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Old 09-17-2001, 12:36 PM
Dan Dan is offline
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Unhappy rebuilt 327 smokes - what to do

I have a rebuilt 327 that a local guy did. Sounded like he knew what he was doing. I've had it for a couple years and am just now running it. I pre-oiled before I started it. I let it run for about an hour while adjusting timing and checking things out. It smokes a lot. It acts to me like the rings aren't seating but the compression is running about 155 on all of the cylinders. The plugs are very oily. Is this normal? Should I keep running it to see if the rings eventually seat?? Any help would be arrpreciated.
Dan

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Old 09-17-2001, 12:47 PM
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Whoops Meant appreciated. Dan
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Old 09-18-2001, 10:38 AM
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Hi, Sounds to me like the oil ring spreader or spreaders were incorrectly installed. They must butt together, sometimes when putting the piston back into the cylinder the spreader slips and overlaps.If thats the case, the oil ring or rings are not being pushed out against the cylinder walls. Thats one scenario. How about the heads? Were they reconditioned too? Email me with all the details on what was done to your 327. I will try to help out with the info you provide.
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Old 09-18-2001, 11:48 AM
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As to the Guy with the rebuilt 327 engine your going to have smoke from this engine regardless of what you do this is a known thing with the older 327 engine's they all smoke,and use oil about one quart to three thousand miles.null
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Old 09-18-2001, 12:29 PM
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You may have already determined what shape your valve stem seals are in. If they leak, you might have an easy answer to your oil burning question.

I'm going to ask for correction but I think I'm right in thinking that between the rings and the valve stem seals, if your oil burn is present in a big way right at start up, it is likely that the valve stem seals are not doing their job (oil sitting on top of pistons). The other test is to shoot some heavy oil in each cylinder (via spark plug hole) and see if compression improves. Compare results between cylinders. If a big improvement is seen on one cylinder over the others, you probably found the cylinder with the problem. I say cylinder, because unless you measured the bore after the machine work was done, you might be the lucky recipient of a bad machine bore and honing - rings are fine, but the bore is too big, or not round (perhaps machine shop couldn't bore enough to make round again!)

Just some thoughts.
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Old 09-18-2001, 12:30 PM
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Have you checked the valve guide seals and/or the valve stems themselves? Were the valve stems knurled when the heads were done? (I assume the heads WERE done...). That would be where I'd start first
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Old 09-18-2001, 01:51 PM
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Quote:
Originally posted by Dan id you go over the heads? You may have bad valve stem seals. Change the plugs and let it set overnite. Before you fire it up next morning pull the plugs and look for traces of oil. If you find oil you have bad valve stem seals. Just makes the engine smoke and fowls the plugs, you can still run this for a while, keeping ahead of the fowled out plugs.
<STRONG>I have a rebuilt 327 that a local guy did. Sounded like he knew what he was doing. I've had it for a couple years and am just now running it. I pre-oiled before I started it. I let it run for about an hour while adjusting timing and checking things out. It smokes a lot. It acts to me like the rings aren't seating but the compression is running about 155 on all of the cylinders. The plugs are very oily. Is this normal? Should I keep running it to see if the rings eventually seat?? Any help would be arrpreciated.
Dan </STRONG>
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Old 09-18-2001, 08:11 PM
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:confused an I'm not really sure what I can tell you about you smoker that anybody else has already mentioned. Sounds like seals to me too, but might be the oil rings too. Just a comment about the guy who said all 327s'smoke.........NOT! I have a 350 horse, stock, in my '70 chevy 1\2 ton in front of a 4 speed, and it has (known) 250k miles plus and still runs great and still no smoke. Yes it does leak a little, but no smoke. I have had 2 in other Novas and they did'nt either.
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Old 09-19-2001, 12:34 PM
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Thanks for all the comments on this 327. I ran another compression check this morning, cold with throttle wide open. Six of the cylinders were between 154 and 158 which I figured was great. I put oil in two of those and one raised 3 pounds and one by 10 to 168. I guess that's not too bad. But the spark plugs in these cylinders were oily like the others. Doesn't sound like rings to me but maybe valve guides or seals or maybe just not hot enough plugs? I think the valves, guides and springs were all new at the time of the rebuild.
Number 5 cylinder ranged from 155 to 170 with an average of 164 and number 7 ranged from 128 to 139 with an average of 138. No. 7 went to 156 after I added some oil to it. I guess that does sound like rings? I'm not sure if they would seat if I keep running it or I would do damage. Maybe I did the damage by letting it sit in my garage for 2 years. I have no idea why no. 5 is so high. Thanks for any more insight you may have. Maybe tonight I'll call the guy that did the rebuild - see if he remembers the engine and what all he did to it.
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Old 09-19-2001, 03:28 PM
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a silly question maybe but what colour is the smoke ? I bought a smoky rebuilt 289 and discovered that the vacumn modulator on the auto was letting trans fluid through and that was causeing the smoke
something to check anyway
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Old 09-21-2001, 06:41 PM
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First off a 327 is no diff than a 350 or a 235 6cyl.If its smokes you have BIG problems.A little blue smoke in the mornin maybe valve seals.Smoke all the time forget it.We run some race motors with NO valve seals (no smoke).Comp tests are just not worth the effort any more ,i can get a motor to read what ever i want with a little gas or some oil.You need to do a leak down test,it shows leakage by the rings(air coming through the breathers or dip stick)a bad intake will leak through the carb,a bad exh valve will leak through the exh system.If its smokin, bite the bullet and pull the motor.Hey a brand new 350 with a 3 year warranty is only 12-13 hundred and you done !!! trouble free. I see most rebuilds more than that.If you want a race motor than i would spend the bucks on a new crate. Its a costly lesson we have all learned at one time or another. Of coarse you you could have Ed build you a killer 417 and all your troubles would be gone There is NO easy fix.Just for info ,i have a brand new 1965 327 365hp vette motor that has been stored in 1966 started it 1 month ago and it runs and burns NO oil.sooooo....i would think something is pretty wrong.zNo bandaids sorryy. Phat
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Old 09-21-2001, 08:14 PM
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Let me jump back in. Interesting topic. I've had a couple of 327s - one in a '55 Chevy and one in a '63 vette. I rebuilt both, the first with lots of help long time ago and the other just recently.

If the heads are old style, the valve stem seals a like rubberbands in size. You might need to machine to have new seals fit.

Without measurements you really don't know what you've got. Valve stem clearance could be too great. Oil ring gaps wrong and/or in wrong position. Bad bore. Out-of-round hole(s).

Crankcase ventilation problems? Rings not seated yet - just one hour of break in?

I guess the big question is - does it hurt to drive it? Well, if you're not worried about an "original" block in your car, then you don't have that much to lose. There are blocks everywhere to buy. I really like the 350 idea for a lower budget replacement. Sky's the limit. So, I'd say drive the car. If it is just rings not seated yet, then that will clear up. If the engine builder put the rings in wrong and too much oil is "hanging around", then it's just oil and your pride!

If you can do your own work, pull the motor and go back through it. Let a machinist mic all cylinders and evaluate the heads. (A step approach would be to pull the heads and leave the motor in the car. Have heads evaluated. If valve guide or seals problem, fix and put heads back on!) If heads look good, then mic bores while motor is still in the car. You might find out-of-round condition. If so, maybe now is the time to buy that block...)

What does everyone else think?
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Old 10-10-2001, 06:00 AM
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drain the oil and put in some non detergent straight 30 or 40 weight start the engine run it up to 3000 rpm and let it run there for about 45 miniuts and see if the rings will seat(I am assuming this is the first time your running it after the rebuild) if it doesen't stop smoking check the valve seals
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Old 10-24-2002, 01:44 AM
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[quote]Originally posted by Dan:
<strong>I have a rebuilt 327 that a local guy did. Sounded like he knew what he was doing. I've had it for a couple years and am just now running it. I pre-oiled before I started it. I let it run for about an hour while adjusting timing and checking things out. It smokes a lot. It acts to me like the rings aren't seating but the compression is running about 155 on all of the cylinders. The plugs are very oily. Is this normal? Should I keep running it to see if the rings eventually seat?? Any help would be arrpreciated.
Dan </strong><hr></blockquote>
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Old 10-24-2002, 01:50 AM
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[quote]Originally posted by StillPlaysWithCars:
<strong>You may have already determined what shape your valve stem seals are in. If they leak, you might have an easy answer to your oil burning question.

I'm going to ask for correction but I think I'm right in thinking that between the rings and the valve stem seals, if your oil burn is present in a big way right at start up, it is likely that the valve stem seals are not doing their job (oil sitting on top of pistons). The other test is to shoot some heavy oil in each cylinder (via spark plug hole) and see if compression improves. Compare results between cylinders. If a big improvement is seen on one cylinder over the others, you probably found the cylinder with the problem. I say cylinder, because unless you measured the bore after the machine work was done, you might be the lucky recipient of a bad machine bore and honing - rings are fine, but the bore is too big, or not round (perhaps machine shop couldn't bore enough to make round again!)

Just some thoughts.</strong><hr></blockquote>
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