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Old 11-03-2008, 09:40 PM
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rewiring help

I am rewiring my 67 ford truck. I have just purchased a 460 crate motor from ford. It came with a MSD ignition system. I purchased a wiring system from ron francis and have just struggled with the wiring of the NSS and the starter/solenoid. Being a ford I guess I needed a starter solenoid. This is the first wiring I have done. They sell alot of these wiring kits, does everyone have problems? Is there more to this than they say. Painless,Francis, ect. all say how easy it is. Does anyone have a idea of what I might do to solve these problems. I have been thinking of calling someone in the business to come in and finish/fix this for me. I was hoping to learn more about the wiring. How have some of you completed this job.

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Old 11-04-2008, 08:30 AM
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What exactly are you having difficulty with? Excuse my ignorance but whats NSS? Painless has helped me out of more than one jam with their excellent customer service. Give us a little clearer idea of what your question is so we can help you better.
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Old 11-04-2008, 09:07 AM
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NSS=neutral safety switch

the ign key start circuit is just a contacts series circuit,,,

key in start position=switch on,,, and tranny in park or neutral only=switch on,,,then power can get to the solonoid relay "S" terminal which closes the batt to starter motor cable contacts "switch" inside the solonoid to be "on" so the starter does crank....

without a NSS the starter will engage in any gear at any speed if you accidently turned the switch to start position...
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Old 11-04-2008, 09:08 AM
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I am have a problem trying to incorporate a starter solenoid into the system with a Neutral Safety Switch (NSS) and Ron Francis wiring kit. The wiring diagrams are not helping me and I am at a loss. I am not sure how many wires go to the starter. The Ron Francis kit I am using was fine up intell I got to the Bag BF Starter/Distributor. I have a MSD ignition (Electronic) and nothing matches. Wire colors do not correspond with the instuctions. The diagrams I have got on this site makes it sound so easy. When I go out to put that to use; my brain stops working.

Now that I have read the survey on wiring kit approvals; I would buy a painless next.

Just trying to learn
Kirk
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Old 11-04-2008, 09:30 AM
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I just talked to tech at Ron Francis. The purple wire marked starter > #3; I ran from the terninal #3 on thefuse panel to the starter. That is marked wrong. It should say #3 > Starter Solenoid. I hooked it to the starter. WRONG. The orange wire says coil > starter. This wire is not used in my application with a MSD ignition The other orange and white wire with the module connection is also not used This might get me one step forward. I still want to hear from everyone elses experience. It will help me and others. I will keep you all posted as I move on.

Kirk
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Old 11-04-2008, 10:10 AM
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often helps just to see diagrams done differently.....

67' truck is almost exactly the same as a 65-67 mustang....

here's a link to the original Ford diagrams that show the circuit(s) and color codes and actual devices....
(I'd use the 65 or 66 starting and charging diagrams for reference)

http://www.hammar.dyndns.org/~djhamma/wiring.htm

you can wire the start circuit thru a "batt direct" fuse (like the interior lights circuit) in the car.....
makes a nifty anti-theft deterent, pull the fuse and the motor won't crank....
most fuse panels are wired for both batt direct fuse locations and "only when the key is in the on position" circuits like a heater blower....

not real smart but notice in the stang diagrams there is no fuse protection on the primary batt feed into the car (#37), ign switch is wired direct to the batt connect at the solonoid stud.....
it was done due to the points ign,,,

edit add: the how to MSD instructions and diagrams are on their web site....

Last edited by red65mustang; 11-04-2008 at 10:29 AM.
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Old 11-04-2008, 10:33 AM
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REPLY on RON FRANCIS WIRING

Hi,
I'm Ron Francis from Ron Francis wiring. I am sorry you are having difficulty wiring your Mustang. First I must say that our tech departement is available to answer any questions you have and WILL solve any problems you have. We'd appreicate you asking us before going out on the web looking for help when we encourage you to ask us first. Our 800-***-**** number answers your questions from the people who designed it. All we need is the serial number on the side of your fuse panel to answer your questions correctly.

Second PLEASE do compare other diagrams from ANY other source when you wire our kits. There are many correct ways to wire the same components. EVERY system is or can be done differently. The printing on the wires should be your source of direction. This is because we sometimes take a wire thru the fuse panel or other component for ease of installation and troubleshooting. This can change what you might see drawn up somewhere else. That does not mean either way is wrong. Please just do it our way with our products. Doing it the way Ford does it is not always the best or easiest when it comes to an after market harness. Notice how our instrcutions are only a few pages.
BTW, Purchasing another brand of wiring that has 42 page books for instructions might not be the best solution. Our tech help is available during the day and now you have my email which is also shown on our home page at www.**********.com

Last edited by Jon; 11-04-2008 at 05:38 PM. Reason: Advertising. Please see: commercial posting guidelines.
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Old 11-04-2008, 10:33 AM
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Thank you very much for your reply. I have looked at the diagram and I think it will help me to get the wires going in the right direction.

Thanks again
Kirk
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Old 11-04-2008, 10:37 AM
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You're welcome, anytime, I am awake
Ron
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Old 11-04-2008, 11:57 AM
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Ron, as a Moderator here, I'd like to welcome you to Hotrodders.com.

We can always use knowledgable help here in the electrical forum

Please read our guidelines for posting, we don't allow business contact information in posts.

Check it out here..

http://www.hotrodders.com/help/board/business.html

You can edit your own post using the "edit" button at the bottom of your post.

Later, Mikey
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Old 11-04-2008, 12:52 PM
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Kirk,
I do want to agree with and re-emphasize what Ron Francis posted....

there are several/many basic EASY TO SEE signifigant design faults in the oem harness link design/layout....

to the point that all you can say is: "what the hell were they thinking,,,we're they all stoned on acid or something!!!!!"

so do use the stang link diagrams just for "what was", not for "what it should be!!"

I enjoy doing it all from scratch myself....
(the old cars are so straight forward and simple)
My 65' fastback is totally rewired and the diagram looks almost nothing like those oem link diagrams circuits....
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Old 11-04-2008, 01:26 PM
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Yes That is what I am trying to do. With your guys help, it allows guys like me to do this ourselfs. Without this forum and others like it, we could not meet guy that love this hobbie like we do. I am so happy to be part of this forum and the car world.

Kirk
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Old 11-05-2008, 08:39 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Ron Francis
BTW, Purchasing another brand of wiring that has 42 page books for instructions might not be the best solution. Our tech help is available during the day and now you have my email which is also shown on our home page at www.**********.com
Why is a 42 page install manual an issue?? I noticed Painless has their manuals available online. Kinda nice if you need a point of reference after hours, even if it isn't one of their harness'.
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Old 11-05-2008, 09:33 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by fitzwell
Why is a 42 page install manual an issue?? I noticed Painless has their manuals available online. Kinda nice if you need a point of reference after hours, even if it isn't one of their harness'.
I keep a few of the Painless manuals around from past projects, they have schematics that I've found are helpful for other projects.

Later, mikey
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Old 11-05-2008, 05:48 PM
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Ron, and Others

First i'd like to take a moment and just say how much I love your Ron Frances wiring kits. I am a electrician by trade, and work mainly in the heavy commercial, industrial end and I'm very comfortable with motor control circuits and logic/Programmer circuits. I purchased a Bare Bones wiring kit for my Ford, a 1933 Ford Tudor sedan that I'll be dropping a Modern 4.6L Ford DOHC SC engine into. Besides the 130 wires needed for the engine, it has an additional 79 wires to run the N2O, Data acq system, Water Injection and so on. The Ron Frances wiring kit I bought, is really nice, yes I could have just started from scratch and wired the thing, but I had no way to access the many marked/labeled wires, that I think adds to the value of any Hot Rod restoration. Besides making my job much easier, it also increases the value of the car (this is of-coarse in my opinion), as all the wiring is clearly marked for anyone to follow, which I think makes the ideal of buying someone else's work much easier to phantom. Besides that, I found it very nice to just kick back and enjoy the time I spent wiring the car. Of-coarse I'm not finished, and like any other build, you do a little here then some there, and your kits make the task of wiring a project so much easier. Gone is the worry of marking the wires, making charts and wiring diagrams, with the wires already labeled, you have nothing to worry about. That is one reason I purchased as many additional wiring groups as your store sold, groups like courtesy lights, heater, power antenna and so on, make the job wonderful to work on, and I'm sure if I do decide to sell the car, well help the new owner out as well.
I no wiring is a very stressful task for some, but I just wanted everyone to know that these kits with there labeled wiring and additional groups can be very helpful.
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