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  #31 (permalink)  
Old 06-05-2007, 04:35 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by seriousracer
please clarify?? sorry i am wrong about what the car is worth? have all the work done by me or you?
the general statement was to say that you need to understand no one can make a bolt on to your needs setup. everything is different and something always will be different. you as a"HOTRODDER" should be able to adapt and make what you want. the wrong air cleaner they will make good on it.
guess i am disappointed in the fact that people seem to think that opening a magazine and catalogs and buying parts is the way to build a hot rod.. guess i should realize that most people see no problem with setting a standard bolt in to aluminum with out a time cert if not at least a helicoil install. that most don't build or look at something and say how could i make this work...not many problem solvers any more in the world..
and no this is not to justify BG lack of customer support but the issues you have been complaining about really are not that big.everthing is you attetion to detail if this was custom built for you than yah you could complain. but it is a "production "piece. chips in the fuel log ..ok ..clean it out.. just like you would do if you were assembling you engine. you clean everything don't you ??
i guess what i need to say is that i don't expect anything i have bought out of a catalog ever to fit with out issues.. and at 3k it not gonna be a perfect bolt on.not like having a custom built piece just the way you want it..

Are you nutz? Maybe a little crazy?

We're not talking about a custom 6 figure race car installation - nor some antiquated 50.s carb setup on an Olds engine.

This is a modern BOLT-ON application for a Small Block Chevrolet which I think this GM engine configuration has been around for what 50+ years?

For BG to not pick the order correctly - ship parts that don't fit and are of dubious questionable quality for that kind of scratch is not good business.

The consumer has a right to complain when things aren't as ADVERTISED. $3k might not be a lot to you and your six figure car ~ but for the average builder for an intake system only it's a lot of $$

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  #32 (permalink)  
Old 06-06-2007, 05:49 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Rambo_The_Dog
Are you nutz? Maybe a little crazy?

We're not talking about a custom 6 figure race car installation - nor some antiquated 50.s carb setup on an Olds engine.

This is a modern BOLT-ON application for a Small Block Chevrolet which I think this GM engine configuration has been around for what 50+ years?

For BG to not pick the order correctly - ship parts that don't fit and are of dubious questionable quality for that kind of scratch is not good business.

The consumer has a right to complain when things aren't as ADVERTISED. $3k might not be a lot to you and your six figure car ~ but for the average builder for an intake system only it's a lot of $$
so does this mean that he won't have to port match the heads to the intake?? why would that be acceptable by this reasoning...look i just get tired of everone expecting a production part to meet there needs with out troubles.. and at 3k now a days.. you don't get much.
and between you complaining about how much something costs and complaing about quality if it was another 500 or a thousand dollars and was prefect you would not buy it do to the price..so send bg your heads and make sure they are matched up after all this should be part of the price...

and trust me i am doing my t bucket for about what he has in to his intake setup. so no six figure car for me eitherthey are what i do for a living..
right now the t stands at about 1800 including getting the body and frame and buying an engine and trans axle. everything else has been dredged up out of trash bens or bought for next to nothing,including wish bones shocks radiators,fuels cell(needs new foam) fuel pumps,intercooler(hit left tank repaired it although it may be sold)turbo off a rally car,seat,areoquip(got a good deal on some free stuff from a race team that was changing chassis,dig it out and haul it away)upright steering beams and some hiems. the rest will be made by me.

and once again i am not making excuses about recieving a missed boxed part but the rest (especailly if your a machinist) is stuff you have to pay attention to detail yourself production parts won't get you there out of the box.
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  #33 (permalink)  
Old 06-06-2007, 06:59 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by seriousracer
so does this mean that he won't have to port match the heads to the intake?? why would that be acceptable by this reasoning...look i just get tired of everone expecting a production part to meet there needs with out troubles.. and at 3k now a days.. you don't get much.
and between you complaining about how much something costs and complaing about quality if it was another 500 or a thousand dollars and was prefect you would not buy it do to the price..so send bg your heads and make sure they are matched up after all this should be part of the price...

and trust me i am doing my t bucket for about what he has in to his intake setup. so no six figure car for me eitherthey are what i do for a living..
right now the t stands at about 1800 including getting the body and frame and buying an engine and trans axle. everything else has been dredged up out of trash bens or bought for next to nothing,including wish bones shocks radiators,fuels cell(needs new foam) fuel pumps,intercooler(hit left tank repaired it although it may be sold)turbo off a rally car,seat,areoquip(got a good deal on some free stuff from a race team that was changing chassis,dig it out and haul it away)upright steering beams and some hiems. the rest will be made by me.

and once again i am not making excuses about recieving a missed boxed part but the rest (especailly if your a machinist) is stuff you have to pay attention to detail yourself production parts won't get you there out of the box.
OK I tried to be nice but you are just way out there! besides please understand that 30,000 is not a six figure car count it is a 5 figure car and I really don't care how cheaply you build your car I have worked hard and saved and made good financial decisions for the past 30 years so I can afford to build the rod I want and spend what I want on it and don't need to make excuses to you because you cannot or choose not to! You have strayed so far from the subject here I purchased a quality product paid top dollar for it and not for a discount version of it. It is not something I went to the junk yard and bought to try and make fit (which is actually the basis of hotrodding)! And for what ever reason it is not what it should be and BG or any other manufacturer needs to and I am sure will make it right! You obviously are the kind of person who would buy a new crate motor take it home and if it quit running just figure that was part of hot rodding and put a new motor in? Get a grip although Hot rodding is putting to gether parts that don't normally fit the purchasing of aftermarket parts for a specific application should work with no issues. Cheap is not necessarily better you often get what you pay for and I have been building and Hot rodding since I was 15 and now am 50 so I have built on a budget but never shoved it in someones face because they didn't have to. I recently went thru cancer and after that decided life could be short and decided to quit waiting to build that rod I have always wanted. You need to learn to respect others for however they want to enjoy their hobby and if you want to rebuild that brand new crate motor so be it to each his own. We have all built on a budget done with out get over it! I say again you are way out there!
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  #34 (permalink)  
Old 06-06-2007, 07:50 AM
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sorry you think i am out there. but i am just not into the fact that everyone thinks a part will be perfect if bought out of a catalog. hince are you going to match ports if so than why not complain about that. and for a crate motor ... no i would not buy a crate motor and expecting to take it apart. of course i won't buy a CRATE MOTOR EITHER no one makes what i want. although i will be honest i was looking at an ls1 crate motor for my wife mustang. but they don't have what i want..
30 k is alot to me for something that doesn't do more than just look shiney,,,,i would have a hard time justifing that amount on a street rod with no history no desiarbilty to any one else. but you know what people out there spend alot more than that..
i think it is out there to expect on this type of deal to have the attenion to detail that you would want for yourself to be for everone else..which is what you are saying of a PRODUCTION piece... a production part will never be what you want it to be as an indvidual. and if it is than well your happy... now the air cleaner they need to get their butts moving and deal with it.

other machenist i know just get the parts to make what they want and go from there ...once again because they are not happy with anything out there but the need the starting point. hell one has his own measuring unit, krillenths. how would you expect to satisfy everyone with a single bolt on piece.
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  #35 (permalink)  
Old 06-06-2007, 07:59 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by seriousracer
sorry you think i am out there. but i am just not into the fact that everyone thinks a part will be perfect if bought out of a catalog. hince are you going to match ports if so than why not complain about that. and for a crate motor ... no i would not buy a crate motor and expecting to take it apart. of course i won't buy a CRATE MOTOR EITHER no one makes what i want. although i will be honest i was looking at an ls1 crate motor for my wife mustang. but they don't have what i want..
30 k is alot to me for something that doesn't do more than just look shiney,,,,i would have a hard time justifing that amount on a street rod with no history no desiarbilty to any one else. but you know what people out there spend alot more than that..
i think it is out there to expect on this type of deal to have the attenion to detail that you would want for yourself to be for everone else..which is what you are saying of a PRODUCTION piece... a production part will never be what you want it to be as an indvidual. and if it is than well your happy... now the air cleaner they need to get their butts moving and deal with it.

other machenist i know just get the parts to make what they want and go from there ...once again because they are not happy with anything out there but the need the starting point. hell one has his own measuring unit, krillenths. how would you expect to satisfy everyone with a single bolt on piece.
Nothing else I need to say your post speak for themselves! God bless you and have a nice life!
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  #36 (permalink)  
Old 06-06-2007, 08:36 AM
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http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WXU3N9wT3u0&eurl=

listen to the lines about 600 dollar steering wheels .

sorry to think that hotrodding has gone to the extant that if you can't buy it the way you want it it is a production fault.
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  #37 (permalink)  
Old 06-06-2007, 08:46 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by seriousracer
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WXU3N9wT3u0&eurl=

listen to the lines about 600 dollar steering wheels .

sorry to think that hotrodding has gone to the extant that if you can't buy it the way you want it it is a production fault.
I apologize to all others reading this thread I wanted to be the bigger guy and let it go but OK I can't let this go! The stud holes are drilled oversize! the studs strip out! Jerk this is a production fault! I said nothing about matching ports or any other tunning issues! Get over it find some other thread to argue with go dig thru a trash bin something OK!
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  #38 (permalink)  
Old 06-06-2007, 09:08 AM
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quality concerns

hey guys i'm new to this site,not new to hotrods!
when i decided to switch from an offy 2x4 setup to a 2x3 i looked at quite
a few options out there!
a few people in this thread are 100% correct, when you pay top dollar for
a bg setup you are paying for thier engineering!,proper fit,proper parts
and yes customer support should be way up there!
i couldn't afford bg's setup(says wife)
so i bought a edelbrock 2x3 ,no messing arround it fits, minor fabbing for the linkage but it works.,edelbrock answered my tech & setup right away!
barry grant take notice!
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  #39 (permalink)  
Old 06-06-2007, 09:15 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Not A T 25
I apologize to all others reading this thread I wanted to be the bigger guy and let it go but OK I can't let this go! The stud holes are drilled oversize! the studs strip out! Jerk this is a production fault! I said nothing about matching ports or any other tunning issues! Get over it find some other thread to argue with go dig thru a trash bin something OK!
haha ok ..
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  #40 (permalink)  
Old 06-06-2007, 09:31 AM
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Trying to stay on track with the original topic of this thread, I agree that the quality seems to be poor and a lot of mis-machining has been passed off as "acceptable". I went through a similar problem with a set of Pro Topline heads. My sons first engine. Spent the big bucks on the heads. Guess what, tons of problems. As stated by others, pushrods not fitting was the biggest problem, along with ports that were so far off it was rediculous.

My complaint was almost identical to the one here. When you spend big bucks, you expect a better product. AND since most manufacturers are now using CNC equipment, there is NO excuse for a crappy product to make it out the door. I could see misdrilled holes or whatever if some guy was drilling them by hand but on CNC parts, it should be close enough to go on the space shuttle!

CNC has now made it into the woodworking industry (my field) and the accuracy is increadable. I have a program here (free) that if I had a CNC pin router, I could build things to machinist tollerances.....out of WOOD!

There is just NO excuse for crappy parts when someone is paying big bucks from a big buck company, who ever it is!

Lets hope this problem gets resolved in a positive manner. We all know that "things happen", but this seems a little over the top.


Mark
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  #41 (permalink)  
Old 06-06-2007, 09:47 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by seriousracer
sorry you think i am out there. but i am just not into the fact that everyone thinks a part will be perfect if bought out of a catalog. hince are you going to match ports if so than why not complain about that. and for a crate motor ... no i would not buy a crate motor and expecting to take it apart. of course i won't buy a CRATE MOTOR EITHER no one makes what i want. although i will be honest i was looking at an ls1 crate motor for my wife mustang. but they don't have what i want..
30 k is alot to me for something that doesn't do more than just look shiney,,,,i would have a hard time justifing that amount on a street rod with no history no desiarbilty to any one else. but you know what people out there spend alot more than that..
i think it is out there to expect on this type of deal to have the attenion to detail that you would want for yourself to be for everone else..which is what you are saying of a PRODUCTION piece... a production part will never be what you want it to be as an indvidual. and if it is than well your happy... now the air cleaner they need to get their butts moving and deal with it.

other machenist i know just get the parts to make what they want and go from there ...once again because they are not happy with anything out there but the need the starting point. hell one has his own measuring unit, krillenths. how would you expect to satisfy everyone with a single bolt on piece.

I'm glad there are forums out there like this for folks to talk about their experiences and quality issues - it educates us all and keeps the fire lit under these vendors and manufactures to have better quality parts and service.

I'm sorry but You are "out there" ~ I suppose "with your reasoning" if you bought a brand new "production" car for 50k and something wasn't right - let's say the window didn't roll down - you would just crack the door open - void the warranty and fix it yourself - although the car came with a manufacturers warranty?

I suppose if you did work on customers cars and they had an issue with your quality of work - you'd just tell them "oh well ~ fix it yourself, you got what you paid for"

You must have gotten your *** kicked several times in your life because you seem to be one of those people who let others just walk all over you - probably you were the kid the bullies beat up on and just took it rather than fight back so you didn't get hurt more.

It doesn't matter if the part is $30, $300, $3000 or $300,000 - if it's advertised to fit and has a gaurantee the manufacturer should honor it = or they won't be doing business long.
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Old 06-06-2007, 12:59 PM
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The fact is that Not-a-t paid nearly $3000 for a part with a supposedly well-respected "brandname" stamped on it, a brandname company that openly claims to provide excellent quality and customer service.
What he got sounds to be something you'd expect from JC Whitney, a no name part with suspect components and quality, likely made off-shore, that may or may not continue to cause future problems.

Had he expected more?? I think so, and probably could have gotten a better fitting, better working used 6 pack setup from a swap meet.

IMO opinion the BG setup is way overpriced, 3-$300 carbs, a MAYBE $300 intake, and a fancy aircleaner adds up to about $1500 max. Somehwere there had better be some damn good factory support for this product.

I don't care what a company sells, and even if it's only $5, they had better be prepared to provide service after the sale.

Last edited by Jmark; 06-06-2007 at 04:23 PM. Reason: Violation of guidelines. Please see: general board guidelines.
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  #43 (permalink)  
Old 06-06-2007, 08:35 PM
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You should have read this thread first. The BG Tech guy has yet to answer me about my motor that they ruined. Check out my pics they prove it.
And read this thread. I feel for ya. Thank goodness for Jegs as a go between.

buying a demon
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  #44 (permalink)  
Old 06-07-2007, 06:17 AM
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[QUOTE=Rambo_The_Dog]I'm glad there are forums out there like this for folks to talk about their experiences and quality issues - it educates us all and keeps the fire lit under these vendors and manufactures to have better quality parts and service.

I'm sorry but You are "out there" ~ I suppose "with your reasoning" if you bought a brand new "production" car for 50k and something wasn't right - let's say the window didn't roll down - you would just crack the door open - void the warranty and fix it yourself - although the car came with a manufacturers warranty?

I suppose if you did work on customers cars and they had an issue with your quality of work - you'd just tell them "oh well ~ fix it yourself, you got what you paid for"

You must have gotten your *** kicked several times in your life because you seem to be one of those people who let others just walk all over you - probably you were the kid the bullies beat up on and just took it rather than fight back so you didn't get hurt more.

It doesn't matter if the part is $30, $300, $3000 or $300,000 - if it's advertised to fit and has a gaurantee the manufacturer should honor it = or they won't be doing business long.[/QUOTE
]
no actaully i go over board to fix my customers problems and they know it.
thats why i draw from all over the country. they also know and respect the fact i don't expect anything to work out of the box and know i don't expect fit and finish to be what i will make it. hmm key word make it... wow wait hotrodding used to be.. instead of assembler out of a catalog...
no i take my stuff back for warranty all the time. heck two ford dealers that i prep their racecars for know what i expect because I prep their race cars...

and no i never got my a**kicked for whatever reason you think.. most people when they meet me no i don't hold any punches and care more about doing the job right EVEN if it means reworking something to my specs...because once again nothing never come in the form of what i expect it to be...if it does my expectations have drop to average lows and that will not make the people i am working for happy...

there are things left out of the post i would like to know ...but i won't go there.. i just get real disappointed when people call assembling something "building" especally somone whos says he is a machineist..... most be a very ambitous one because like i stated before the machinest i know all rework everything to their specs..
i never disagreed bg should not have taken care of somethings the rest of mass produced product fit and finish it all sucks today. that why i NEVER expect anything to work.. you know the prime example of this i have to fly to work on a raceteam in portland tonight ... the team thinks something is good enough but iwill go the the FTR trans do it right ..tonight ..when i get there...because it is not good enough. oh by the way most of this will include building the back cover and installing time certs in all the bolt holes...LOL you 3k intake isn't worth 1/4 of what this gear box is ...used...
and i still have to fix problems. so with this said i am heading to portland please try and flame me while i am away.. but in reality this has been a real dissappointment in poeple just assembling hot rods... long live the catalogs and magazines!
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Old 06-07-2007, 09:42 AM
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Man, talk about a "run on" post.

Vince
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