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Old 11-05-2004, 03:48 PM
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Sould I build 496 or 468 BBC?? Help.

Hey all...
I have a 1974 454 bigblock. Its nothing special, it has 2 bolt mains and oval port heads.

My tech college i'm going to wants to machine it for me. Now, i don;t have tons of money, i'm just 19 and going to college, but would a 496 work out with this block? or would the 496 blow the 2bolt mains out of the oil pan? ALSO, i kinda wanted to know whats realistic for this motor so i can find a kit and build her up affordaby/worth while. I also wnated to find a kit so that i know the EXACT piston DIA so they can machine it to fit the pistons the best. Thanks Guys...

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Old 11-05-2004, 05:58 PM
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A 496 should be fine. I would find a set of 049 or 781 ovals of you want at torque monster for cheap, or find a set of recangualr port heads. You wouldent be looking at more than around 550 hp max, if you are running pump gas and the heads are not ported, so the block should be fine. You could also splay the main caps for some more strength. That is actually stronger than a stock 4 bolt. Check your heads, they may already be 049s or 781's.

Adam
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Old 11-05-2004, 06:06 PM
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I agree build the biggest engine you can. One problem with your post is I see you want to bore the block before you have the pistons in hand. That is not the wise way to go. You should measure the pistons and bore the block accordingly. Different manufactures/materials require different tolerances. Differnt pistons need to be measured at different spots. While the clearance is "supposed" to be in the piston, I have never had a block machined without the pistons in hand.

Royce
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Old 11-05-2004, 07:03 PM
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I agree, get the pistons first. Man camaroman, it feels good to finally agree on something.

Adam
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Old 11-06-2004, 07:47 AM
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The 496 is not a high reving build so the 2 bolt mains will suffice. Since you are budget limited, but can get the machine work "free" , the stroker crank is going to be the high dollar ticket unless you go wild on the rest of the rotating assembly. I'll try to get a build sheet to you that is from John Lingenfelter. This will give you some good ideals as to what a "high end" build entails and costs.

Trees
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Old 11-06-2004, 07:54 AM
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Adam,
We agree more than you think. There is usually more than one way to get a job done. We usually just choose two different ways, LOL.

Royce
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Old 11-06-2004, 12:55 PM
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Camaroman,
Yeah, you're right.

Muscleblock,
As far a the 496 goes, I have seen pump gas 496's with oval heads that were ported and polished, and solid roller cams make close to 600 hp. I would guess that if you just used a hyd flat tappet, and the heads were unported, you should still be able to get around 500 hp out of it. Do you have the heads on hand, If so, I would be interested in knowing what the casting numbers of the heads is. The last 3 digits is all thats important.


Here are some parts that I found that seem pretty reasonable. They arent the strongest parts in the word, but I am sure they are strong enough to handle what ever you are going to throw at them even if you go a litte more radical on your motor someday.

Rotating assembly:
Look at the Part Number 1-496IPS It is $1,050 for pistons, crank and rods. That doesnt seem too bad.

http://www.sallee-chevrolet.com/Scat...mbly_Kits.html

I would also look at a cam somethink like this:

XE284H (240 246 @ .050 duration, .574 .578 lift) 2300 - 6500 powerband. And run a 2500 stall. This cam would start making power around 1800-2000 RPM and stop around 5600 RPM in a 496 due to the extra cubic inches.

Or if you wanted someting a little smaller, this:

XE274H (230 236 @ .050 duration, .552 .555 lift) 1800-6000 RPM Powerband and run around a 2200 stall. Again because of the extra cubic inches, the real powerband of the cam would drop to around 1500-5300. Those corrected powband numbers are just estimates, and could be off a little.

Either way, I would use a Performer RPM or RPM airgap intake. That manifold matches the 2 cams above perfectly, and its powerband will drop accordingly.

Good luck
Adam
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Old 11-09-2004, 01:19 AM
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I had the chance to the the machine work done for free before and i went for it and built a decent 406 with aluminum heads.

Now i can get my 350sbc and my 454bbc blocks machined for free but i don't have the money for all the goodies inside just yet. I wanted to take advantage of this deal because it have a pretty penny. BUT!!!! how bad would it be to just tell them to machine everything and just go with a .030 over bore in the motor and get .030 over bore pistons later when i can aford them. I mean, yes, every brand isn't exactly .030 on the dot like you guys say, but would it make THAT BIG of a difference?????

I'm all for spending the extra dallor to do the job out right and don't cut corners, but i just don't have the cash to build another motor right now.

Even if i didn't build these motors up, could i sell the machine block for more money then the stock block? Would they gain any value?


Let me know, you guys have been great help!!! Thanks!
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Old 11-09-2004, 11:17 AM
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I don't know enough about machine work to give you a definite answer. I would choose now what kind of piston you want in the future, and then call that company. Ask them what they think the dangers might be with what you are doing. They may be able to tell you if their pistons run a little big or a little small, and how much. I think that would be your best bet if you have to get the machine work done now.

Good luck
Adam
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Old 11-09-2004, 02:47 PM
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Yeah, thats the problem, i have to get it done NOW or else i'll have to pay later. I'm not 100% sure if i want to go all out and build a 500hp motor or if i just want to get some cheap 454 piston kit and have an alight 454 with some muscle in her.

anyone else have an opinion with regards to just having it machined with out the pistons in hand?
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Old 09-08-2009, 11:13 PM
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Years ago, I dropped the 454 block off to get machined, and the guy doing the work offered me some cash for the block I couldn't refuse.... in retrospect, looking at all the "crap" I have collected over the years, that was the only car "part" I ever sold and got ride of, and probably the only one that woulda been worth keeping.

BTW, I agree with you guys to have the pistons in hand and do it right the first time around. (especial something you can't "un-bore" after getting the pistons and saying "OH _")
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Old 09-09-2009, 02:14 AM
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Agree with Adam. Choose the pistons you want to use, call the manufacturer or other savvy distributor and ask what the bore should be to run those exact pistons. Have the block bored and honed to that exact size, then wipe the bores down thoroughly with cosmoline or other heavy grease to store the block. No problem. If you want to have it align honed or align bored at the same time, you should know that there are shorter timing sets to take up the slack.

Stock measurement from the centerline of the cam journals to the centerline of the main journals is 5.152" and would take a Cloyes True Roller 9-3110 timing set.

A centerline to centerline measurement of 5.147" (-0.005") would take a Cloyes True Roller 9-3110-5 timing set.

A centerline to centerline measurement of 5.142" (-0.010") would take a Cloyes True Roller 9-3110-10 timing set.

A WORD OF WARNING; Do not use a flat tappet hydraulic or flat tappet solid cam in a big block Chevy. Use only a roller cam, hydraulic of solid.

ANOTHER WORD OF WARNING; Do not use a piston that has the wrist pin bore pushed up into the oil ring groove. Here is an example of the highest pin location you would want to use, just short of the oil ring with a 4.250" stroke and 6.135" rod.....compression height on this piston is 1.520"....
http://kb-silvolite.com/performance....tails&P_id=121
Pay no attention to the guys who spout off about long rods. Read and heed what Iskenderian says. Scroll down to Tech Tip 2005 on this page....
http://www.iskycams.com/techtips.php

Add up the stack of parts you will use, for example, piston with a 1.520" compression height, rod with a 6.135" length and crank with a 2.125" radius (4.250" stroke). The sum of these parts is 9.780". Stock block deck height (nominal) of a BBC is 9.800", so if you were going to use this list of parts, you would want the shop to cut the block deck height to 9.790"/9.795" to leave a piston deck height of 0.010"/0.015", so that using a nominal 0.040" gasket, your squish would be at 0.050"/0.055".

Cutting the block decks to square with the centerline of the main bearing bore will not only insure that static compression ratio will be the same from one end of the block to the other, but will also insure that the heads sit squarely on the block and thus the intake manifold will sit squarely on the heads.
Also, as noted, you will properly set the squish for operation on pump gas.

Last edited by techinspector1; 09-09-2009 at 03:06 AM.
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