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Old 03-14-2008, 08:39 AM
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Remote reservoir positioning ?

A search turned up only one vague reference to my question and I think I already know the answer but just want to make sure. If installing a remote fill on a clutch master, does the reservoir always have to be higher than the master to gravity feed?

After fabricating my clutch master mount and then looking at it every day for the last couple of months, I'm unhappy with the reservoir sticking up above the front edge of the cowl - as you can see on the right in the pic below. Worst case I can rebuild the mount to lower the master a couple inches, but I was hoping for a somewhat easier alternative. Also, that solution changes the "throw" on the pedal/plunger somewhat and I don't know the repercussions of doing that.



Here's a shot from the other side of the firewall. Anybody got a bright idea how to eliminate that reservoir without lowering the entire master?


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Old 03-14-2008, 09:00 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by cboy
does the reservoir always have to be higher than the master to gravity feed?
Because the remote reservoir is gravity fed; it must be above the master.

If the reservoir is removeable, you might be able to mount it under the dash and above the clutch master connecting it with tubing.

Have you considered lowering the clutch master on the firewall and just changing the linkage from the pedal? This way you would not have to change the pedal location.
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Old 03-14-2008, 09:17 AM
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You shouda put up a better pic of the res. Can it be cut down some how? They sure don't need much fluid capacity.

One complicated solution is to lower that master. Then build a reducing bellcrank. GM used one on power brake-only pickups(67-72). It is a vertical pivoting lever with a pivot at one end, a push-point in the middle, and a push-point at the other end.

Then you build this lever & pivot, then calulate how much lower to move the existing pivot hole in you clutch pedal. I can try to get a pic if you can't figure out what I mean

If you design the points correctly, the push length will be exactly what it is now, only the master can be mounted lower.
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Old 03-14-2008, 10:12 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by cboy
Anybody got a bright idea how to eliminate that reservoir without lowering the entire master?
Hark back to the days of yore: "Longer, lower, wider!"
Put those fabricating skillz you've demonstrated to work and make a reservoir that carries the same (or more) volume without the height. As I understand it, you don't need a head of pressure (height), you only need sufficient volume to keep all lines filled plus the master plus some safety margin.

You might also look around the boneyard for brake fluid reservoirs that are lower but either longer or wider.
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Old 03-14-2008, 10:19 AM
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something like what F&J said - but stealthy!

A VERY rude sketch

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Old 03-14-2008, 10:24 AM
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Tilton and Wilwood and Coleman machine all make master cylinders that have interchangeble reservoirs that are shorter than the one you have on your firewall. There are remote reservoirs available for those as well.

Like F&J said, you don't need much fluid.

Here is a pic of a setup I'm working on right now, a 65 mustang with hydroboost and hydraulic clutch. I'll take some better pics of the available adapters and stuff that came with the MC kit so you can get an idea..

Just out of curiosity, how does that clutch setup feel as you have it installed? It looks like it might be stiff.

Later, mikey
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Old 03-14-2008, 11:17 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by grouch
... make a reservoir that carries the same (or more) volume without the height.
Hmmmm, gotta go do some measuring.
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Old 03-14-2008, 11:19 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by powerrodsmike
Just out of curiosity, how does that clutch setup feel as you have it installed? It looks like it might be stiff.
Hard to describe. I think it feels fine but then clutch operation is much better diagnosed after about 100 hours of shift gears.
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Old 03-14-2008, 12:41 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by cboy
Hmmmm, gotta go do some measuring.
Just in case you don't want to go to a boneyard...

Wilwood 260-8742 at Summit Racing, 10.7 oz. remote reservoir kit.

Small one (4 oz.) is Wilwood 260-7577.
Wilwood master cylinders

I think I remember a Honda mini-van from the '90s that had a short, boxy remote reservoir mounted up front under the ridiculous hood, with one hose going back to the master cylinder.
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Old 03-14-2008, 01:19 PM
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RE:Remote reservoir positioning?

Hi Try a 91 or so s-10 Remote Reservoir its only 2 1/2 inches tall by 2 inches deep by 2 1/2 inches long works for a t-10 but all the linkage is s-10, just a thought! Yours looks much taller! TROY
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Old 03-14-2008, 01:33 PM
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I'm stumped just trying to remove the reservoir. It doesn't screw off the base of the master because there's a little plastic peg (at the arrow and a little difficult to see in this pic) that fits into a hole in the master so that the reservoir can not be turned left or right. I can't imagine it's just a friction fit but I did try just a bit of pressure on it to see if it would simply pull straight out...but no luck. The other problem is that if it IS some sort of friction fit, I doubt I could make something that would fit it properly. BTW, just to the right of that little peg is a rubberized washer that is between the res. and the master. I can poke it and it flexes. For whatever that might be worth.

Is there a secret to getting this apart...or is it made so us hot rodders can't tamper with it. I could probably cut that tab...but maybe end up creating some other disaster. Looks like lowering the whole unit is rapidly becoming the most viable option.

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Old 03-14-2008, 04:42 PM
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The options got narrowed down pretty quickly and I ended up moving the master about 2 1/4" down on the firewall after rebuilding the mounting plate and then fabricating a new linkage. Time will tell if the "throw" and pedal ratio are going to be correct and/or comfortable. I may be getting back in there to make more alterations as I see how well it works.

Thanks for the ideas. Always helps to bounce these things off 6 or 8 folks who know what they are doing.

(I'm still wondering how that reservoir comes apart - so feel free to continue the thread if you've got the answer, or even a good guess. It's a matter of satisfying my curiosity now.)
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Old 03-14-2008, 04:50 PM
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That peg on the res is only there so you can unscrew the cap...or tighten it.


IF that rubber grommet was new & flexible, you could pry the res up and pop it out. I'll bet there is a slight bead at the end of the part that fits into the grommet. Some furrin' cars have master cyl remote fittings just like that. Old vw for example. They are tough to get out if the rubber is old & stiff.
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Old 03-14-2008, 05:03 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by F&J
...IF that rubber grommet was new & flexible, you could pry the res up and pop it out.
Thanks F&J, now I'll be able to sleep tonight.
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Old 03-15-2008, 12:18 PM
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cboy

Is it possible to move the reservoir over to the center of your firewall to still be above enough to get the proper setting. this may not work another option is to head to the wrecking yards and find a better size that would fit.
NOTE: Not trying to make this a RICCCCCCER
But honda and toyota both have a shorter , larger reservoir that might work.

30dee
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