature reset control pack. Two sensors wire from the control pack actuator terminal block, one to the outdoor air and the other to the supply side pipe feeding the zone. Hot water (above 50 Deg C) from the heat source is mixed through the 3 way valve with cool water coming form the slab. The 3 way valve works on an outdoor air reset schedule, as the outdoor air temp drops, the setpoint on the supply water sensor is increased and the actuator moves the internal plug inside the valve to take more hot water and less cold slab water, as the out door air temp increases the setpoint decreases. So every time the zone calls for heat the water temp to the zone is effected by how cold it is outdoors. The reason for this mixing is that it allows you to keep the hot side hot and the slab side at a maximum of 45-50 deg C. The in slab sensor as mentioned before by zapper should only be used as a low limit for that zone, it will open the 2 way valve as well but along with this you need an air temp zone stat for each zone, the slab sensor is considered an option, the air stat is not an option. Once that slab gets warm it will stay that way for hours even days in some cases were as the air temp will change in seconds and you need to respond to it ,this is especially true on small zones. Large zones with lots of mass tend to be more stable and control strategies are not effected by changes in ambient air temp as much. Now the hot side,,,Some of these systems are used for hot water tanks and heating coils in air handling units. The water temps from the boiler or heating appliance needs to be above 50 deg C and can reach 85 Deg C. This is way too hot to put through a slab thus the mixing valves mentioned before. Another set of pumps are the primary ones, they send water through the heat source and are started each time there is a call for heat either from the zone stat/valve or the local boiler controller. The boiler controller may also have an outdoor air reset but for the most part it is set to provide the hot side at 60-70 Deg C, a call from the the hot water tank or the air handling unit will step up this setpoint to 85 Deg C. We installed a nice system like this last year at a friends acreage with 2 natural gas 100K btu condensing boilers, he heats his 1400sq/ft house with a small air handling unit with hot water coil (no burner) ,50 gallon hot water tank for the house, 800 sq/ft attached garage slab, right outside is his small shop/office with attached triple garage another 1300 sq/ft of slab, then there is the big shop at 3500 sq/ft of slab. Most days one boiler will carry the load. There are many different types of slab heat applications and control systems designed to match. I think it is the best way to heat a shop and/or house. Combine this with some solar panels be they water or electric, add some wind power with battery storage maybe. On small farms and acreages around here wood burning boilers are making a come back, central units sitting in the yard with flex pipping up to the dwellings. Made for wood but guys are burning just about anything in them
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Old 08-11-2010, 08:39 AM
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Originally Posted by Custom10
On small farms and acreages around here wood burning boilers are making a come back, central units sitting in the yard with flex pipping up to the dwellings. Made for wood but guys are burning just about anything in them
I plan on putting in a wood burner in the next 1-2 years. With the rising cost of energy, largely due to political reasons it's ironic that we are resorting to burning wood again!
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Old 08-12-2010, 06:39 AM
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wood stove

good thaught take a look on u tube for the the heater the man made with soda cans its good i have wind turbine and solar pannels i want to make this soda heater for the garage made a solar hot water heater for heating water for the garage still not getting it right tie the wood burnig stove into the floor heater with a mixing valve and some copper pipes u tube is great for helping to save energy
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