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  #46 (permalink)  
Old 09-23-2010, 04:32 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by turbolover
You're a PE? What field?
Control Sytems

Bogie

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  #47 (permalink)  
Old 09-23-2010, 05:48 PM
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Originally Posted by lookatme
do you have any? decisive a/b test results that is.
Yes very decisive, although many here would consider it all anecdotal evidence.
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  #48 (permalink)  
Old 09-23-2010, 08:56 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Silverback
I'm not sure if you said it earlier or someone else, but I don't get "increase quench area to reduce compression." Depending on how you're defining it, grooving the quench pad either doesn't change quench area or decreases it, and if you increase the distance as Singh suggests you'll further decrease the effect.

Second, yes, groves seem to make the engine less detonation sensitive (that is where my 10% increase in compression on the briggs idea came from, generally those briggs L-heads do not like compression increases and almost never show any positive effects from it but I knew that I'd be safe based on previous experience with groves), but there are loads of other ways to skin that cat. I've run as high as 11.8:1 compression on an iron headed SBC with 87 octane without groves and without detonation problems. My DD in college was at around 10:1 (again, iron headed SBC that by the time I was done with it could average 35-37mpg highway, still crappy in the city though), and much of the time I didn't have the money for better than 87 and that thing ran reliably like that after some tweaking.
do you mind sharing any of these tips/tricks/secrets on running that high of compression? If you don't want to post them public you could pm me.
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  #49 (permalink)  
Old 09-23-2010, 09:17 PM
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Would be hard (impossible?) to do w/total timing set for max power- at least w/any of the iron heads I am aware of. I would be interested in hearing all about this deal, for sure. Especially if it was a SBC >/= 327 cid.
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  #50 (permalink)  
Old 09-23-2010, 11:03 PM
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I want in too.
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  #51 (permalink)  
Old 09-24-2010, 01:09 AM
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I would certainly be interested in how you could run 11.8:1 compression in an iron head SBC using 87 octane gasoline running standard timing and get 35-37 mpg at highway speeds with a similar engine at 10:1 compression with 87 octane. What kind of vehicle, 1/2T truck, Camaro, full size Impala, Fiero with 2.23:1 gearing + overdrive?

Tell us the secret, special cam, carb, manifold, header? Please don't tell us the highway portion of the mileage test was all downhill?

Perhaps a Smokey Yunick type device?
Smokey Yunicks Adiabatic Hot air engine.

Inquiring minds want to know.
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  #52 (permalink)  
Old 09-24-2010, 06:15 AM
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Gonna Need Boots

I would like in on the secret too. Hold on, don't start yet. I gotta go get my hip boots, this is gonna get deep. olnolan
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  #53 (permalink)  
Old 09-24-2010, 10:10 PM
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we would like to at least hear you out silverback. I want to believe you but when tech chimes in and says he would like to see it, then it has got to be a breakthrough that we all would like to know about, this is my thread and I am all ears and am always willing to hear anything just not try everything.
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Old 09-25-2010, 01:18 PM
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propane? i want to believe.
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  #55 (permalink)  
Old 09-25-2010, 02:47 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by lookatme
propane? i want to believe.
Yeah. But "87 octane" propane?
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  #56 (permalink)  
Old 09-26-2010, 11:01 PM
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I've posted full details in other places and had nothing to do with this thread but the car was an '83 Trans Am with a crossfire injected (basically throttle body with long intake runners) 305 with a TH700r4, 3.23 gears and fairly tall (27") tires, headers, 2 high flow converters and no muffler. No dramatic changes, just a good, well matched combination with years of tweaking and small changes till it got as good as it was going to get (when I was in college and didn't have anything better to do besides playing with my car). It helped that it wasn't incredibly heavy and was one of the most aerodynamic body styles ever built, and I took that further also. The engine started with a good combination for this kind of thing also, small bore, high compression (9.8:1, which was really high for early 80's with iron heads), good valve size, iron heads, long, narrow runners that.

After college my wife (then gf) lived in RI for a while while I was in the DC metro area, so many weekends I'd head up that way and that is where I clocked some of the best MPG numbers, and it wasn't uncommon for me to make it up there (over 400miles), drive around a bit and not have to get gas until i was headed back. It also still managed some pretty crappy mileage around town, in the 16-19mpg range, which I always attributed to a primitive ECM setup in it.

Funny how now I'm pretty happy now when I can mange 20mpg in my LT1 powered TA or either of my TPI powered cars (TA and formula)

Last edited by Silverback; 09-26-2010 at 11:09 PM.
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  #57 (permalink)  
Old 09-27-2010, 08:29 AM
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Thats pretty amazing considering a friends brother managed to get 31-33 mpg in 1991 from his 3.1L Firebird when it was broken in, and that was Imperial mpg not US mpg which works out to 26-28 mpg US.

That bird was slippery and not that heavy too, surprisingly good performance from 140hp with the 5 speed.

Your car wasn't black and called Kitt by any chance? David Hasselhoff is that you?

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  #58 (permalink)  
Old 09-27-2010, 07:14 PM
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Silverback, so if the engine started out at 9.8 compression how did you get to 11.8? Do you have a link to this other thread that you were talking about this car in?
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  #59 (permalink)  
Old 09-27-2010, 07:58 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by 4 Jaw Chuck
Thats pretty amazing considering a friends brother managed to get 31-33 mpg in 1991 from his 3.1L Firebird when it was broken in, and that was Imperial mpg not US mpg which works out to 26-28 mpg US.

That bird was slippery and not that heavy too, surprisingly good performance from 140hp with the 5 speed.
it's funny, it's not uncommon for the later 305 TBI (LO3) third gens to get better mpg then the same vintage V6's... ad headers, exhaust, ignition box/better coil with a larger plug gap, some basic tbi mods... and you can easily end up in the range that I was in.

Last edited by Silverback; 09-27-2010 at 08:04 PM.
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  #60 (permalink)  
Old 09-27-2010, 08:02 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by crussell85
Silverback, so if the engine started out at 9.8 compression how did you get to 11.8? Do you have a link to this other thread that you were talking about this car in?
That car never saw more than that. There have been quite a few MPG threads on thirdgen.org
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