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-   -   Skip Wite Performance 383 or ZZ383 crate motor??? (http://www.hotrodders.com/forum/skip-wite-performance-383-zz383-crate-motor-170272.html)

rbat 12-21-2009 09:07 AM

Skip White Performance 383 or ZZ383 crate motor???
 
Any thoughts on this motor for a 1975 TH400 with 353 gears. Looking for an agressive but reliable driver. Wondering about the company, cam (vacuum) and hood clearance with a Holley 750dp
http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/CHEVY...item563824b3f1
this or ZZ383????
thanks

SDLuck 12-21-2009 09:23 AM

I believe this was covered recently,try the search feature.

my87Z 12-21-2009 11:43 AM

didn't you post this same question on this same motor about a week ago?

i remember reading the build sheet and seeing that it's made with the ProComp heads and ProComp rods. these are chinese made with infieror metals, and horrible performance characteristics. i would strongly suggest not going with this motor. another set of heads from a reputable head manufacture with much less runner sizes will make more power. ProComp rods are well known to be garbage, i know guys who have said they wouldn't use them in a stock rebuild that they would rather have reconditioned GM rods than anything ProComp. if you look up these exact heads they only cost around 600-700.00, this is because they are outsorced to china, and built very cheaply.

why dont you look into your local machine shop and have them assemble it for you. ie;
350 core block= 50.00-100.00
all the machine work to the block= 600.00
scat 383 rotating assembly= 1000.00
summitt oil pan, hi-vol pmp and pick-up= 200.00
arp main, rod, head bolts= 150.00
felpro gasket set= 50.00
flat tappit cam/timing kit= 300.00
DART/RHS iron heads= 1000.00
performer RPM intake= 200.00
holley 750 vac sec= 300.00
pioneer balancer= 100.00
flex plate= 50.00
HEI hi-po dizzy= 50.00 (white's performance)
wires and plugs= 50.00
dress-up= 150.00
GM serp kit= 550.00
granted you'll have around 5k into it, but the machine shop could get you some better prices, and atleast you'll know what is in the motor and trust it. and if you think about it before it's all said and one you would have 5k into this motor as well, you'll still need a carb, flex plate, water pump, alternator, power steering pump, all the pulleys and belt, plus you'll pay a heft amount for shipping it to a warehouse, even more if you want it shipped to your house

XNTRCI-T 12-21-2009 12:42 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by my87Z
didn't you post this same question on this same motor about a week ago?

Yes, he did...

price 12-21-2009 01:32 PM

garbage
 
We have to stop *****footin around with Chinese garbage. I heard a 3000 lb. counterfit pipe fitting blow in the power plant in Monroe Mich. and it was scary. Don,t even give the Chinese the the honour of acknowledging their garbage.
Clint

rbat 12-21-2009 03:03 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by my87Z
didn't you post this same question on this same motor about a week ago?

i remember reading the build sheet and seeing that it's made with the ProComp heads and ProComp rods. these are chinese made with infieror metals, and horrible performance characteristics. i would strongly suggest not going with this motor. another set of heads from a reputable head manufacture with much less runner sizes will make more power. ProComp rods are well known to be garbage, i know guys who have said they wouldn't use them in a stock rebuild that they would rather have reconditioned GM rods than anything ProComp. if you look up these exact heads they only cost around 600-700.00, this is because they are outsorced to china, and built very cheaply.

why dont you look into your local machine shop and have them assemble it for you. ie;
350 core block= 50.00-100.00
all the machine work to the block= 600.00
scat 383 rotating assembly= 1000.00
summitt oil pan, hi-vol pmp and pick-up= 200.00
arp main, rod, head bolts= 150.00
felpro gasket set= 50.00
flat tappit cam/timing kit= 300.00
DART/RHS iron heads= 1000.00
performer RPM intake= 200.00
holley 750 vac sec= 300.00
pioneer balancer= 100.00
flex plate= 50.00
HEI hi-po dizzy= 50.00 (white's performance)
wires and plugs= 50.00
dress-up= 150.00
GM serp kit= 550.00
granted you'll have around 5k into it, but the machine shop could get you some better prices, and atleast you'll know what is in the motor and trust it. and if you think about it before it's all said and one you would have 5k into this motor as well, you'll still need a carb, flex plate, water pump, alternator, power steering pump, all the pulleys and belt, plus you'll pay a heft amount for shipping it to a warehouse, even more if you want it shipped to your house

Thanks for the detailed response. It gives me some specifics to ask my local machine shop. I did ask about the company and build of the skip white mtr about a week ago. The response from muliple forums was minimal. A few said that the heads were chinese and not quality, seemed to be more from the build parts which they do not use (valves or springs). I could not find anything else on the rods. Maybe I searched incorrectly.

BTW, I originally started with local machine shops and it got real expensive (I live in south florida). I was over the price of this motor using my 2 bolt main, numbers matchng block. I thought it would be better to go with a bowtie block or the gm performance 383 and pickle the original mtr. ( I was told there were major advantages to the new style blocks).
Although I am open for "any" additional information I was looking for thoughts on a comparison of the two.
I put myself in the category of knowing enough to be dangerous. I am not looking to piss anybody off, just trying to tap into helpful people and their knowledge on this project.

ap72 12-21-2009 03:08 PM

If you can't build local then buy a crate engine from a reputable supplier. Don't even look at the price until your done, if you shop by price then quality takes a back seat.

There are many ways to skin a cat.

my87Z 12-22-2009 10:09 AM

take a look at some of these:

http://www.blueprintengines.com/popu...specs&pc_id=25

http://www.blueprintengines.com/popu...specs&pc_id=26

http://masperformance.com/420_383.htm

if you look into it you can find tons of crate motors our there for a good price, i'm still a bigger fan of either building it your self or haveing a local machinest do it cause no matter what you know what is in that motor, and you know that no one is lieng to you

SKIP WHITE 12-26-2009 11:37 PM

I'm surprised at the opinion some of you guys have for the offshore products on the market, and it's understandable. The Procomp heads are just as they should be, as we have sold no less than 1500 pair worldwide. It is the low quality parts that many sellers install in the heads, and worse yet, the mismatch of parts, installed by someone that knows very little about how to do it. Shame on Procomp for letting their sellers do this Our problems with these heads have been few and far between, and it's the above mentioned that causes most all of the problems. As for the Pc rods we have also sold at least 800 sets with zero issues, and built at least 200 engines with them. You would be surprised at just who makes those rods. We know where to draw the line when it comes to offshore products. I have rejected many products due to quality issues. You don't see us using the low cost Procomp cranks, lifters and oil pumps do you. My value to the hot rod community is to offer products that have a very low failure rate, and that's exactlty what I do. As for the crate motor comparison in this post, you really don't realize what we are offering. Do you really think I would put together an engine using a brand new 1pc. rms Bowtie block with inferior parts. Low cost with little sacrifice, and no failures tolorated is our objective. For those not in the know, Scat, Eagle and Comp Star cranks and rods are all made in China. Scat has exceptional quality control, as I personally know the the owner of the company and he spends four months of the year in China.
There are many sellers on the market that will sell inferior offshore products, and could care less what happens to your engine if they fail. We do care for every good reason, and don't sell junk. I'm not here to push products, just trying to set the record straight.

rnix999 12-27-2009 01:03 PM

Skip,

Finally, an excellent response to this question and much appriciated!

cobalt327 12-27-2009 04:25 PM

My only reservation is that some will read Skip's partial endorsement of off-shore/Chinese manufactured parts as a big green light to go ahead and buy anything that comes along- regardless of the point of origin- while humming a mantra of "it's all good".

The fact is- IMO- SOME of the parts and pieces coming from 'elsewhere' are OK, but MANY of the parts are just hastily made, reverse-engineered pieces of **** that are bought for a pittance and sold for a pittance and a half by unscrupulous importers who could give two ****s whether or not the parts are fit for the app or not. THEY (the importers) will be gone before you can say boo, along w/your hard-earned coin- having morphed into yet another LLC w/a new name, etc.

The bottom line is- for me- to use due diligence in any expenditure that you make that involves off-shore or non-mainstream importers. This includes ALL the Chinese imports, as well as parts coming in from anywhere else. This is your best weapon against being taken.

If a deal seems too good to be true, it very likely IS too good to be true.

SKIP WHITE 12-27-2009 04:33 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by cobalt327
My only reservation is that some will read Skip's partial endorsement of off-shore/Chinese manufactured parts as a big green light to go ahead and buy anything that comes along- regardless of the point of origin- while humming a mantra of "it's all good".

The fact is- IMO- SOME of the parts and pieces coming from 'elsewhere' are OK, but MANY of the parts are just hastily made, reverse-engineered pieces of **** that are bought for a pittance and sold for a pittance and a half by unscrupulous importers who could give two ****s whether or not the parts are fit for the app or not. THEY (the importers) will be gone before you can say boo, along w/your hard-earned coin- having morphed into yet another LLC w/a new name, etc.

The bottom line is- for me- to use due diligence in any expenditure that you make that involves off-shore or non-mainstream importers. This includes ALL the Chinese imports, as well as parts coming in from anywhere else. This is your best weapon against being taken.


If a deal seems too good to be true, it very likely IS too good to be true.


You say my partial endorsement of these products gives the green light to buy anything from offshore companies. I'm not even going to comment on that. You need to read my posts again.

ap72 12-27-2009 05:03 PM

There are many many very reputable machinists who won't touch pro comp products. There's a good reason for that.

SKIP WHITE 12-27-2009 05:16 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ap72
There are many many very reputable machinists who won't touch pro comp products. There's a good reason for that.

And to that I will add, there are just as many if not more that will and do approve of these heads. Have you surveyed this with all the machinists in the country. If your saying that these machinists find the Dart Platinum Pro 1's a better choice then I would have to aggree for many good reasons. But for several reasons, strange as some may be, the PC heads have a place, and they are very reliable and strong performers.

cobalt327 12-28-2009 02:52 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by SKIP WHITE
You say my partial endorsement of these products gives the green light to buy anything from offshore companies. I'm not even going to comment on that. You need to read my posts again.

No- I think YOU ought to reread MY post, if anything. I'm NOT SAYING YOU GAVE THE GREEN LIGHT!!!

Only, that some DA's will read that into your post- THAT IS THE POINT OF MY POST- TO USE YOUR ****ING BRAINS BEFORE SHELLING OUT YOUR CASH FOR OFF-SHORE PARTS.

Got That?

What part of: "My only reservation is that some will read Skip's partial endorsement of off-shore/Chinese manufactured parts as a big green light to go ahead and buy anything that comes along- regardless of the point of origin- while humming a mantra of "it's all good".

The fact is- IMO- SOME of the parts and pieces coming from 'elsewhere' are OK, but MANY of the parts are just hastily made, reverse-engineered pieces of **** that are bought for a pittance and sold for a pittance and a half by unscrupulous importers who could give two ****s whether or not the parts are fit for the app or not."
do you not get?


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