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Old 10-07-2004, 02:33 PM
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sikkens or ppg's omni????

Hoping to get insight as to what is a better paint?

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Old 10-07-2004, 02:53 PM
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In order: (best to?&*?/)
Sikkens -Auto base Plus
Sikkens-Lesonal
PPG brand dbu, dbc (not Omini)
Sikkens-main- auto cryl. (being disc)
Sikkens-Utech brand.
Omini-

Last edited by BarryK; 10-07-2004 at 02:59 PM.
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Old 10-07-2004, 07:08 PM
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OMNI is junk!!
Barry just wondering why do you think DBU is better then DBC?
Ive found it to be cloudy and dirter then DBC...Eric
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Old 10-07-2004, 07:34 PM
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I don't, I was just placing both above the next in a group, if that makes any sense. I was only answering on coverage and durability, no personal opinion on my part.
But if you want my personal opinion the Utech base beats all of them, they just don't have color matches.
BK
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Old 10-07-2004, 08:45 PM
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Sikkens -Auto base Plus: BMW 745i

Omni - Nissan Sentra
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Old 10-07-2004, 11:36 PM
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Here I go opening my mouth in the real of the pros. Oh boy: I would not be afraid to use the Omni like the acrylic urethane on the interior areas of the body. I stripped mine down to bare metal inside and out, and I elected to use Omni MTK of the same color on the inside of the body. These are areas that will not be seen after interior installation, and I think the seal is acceptable and I saved a few bucks in the process. I am going with the BC/CC on the exterior since I am most comfortable with that system IE: (have a little experience and luck with it). Even though different systems, I can get the same color in both, and I think I can get a decent enough match (which is not critical) for my taste. Any case, these folks have helped me a tremendous amount and have excellent advice. That's why they are pros.
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Old 10-08-2004, 04:25 AM
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If you want the real truth the difference between base-coats are minimal as long as the best I can put it a "non enamel base".
The enamels are used rarely and in the cheaper lines (omni, Nason, Western)
And even so they will work fine the draw back will be how many coats to cover, flash time will be slower and a total slower full cure time and a slight possibility of sensitivity if you must redo the job. Most important thing for base-coat longevity is the choice of clear.

Single stages, get a lot more complicated with major differences as the single stage is the Color, Clear all in one so quality
is very important for a single stage.
For the inside like you did Ron it will not hurt a thing and last forever as its not exposed.
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Old 10-08-2004, 05:12 PM
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Quote:
Originally posted by BarryK
And even so they will work fine the draw back will be how many coats to cover, flash time will be slower and a total slower full cure time and a slight possibility of sensitivity if you must redo the job.
Right here to me is the reason NOT to use this crap.
The last place I work we sprayed PPG, but for one certain car dealer on their used cars they wanted cheap, and it was OMNI.

There were a couple times were the shop lost money by using OMNI instead of DBC. OMNI took 7-8 more coats, took 3 times as long for a flash time. I remember one certain red Chrylser had, it was cheaper in the long run to buy DBC then to buy OMNI.
Nothing like using a qt and half of OMNI were DBC would have covered in less of a pt.

And dont even get my started on the Single Stage, I wouldnt paint my beat up rusted out wheel barrow with that crap...Eric
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Old 10-08-2004, 07:36 PM
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One way a salesman sells is to show the customer that his "cheaper" product costs more to use than the more expensive product you are selling.

As a paint rep, this is a common sales tool. It was VERY easy some times to show a guy how his $15.00 a roll DA paper was costing him more to use than my $30.00 a roll DA paper. This is a hard thing for some people to grasp, but with a test, and a note pad you can PROVE it.

I had a guy one time who was a good paint account, but I just couldn't get him to move on up to better DA paper. He was painting big tractor trailer rigs, BIG accounts like COKE and the like. He used all our products but the sand paper because we couldn't get anywhere near the $15.00 a roll price he was paying. He finally agreed to a demo. I had his painter sand a the paint to bare metal on an old fender, timing him for one minute. He used his cheapie paper, then my paper. I PROVED with simple math how that roll of $15.00 paper was COSTING him $154.00 MORE in labor to use it than the $30.00 a roll I had.


Paint is just the same, that is why I don't like the "value lines" like OMNI. It "can" do a great job, and many time save money. But not every time, not by a long shot.
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Old 10-09-2004, 06:09 AM
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He used his cheapie paper, then my paper. I PROVED with simple math how that roll of $15.00 paper was COSTING him $154.00 MORE in labor to use it than the $30.00 a roll I had. (byMS)
*****************************************
Been there done & seen that and as a fleet shop after you proved your point he said " they just throw the paper on the floor anyway, so I will just keep the cheap"
BWK


Three MAIN things in automotive refinishing where cheap products is not cheaper.
"Sandpaper, Basecoat, Lacquer primer".

(footnote on sand paper-- this is a lot of trial and error as there are brands for $20-40 a roll that are a lot better than the $65-70
a roll stuff but you must find, as a lot are not a 1/4 as good.)
BWK
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Old 10-09-2004, 08:38 AM
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Barry, you are right about the guys tossing the paper. But I also would tell the manager to watch during the test. I told them to watch the guys sanding, how they ONLY will want to replace the paper that isn't doing any sanding anymore. How with the better paper, they will NOT change paper because it is still doing it's job. The painter/preper is conditioned to tear that paper off the disc at the first sign of poor performance, NOT by some clock or something. So the better paper is going to stay on the disc and stay working INSTEAD of on the floor.

You are very right, when I was refering to my "$30.00 a roll" DA paper, it was only for the story telling purposes. "Better" could replace the "$30.00 a roll" most times. Heck, that "$30.00" a roll was a killer price for me. That paper RN was about $38.00 a roll! And I lost the business many time to the 3M rep with Purple which performed better than mine at $28.00 or so (prostitutes )

So price isn't always the end all, that is for sure.
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