Spark Plug Tech - Hot Rod Forum : Hotrodders Bulletin Board
Hotrodders.com -- Hot Rod Forum



Register FAQ Search Today's Posts Unanswered Posts Auto Escrow Insurance Auto Loans
Hot Rod Forum : Hotrodders Bulletin Board > Tech Help> Engine
User Name
Password
lost password?   |   register now

Reply
 
LinkBack Thread Tools
  #1 (permalink)  
Old 03-30-2005, 01:21 PM
ChevelleSS_LS6's Avatar
Jeep XJ and a Javelin
 
Last wiki edit: Compression test
Last journal entry: August 9, part III
Last photo:
Join Date: Dec 2001
Location: Grand Rapids, Michigan
Age: 28
Posts: 1,610
Wiki Edits: 7

Thanks: 3
Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts
Spark Plug Tech

I am just wondering what kind of plugs/ignition parts you use in your car/truck/lawn mower/etc. and how well they work, and what didn't.

1993 Saturn 1.9 twincam (LLO):
AC Delco Rapidfire: fouled quickly, 120,000 miles. Better response not unlike adding a KN drop-in filter.
AC Plainjane: didn't foul as quickly as the rapidfire plugs. Adding new OEM plug wires helped a lot, I didn't run the rapidfires with new wires, they probably wouldn't have fouled with a good set of wires.

1974 AMC 360:
AC plainjane "lasts about 6k miles" according to my dad, original owner of the car.
Champions are better plugs. Has Standard (as in the parts company) Electronic Ignition, coil, etc. on it. Points have been gone off that thing for ages.

2000 GM 3400v6:
OEM: I think it's original with 124,500 miles on it, even plugs. I did not check plugs since I have heard that the wire boots can pull off, and then I'd be screwed. I plan on getting OEM wires and rapidfires for this, since I have heard good about the rapidfires.

1971-3 Briggs 8hp engine:
Autolite plug works well, ancient Champion that came with it has spark but it won't start!? Stock ignition.

    Advertisement
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Sponsored Links
Advertisement
 
  #2 (permalink)  
Old 03-30-2005, 03:17 PM
johnsongrass1's Avatar
Race it, Don't rice it!
 
Last photo:
Join Date: Jul 2002
Location: Columbia, Mo
Age: 38
Posts: 4,080
Wiki Edits: 0

Thanks: 0
Thanked 10 Times in 10 Posts
Autolight (pronounced "Ought to light") But they don't.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
  #3 (permalink)  
Old 03-30-2005, 03:20 PM
bracketeer's Avatar
489 Lemans
 

Last journal entry: Street Legal
Last photo:
Join Date: Dec 2004
Location: Courtenay, BC, CehNehDeh
Age: 55
Posts: 2,139
Wiki Edits: 0

Thanks: 0
Thanked 1 Time in 1 Post
plugs

I use Accel U grooves in my race cars.

I tried champion in my Harley but they didn't stand up to the vibration.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
  #4 (permalink)  
Old 03-30-2005, 03:40 PM
Docs91RS's Avatar
Member
 
Join Date: May 2004
Location: Chicago,IL.
Age: 49
Posts: 130
Wiki Edits: 0

Thanks: 0
Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts
Ive had good luck with NGK and Bosch depending on the application. My 383 in my Camaro loves the NGK race plugs and my Nissan daily driver uses the Bosch. If your plugs foul too quickly and your ignition system is in good condition then get a one step hotter plug.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
  #5 (permalink)  
Old 03-30-2005, 03:50 PM
Derkyb's Avatar
Member
 
Last photo:
Join Date: Jan 2005
Location: okc, ok
Age: 39
Posts: 229
Wiki Edits: 0

Thanks: 0
Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts
AC Delco- Chevrolet
Autolite- Ford
Champion-Dodge/Chrysler

I installed a set of autolites in my chevy truck and after about 50mi it started to run like crap. I thought I had a burnt wire so i replaced the wires, and after hours of troubleshootin I thought it may have been a burnt valve. When I called my uncle to help tear the engine down I found he had the same problem with a set of autolites. Replaced the plugs and it ran like a champ.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
  #6 (permalink)  
Old 03-30-2005, 09:14 PM
Member
 
Join Date: Nov 2003
Posts: 75
Wiki Edits: 0

Thanks: 0
Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts
Quote:
Originally Posted by Docs91RS
Ive had good luck with NGK and Bosch depending on the application. My 383 in my Camaro loves the NGK race plugs and my Nissan daily driver uses the Bosch. If your plugs foul too quickly and your ignition system is in good condition then get a one step hotter plug.

This question has probably been answered several times on here, but I happened to come across this quote while browsing. What does it mean to get a "hotter" plug? Does that mean the plug emits a hotter spark? Is the plug more able to ignite inside a hotter chamber? How do I tell the guy at Auto Zone to get me a set of hotter plugs? All they want to know is what year, make, model and engine size I have, but that never works with a 350 in an S10 . Like I said, I'm sure this issue has been addressed before, I just thought I'd ask since this was a fresh thread going.
Thanks,
Matt
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
  #7 (permalink)  
Old 03-31-2005, 12:43 AM
SAATR's Avatar
Member
 
Last wiki edit: Header design
Last journal entry: And still more pics...
Last photo:
Join Date: Dec 2003
Location: Shreveport, LA
Age: 29
Posts: 247
Wiki Edits: 1

Thanks: 0
Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts
It literally refers to the temperature that the plug electrode reachs during operation. For example an AC Delco R44TS has the plug electrode more recessed into the metal threaded part of the plug than an AC Delco R45TS, which is a hotter plug. The electrode gets hotter because it is more exposed to the combustion chamber and it conducts and retains heat from the head better than the colder plug. Too hot a plug and you'll get preignition and melted electrodes, too cold and the plug won't get hot enough to self clean and will foul out faster. The dudes at Autozone are just getting you the plug for a stock vehicle with a stock engine that has a stock cam, stock pistons, stock heads, stock compression, etc, which may or may not work with your particular combo. Most 350's require R43TS plugs. If they're fouling out, step up a heat range to an R44, if they're melting step down to an R42, and so on and so forth till you find what is right for your combo. Just be sure to get the right thread reach and seat type or you will have some serious problems. Just my .02.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
  #8 (permalink)  
Old 03-31-2005, 02:50 AM
Docs91RS's Avatar
Member
 
Join Date: May 2004
Location: Chicago,IL.
Age: 49
Posts: 130
Wiki Edits: 0

Thanks: 0
Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts
^what he said

Last edited by Docs91RS; 03-31-2005 at 03:01 AM.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
  #9 (permalink)  
Old 03-31-2005, 06:09 AM
Hotrodders.com Moderator
 

Last journal entry: PICTURE TEST
Last photo:
Join Date: Jan 2004
Location: york pa
Age: 52
Posts: 2,795
Wiki Edits: 0

Thanks: 0
Thanked 1 Time in 1 Post
Plugs

I'll add a little more to the hottter plug question...

A plug needs to reach a certin temp to be self cleaning. Most places i have seen say 750/800 degrees some have it a little higher at 900 deg. This really is just a number to us motor heads because we have no way of testing a plug to see how hot it is getting!!!! A change of one heat range in a plug is about 70/120 degrees. You always want to run as cold of a plug as you can and keep the plugs self cleaning.....

The colder plugs have a shorter electrode, moving them closer to the coolant passages in the heads and that is why they are considered a colder plug.... The plug cools quicker, runs colder because it is closer to the coolant....

Keith
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
  #10 (permalink)  
Old 03-31-2005, 06:15 AM
Silentlion_69's Avatar
Duck Tape & WD 40
 

Last journal entry: No more Vehicle
Last photo:
Join Date: Nov 2003
Location: Lagrange Maine
Age: 26
Posts: 278
Wiki Edits: 0

Thanks: 0
Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts
Hey Chevelle, I had an old snowblower that the plug had spark but it wouldn't start, It ran fine with a new spark plug, turned out that the spark plug wouldn't fire under pressure.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
  #11 (permalink)  
Old 03-31-2005, 03:20 PM
ChevelleSS_LS6's Avatar
Jeep XJ and a Javelin
 
Last wiki edit: Compression test
Last journal entry: August 9, part III
Last photo:
Join Date: Dec 2001
Location: Grand Rapids, Michigan
Age: 28
Posts: 1,610
Wiki Edits: 7

Thanks: 3
Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts
Quote:
Originally Posted by Silentlion_69
Hey Chevelle, I had an old snowblower that the plug had spark but it wouldn't start, It ran fine with a new spark plug, turned out that the spark plug wouldn't fire under pressure.
/\must be the same problem I had.

.........
One reason I noticed nobody mentioned why plugs foul quickly (as said about the ones I ran in the Saturn I had) is due to worn out plug wires, and other ignition components.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
  #12 (permalink)  
Old 03-31-2005, 04:47 PM
Member
 
Join Date: Nov 2003
Posts: 75
Wiki Edits: 0

Thanks: 0
Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts
Quote:
Originally Posted by SAATR
It literally refers to the temperature that the plug electrode reachs during operation. For example an AC Delco R44TS has the plug electrode more recessed into the metal threaded part of the plug than an AC Delco R45TS, which is a hotter plug. The electrode gets hotter because it is more exposed to the combustion chamber and it conducts and retains heat from the head better than the colder plug. Too hot a plug and you'll get preignition and melted electrodes, too cold and the plug won't get hot enough to self clean and will foul out faster. The dudes at Autozone are just getting you the plug for a stock vehicle with a stock engine that has a stock cam, stock pistons, stock heads, stock compression, etc, which may or may not work with your particular combo. Most 350's require R43TS plugs. If they're fouling out, step up a heat range to an R44, if they're melting step down to an R42, and so on and so forth till you find what is right for your combo. Just be sure to get the right thread reach and seat type or you will have some serious problems. Just my .02.

With that said, how will I be able to determine the "heat range" that I need to install in my engine? I know I could always run the plugs for a while and pull them to see how the tips look, usually they're real oily since I have severe blowby. I just wonder how to tell on say a motor that I am currently building what type of plug I will need. I've been just using Accel U-groove header plugs since I have tight clearances. Also, I don't understand, unless you do all the testing yourself, how you will know the specific part number for a higher or lower heat plug. I guess you could always run head temp guages and see what the differences are, but that could get expensive. I just don't want to take chances on detonation on a motor built specifically for nitrous/street use. You say that the AC Delco R45TS is a hotter plug than the AC Delco R44TS, I assume that means the AC Delco R44TS is also hotter than the AC Delco R43TS which is what most people would receive when asking for a set of plugs for a 350. I guess my real question is how will the use of nitrous, or any form of forced induction for that matter, affect the necessary heat range of a plug? I would think that a "colder" plug would be more affective in those cases since the forced induction tends to run a motor lean (excluding fuel injected motors). Should I sacrifice the "off nitrous" situation and run a hotter plug for the around town driving or vise versa?
Thanks for the very technical response again!
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
  #13 (permalink)  
Old 03-31-2005, 04:57 PM
NXS's Avatar
NXS NXS is offline
wind & fire = guides to power
 
Last photo:
Join Date: Nov 2004
Location: Oklahoma
Posts: 1,534
Wiki Edits: 0

Thanks: 0
Thanked 1 Time in 1 Post
An AC45 is the common plug for a sbc. The AC44 would be for a small amout of nitrous or boost.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
  #14 (permalink)  
Old 03-31-2005, 05:37 PM
SAATR's Avatar
Member
 
Last wiki edit: Header design
Last journal entry: And still more pics...
Last photo:
Join Date: Dec 2003
Location: Shreveport, LA
Age: 29
Posts: 247
Wiki Edits: 1

Thanks: 0
Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts
Plug selection is really just a trial and error process at best. Every motor is different, and there really are no hard and fast rules of plug selection. There are too many variables involved to simply calculate your heat range. That said, heres a few general guidelines to follow:

Higher compression requires a colder plug
Forced induction requires a colder plug
Nitrous requires a colder plug
Leaner mixtures require a colder plug

Also plug heat ranges can vary from manufacturer to manufacturer. What works in an NGK might be too cold in a Champion, same for a Delco, Bosch, Autolite, etc. Accel plugs are none too cheap, especially the header plugs, so I can see where experimenting might get pricey for you, but that's all you really can do. As far as the nitrous plug vs. street plug goes, go with the colder plug. It's better to foul out plugs driving around town that to blow the pistons to pieces with detonation while on nitrous. You might try and find somebody around here with similar combo and see what worked best for them and go from there, but like I said, trial and error.

As far as finding the heat ranges on the Accels, I would look around on the net, at Accel's website especially, and see what they can tell you. If all else fails, I could look up the part No.'s at work for you. Just PM me if you need help.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
  #15 (permalink)  
Old 03-31-2005, 11:44 PM
Member
 
Join Date: Nov 2003
Posts: 75
Wiki Edits: 0

Thanks: 0
Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts
Quote:
Originally Posted by SAATR
Plug selection is really just a trial and error process at best. Every motor is different, and there really are no hard and fast rules of plug selection. There are too many variables involved to simply calculate your heat range. That said, heres a few general guidelines to follow:

Higher compression requires a colder plug
Forced induction requires a colder plug
Nitrous requires a colder plug
Leaner mixtures require a colder plug

Also plug heat ranges can vary from manufacturer to manufacturer. What works in an NGK might be too cold in a Champion, same for a Delco, Bosch, Autolite, etc. Accel plugs are none too cheap, especially the header plugs, so I can see where experimenting might get pricey for you, but that's all you really can do. As far as the nitrous plug vs. street plug goes, go with the colder plug. It's better to foul out plugs driving around town that to blow the pistons to pieces with detonation while on nitrous. You might try and find somebody around here with similar combo and see what worked best for them and go from there, but like I said, trial and error.

As far as finding the heat ranges on the Accels, I would look around on the net, at Accel's website especially, and see what they can tell you. If all else fails, I could look up the part No.'s at work for you. Just PM me if you need help.
Thanks for the help.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message

Recent Engine posts with photos

Quick Reply
Message:
Options

Register Now

In order to be able to post messages on the Hot Rod Forum : Hotrodders Bulletin Board forums, you must first register.
Please enter your desired user name (usually not your first and last name), your email address and other required details in the form below.
User Name:
If you do not want to register, fill this field only and the name will be used as user name for your post.
Password
Please enter a password for your user account. Note that passwords are case-sensitive.
Password:
Confirm Password:
Email Address
Please enter a valid email address for yourself.
Email Address:

Log-in

Human Verification

In order to verify that you are a human and not a spam bot, please enter the answer into the following box below based on the instructions contained in the graphic.




Currently Active Users Viewing This Thread: 1 (0 members and 1 guests)
 
Thread Tools

Posting Rules
You may post new threads
You may post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are On
Pingbacks are On
Refbacks are On


Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
Ignition system info................ poncho62 Electrical 18 10-11-2008 10:10 PM
Spark Plug brands question Francis Engine 65 07-15-2008 12:01 AM
Spark arcing outside the plug?? 85MonteSS Electrical 16 11-16-2004 10:02 PM
spark plug getting little spark 72 chevy elcamino Electrical 1 10-19-2003 04:54 PM
Weird spark plug situation?? Jim Weeks Engine 4 05-13-2002 07:32 PM


All times are GMT -6. The time now is 09:00 PM.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.7
Copyright ©2000 - 2014, vBulletin Solutions, Inc.
Search Engine Optimization by vBSEO 3.6.0 PL2
Copyright Hotrodders.com 1999 - 2012. All Rights Reserved.