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kc8oye 12-18-2010 11:37 PM

single vs base/clear
I'm still trying to decide on going with a single stage urethane or a base/clear combo on my 72 monte carlo.. can I get your guyz' opinions on which might be better for me?

it's going to be a Solid (non-metallic) white.. I plan to use the GM color code for a 2006 "Arctic White" corvette. (I like the white, and being a factory color, it should be easy to find touch up paint and such for it)

I'm not an experienced painter, in fact, I will probably do all the primer and prep/blocking work (i've got experience with this stuff) and have a shop do the final paint for me.

I'm looking for what would be easier to take care of and touch up if it does get dinged up (And it will, cuz I drive the SNOT out of my car)

deadbodyman 12-19-2010 06:39 AM

I use SS for all my solid colors

raybo 12-19-2010 07:54 AM

single vs base/clear
single is cheaper and as long as you are using hardener works just fine touching up

Centerline 12-19-2010 04:42 PM


Originally Posted by deadbodyman
I use SS for all my solid colors

X-2 on that one. Single stage has several advantages for a novice painter. Its easier to fix imperfections, easier to cut & buff (no chance of going through the clear coat) and easier to re-shoot if you screw up. Custom effects can be done easier with BC/CC but solid non metallic colors..... I'll use single stage every time.

DanielC 12-19-2010 06:22 PM

I believe for easy touch up, a single stage would be better.
If I am not mistaken, in Dupont numbers, you want Centari 817 White. My information says it is for 1982 Chevy truck "Frost White" This white in bright sunlight is almost painful to look at without sunglasses.

kc8oye 12-20-2010 03:07 AM

that's the kind of white I want :>

i'm problaby going to continue using the brand of paint I used for the epoxy.. if I could only remember what it's called.. LOL. it's 4am and I'm tired.. lol

oh yeah.. it's Matrix paint.. i get it locally in michigan.. and it's a michigan company. the paint seems to be good stuff, tho being a novice I can't really make a fair comparison.

and it's pricing is really quite reasonable compared to PPG products which I can also get locally .. never looked for a dupont dealer in the area.

Single stage is what I was thinking.. my buddy keeps trying to talk me into a base/clear.

deadbodyman 12-20-2010 05:33 AM

although I havent used Matrix Theres a lot of painters around here that love their clear so I would guess their SS paint is just as good...Centari is an acrilic enamel even if you use a hardner it wont last near as long as a urathane is cheaper but urathane is what you really want...
when sprayed right you cant tell SS from BC/CC unless you actually sand it. as long as its a solid color...metalics are a whole nuther story....

cyclopsblown34 12-20-2010 10:47 AM

A buddy of mine is a chemist in the automotive coatings division of a huge chemical company and part time painter, he does some awesome work behind a paint gun. He's in Michigan and swears by Matrix clears. He generally uses PPG bases.

DanielC 12-20-2010 10:49 AM

I forgot to mention that I use the Dupont 793S hardener in the Centari. It makes the Centari quite durable.

kc8oye 12-20-2010 12:23 PM

I have a friend who got a deal going with the local Matrix rep through the auto body classes he took, so i can get Matrix stuff a lot cheaper then anything else ;)

and absolutely.. Urethane is the only way I want to go for a SS.

this car was painted with a Urethane SS.. if my car looks half this nice I'll be happy :) (this is a car we did at the shop i used to work at) we did all the base work, then had a local paint shop do the final coat, as we didn't have a proper spray booth..

ant_8u 12-22-2010 08:27 PM

What is the rationale behind using SS for solids and bc/cc for metallics and pearls?

I'm new to paint, so I need an education


DanielC 12-22-2010 09:19 PM

Metallics and pearls demand a very good gun technique. If really affects the appearance of a metallic if you spray it slightly "dry" or "wet". If you spray a metallic BC/CC, it is a little more forgiving getting the color and evenness of the shade right, without having to worry as much about orange peel, or runs, or sags. Not that you do not have to worry about it, but not as much. Once the color is right, just shoot the clear on it, to get the gloss.
I have seen a few cars painted with a SS metallic, and sprayed slightly "wet" and look really good right after spraying, and then when looked at again slightly later, a very slight "sag" in the paint, that becomes very obvious because the metallic highlights the sag.

kc8oye 12-22-2010 09:20 PM

i've also understood it that the clear prevents the metallic from being exposed to oxygen and corroding..

also if you try to 'cut and buff' a single stage metallic, you can actually affect the metallic, whereas doing the same to a clear coat won't

deadbodyman 12-23-2010 05:23 AM

SS stays wet for a while so when you get the metalics all standing up nice and even and popping they slowly sink back into the wet paint and lay down.if you get a little too much paint on it will run or sag and the metalics will slide ....

BC/CC on the other hand drys very fast so once you get the metalics standing up and even they get locked into place ,same with pearls.

concider clear a SS solid color paint W/O the color,
since thats what it is,you can do anything to SS paint that you can do to clear.
if you get a run in either it can be sanded out easily....SS metalics can not be sanded, any runs are there for life ,you can sand it flat but you'll also disturb the metalics making a very noticable spot

SS paint and BC/CC are sprayed using completly different methods....SS being the easiest,You just lay it down like you want it to look. Clears are sprayed the same way (they are the same)

base coats are a lot tougher if you lay it on to heavy(like a SS) it'll) skin over (looking dry ) but soft underneath causing problems when the clear is put on because it traps the solvents ,leaving them nowhere to go.
I would highly advise someone doing their first paint job to use a SS solid color. you'll have a more harmonious outcome. if you get runs , dont worry about it ,they'll sand right out and you'll gain even more valuable experiance.
(all good) So start at the begining when painting your first car (solid color SS) ,it takes practice to get it down ,just getting your trigger finger to operate right takes time,very few people are true naturals when it comes to painting and the really good ones had someone standing over them showing them the pretty pearls and metalics for later...Using them could be a very expensive first lesson.....once you can spray a SS paint nice and slick you'll already know how to spray clear the same ,so your already half way there to learning how to spray BC/CC. The most important part of painting is being patient...

shine 12-23-2010 08:08 AM

matrix is one of the most brittle paints i have ever used. i was talked into using it by a dist on 2 cars. both chipped easily during build. will never use it again. there are many others to use that are far superior to it.

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