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-   -   SBC - Which Head Bolts enter the Water Jacket? (http://www.hotrodders.com/forum/sbc-head-bolts-enter-water-jacket-185817.html)

kbuhagiar 10-10-2010 08:39 PM

SBC - Which Head Bolts enter the Water Jacket?
 
Hello Folks,

On the small block chevy engine, which of the seventeen head bolts enter the water jacket (and thus need to be sealed)?

Thanks in advance. :thumbup:

BOBCRMAN@aol.com 10-10-2010 08:48 PM

ALL of them

Caballerokid 10-11-2010 01:57 AM

I just put my 360 together and I sealed all of the head bolts on each side of the engine. I used the teflon paste... I like that the best. :mwink:

mud.man.rj 10-11-2010 02:38 AM

head bolt info
 
Seal them all that way your torque specs will also be the same on all the bolts, plus they won't rust in the block.

65smallblock 10-11-2010 09:34 AM

Ditto, just seal them all. I like permatex high tack for that job..

adantessr 10-11-2010 10:43 AM

Clean them all with a wire wheel and run a thread chaser or brass rifle bore brush through the threads in the block and seal them all with Permatex #2 . Tried and proven sealer for this application .

oldbogie 10-11-2010 12:46 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by kbuhagiar
Hello Folks,

On the small block chevy engine, which of the seventeen head bolts enter the water jacket (and thus need to be sealed)?

Thanks in advance. :thumbup:

They all do but check each and every one. The reason for checking is that you will be applying a thread sealer and if anyone hole happens not to be open any sealer ahead of the bolt that becomes trapped between the bolt end and the bottom of a closed hole will form a hydraulic lock as the bolt is turned in and this lock will have sufficient force to crack the casting at the bottom of any blind hole.

I have come to simply using Teflon plumberís pipe thread sealant. It is effective, doesnít form solid particles that can become dislodged and circulate with the coolant, possibly plugging small passage as it does. The Teflon sealant also has properties most similar to lubricating oil which is most often the thread lubricant used when torque setting that make the prescribed bolt stretch are established and published, however, when using none OEM fasteners carefully check with the manufacturer such as ARP for example as often their torque specs are made with their proprietary lubricant or sealer. So just take time to study up before crossing types and brands of fasteners and sealants/lubricants.

As has been sighted, the threads both male and female need to be clean and undamaged other wise they will give false torque readings which will be that the prescribed amount of torque will be reached before the needed stretch of the fastener is achieved. Brushing the threads to clean them and running a thread restorer tap or die to both clean and refinish them is a good idea. Thread restorers
Are not the same as thread cutting dies or taps. These tools are made from a softer material than thread cutters and are intended to clean and massage the threads back into shape, not cut new ones. Threads come in different specifications and most fasteners use a rolled thread fasteners rather than cut. So taking a thread cutting tool may greatly alter the dimensional and shape detail of the thread itself to some other than the OEMís design. While such threads will fir together by having the same overall diameter and pitch, the specific differences in the shape and dimension of the thread itself can compromise the contact area.

Donít forget to lubricate where the fasteners head makes contact with the surface being fastened, there is a lot of friction here and if left dry, like poor quality threads, it will lead to a falsely high torque reading before the fastener reaches its intended stretch. If youíre fastening aluminum, there needs to be a hardened washer between the fastenerís head and the surface being fastened, otherwise the fastener digs into the softer aluminum damaging the aluminum part and again developing a false torque before the needed stretch is achieved.

Bogie

Adam65 10-11-2010 01:23 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by oldbogie
They all do but check each and every one. The reason for checking is that you will be applying a thread sealer and if anyone hole happens not to be open any sealer ahead of the bolt that becomes trapped between the bolt end and the bottom of a closed hole will form a hydraulic lock as the bolt is turned in and this lock will have sufficient force to crack the casting at the bottom of any blind hole.

I have come to simply using Teflon plumberís pipe thread sealant. It is effective, doesnít form solid particles that can become dislodged and circulate with the coolant, possibly plugging small passage as it does. The Teflon sealant also has properties most similar to lubricating oil which is most often the thread lubricant used when torque setting that make the prescribed bolt stretch are established and published, however, when using none OEM fasteners carefully check with the manufacturer such as ARP for example as often their torque specs are made with their proprietary lubricant or sealer. So just take time to study up before crossing types and brands of fasteners and sealants/lubricants.

As has been sighted, the threads both male and female need to be clean and undamaged other wise they will give false torque readings which will be that the prescribed amount of torque will be reached before the needed stretch of the fastener is achieved. Brushing the threads to clean them and running a thread restorer tap or die to both clean and refinish them is a good idea. Thread restorers
Are not the same as thread cutting dies or taps. These tools are made from a softer material than thread cutters and are intended to clean and massage the threads back into shape, not cut new ones. Threads come in different specifications and most fasteners use a rolled thread fasteners rather than cut. So taking a thread cutting tool may greatly alter the dimensional and shape detail of the thread itself to some other than the OEMís design. While such threads will fir together by having the same overall diameter and pitch, the specific differences in the shape and dimension of the thread itself can compromise the contact area.

Donít forget to lubricate where the fasteners head makes contact with the surface being fastened, there is a lot of friction here and if left dry, like poor quality threads, it will lead to a falsely high torque reading before the fastener reaches its intended stretch. If youíre fastening aluminum, there needs to be a hardened washer between the fastenerís head and the surface being fastened, otherwise the fastener digs into the softer aluminum damaging the aluminum part and again developing a false torque before the needed stretch is achieved.

Bogie

Ding! ding! Here's the winner-covered all the key points that people tend to miss or maybe don't realize.

35terraplane 10-11-2010 02:41 PM

Sbc Head bolts into water jacket
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by oldbogie
They all do but check each and every one. The reason for checking is that you will be applying a thread sealer and if anyone hole happens not to be open any sealer ahead of the bolt that becomes trapped between the bolt end and the bottom of a closed hole will form a hydraulic lock as the bolt is turned in and this lock will have sufficient force to crack the casting at the bottom of any blind hole.

I have come to simply using Teflon plumber�s pipe thread sealant. It is effective, doesn�t form solid particles that can become dislodged and circulate with the coolant, possibly plugging small passage as it does. The Teflon sealant also has properties most similar to lubricating oil which is most often the thread lubricant used when torque setting that make the prescribed bolt stretch are established and published, however, when using none OEM fasteners carefully check with the manufacturer such as ARP for example as often their torque specs are made with their proprietary lubricant or sealer. So just take time to study up before crossing types and brands of fasteners and sealants/lubricants.

As has been sighted, the threads both male and female need to be clean and undamaged other wise they will give false torque readings which will be that the prescribed amount of torque will be reached before the needed stretch of the fastener is achieved. Brushing the threads to clean them and running a thread restorer tap or die to both clean and refinish them is a good idea. Thread restorers
Are not the same as thread cutting dies or taps. These tools are made from a softer material than thread cutters and are intended to clean and massage the threads back into shape, not cut new ones. Threads come in different specifications and most fasteners use a rolled thread fasteners rather than cut. So taking a thread cutting tool may greatly alter the dimensional and shape detail of the thread itself to some other than the OEM�s design. While such threads will fir together by having the same overall diameter and pitch, the specific differences in the shape and dimension of the thread itself can compromise the contact area.

Don�t forget to lubricate where the fasteners head makes contact with the surface being fastened, there is a lot of friction here and if left dry, like poor quality threads, it will lead to a falsely high torque reading before the fastener reaches its intended stretch. If you�re fastening aluminum, there needs to be a hardened washer between the fastener�s head and the surface being fastened, otherwise the fastener digs into the softer aluminum damaging the aluminum part and again developing a false torque before the needed stretch is achieved.

Bogie

I agree with everything said, but if you have both rolled and cut threats on the bolts, then you would have rolled and cut threads in the holes. making bolts would be much easier and faster when they are rolled, as you would use a tread roller which wold be two plates. These would last much longer than a die. The holes would be tapped with a roll tap. The rolled thread is rounded on top and in the valleys plus they are the stronger of the two type threads. The cut thread would be sharper on the top and bottom. When you roll a thread, you do not remove any metal you just move it around. so I would think IMO that it would be better that they used rolled threads, and not knowing for sure, but I would guess that it's a standard to use rolled threads. Plus they are pretty stable when the bolts are hardened. You can use one with the other as they measure the same, it's just that the blanks are different size before you roll or cut, or the hole size is bigger or smaller.
But like said by oldbogie they don't work well together.



Later 35terraplane


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