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-   -   Stall converter help (http://www.hotrodders.com/forum/stall-converter-help-99315.html)

David03 09-30-2006 08:36 PM

Stall converter help
 
82 chevy c10 longbed 2wd, 350 with trick flow heads and the cheap cnc job 202 intake 160 exh, 195 intake runners, 1.6 rockers, comp cam Xe268 cam, rpm air gap intake, 600 elderbrock, msd, headers, block is a 350 replacement goodwrench with stock dished pistons, th-350 or th350c tranny with no overdrive, 3:42 with posi lock. 9-1 compression.

Times on 91 octa.
15.350 at 89 mph with .567 reaction time.( a dodge neon out ran me by 2-3 lengths here :mad: ) I dont think it was stock though.
15.287 at 90 mph with .003 reaction time.
2 other times with about same result.

Will a stall converter get me into the 14's. If so what size because this thing sux off the line.

I also have a B&M shift kit with three different stages. will this help as well.

What about high octa gas. This thing is no longer a daily driver because of gas mi so i'm not worried about that.

mechanicodell 10-27-2006 02:53 AM

Need to know tire size
 
I would suggest a 2,000. I need to know your tire size though. The only reason I don't say 3,000 is because you have not mentioned beefing up your drive. Also, you better have some serious v or z rated tires. Driving it home is a nice feeling rather than trying to load that onto something. Your time aint too bad, your truck is heavy.
As a personal favor though, try using a mixture of 3 gallons 93 or 94 octane with 2 gallons racing fuel.
Try to advance your timing about 5 degrees, these should help your time without a stall convertor. These are my opinions only.

onovakind67 10-27-2006 07:26 AM

Every converter is a 'stall' converter, some have a higher stall speed than others. B&M rates their stall speeds for 230#ft of torque, so a 9:1 engine with less low end torque will not stall as high as a stock engine. I would use at least a 3000 stall converter, a good one from folks like Coan, Continental, etc.

If you want to win drag races, get some tires for that purpose. There is no substitute for good traction, and good traction will get you better traction.

With 9:1 compression and an XE268 you sure don't need race gas, you could probably run faster on 87 or 89 octane.

hotrodf1 10-27-2006 08:08 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by onovakind67
Every converter is a 'stall' converter, some have a higher stall speed than others. B&M rates their stall speeds for 230#ft of torque, so a 9:1 engine with less low end torque will not stall as high as a stock engine. I would use at least a 3000 stall converter, a good one from folks like Coan, Continental, etc.

If you want to win drag races, get some tires for that purpose. There is no substitute for good traction, and good traction will get you better traction.

With 9:1 compression and an XE268 you sure don't need race gas, you could probably run faster on 87 or 89 octane.

I agree!!! esp. the 87 or 89 octane gas. Unless you need the detonation resistance when running high compression, you are actually giving up some by going to higher octane fuel. Reason - the higher octane stuff actually burns slower - which is the reason that you would advance the timing more with the race gas.

As I understand it, the less advance you can run the better (while acheiving optimum power - the LS1 does it with like 30 deg.) - that means the mixture is burning more "all at once" and I think that maximizes your pressure at the most opportune moment - when the piston starts traveling downward in the power cycle.

Course, if you run the 87 or 89 - I would back the timing off about 6 deg. - and then watch your MPH (not ET) and add the timing back in a little at a time (maybe 2 degrees each run). When the MPH does not increase any more - you have reached your "ideal" max timing. Back it off 2 deg. for safety and let er rip. (of course you adjust while the motor is spun up by a buddy - set the timing while its at max timing - setting using initial only can be deceiving because idle RPM can influence the "initial" setting - and watch out if you have a mech. fan.)

Have fun - be careful. :D

johnsongrass1 10-27-2006 11:17 AM

91 isn't too high and a safe bet. 89 might be slightly faster but burning a piston is even slower.

91 with a 36' max timing.


I would think you 60 foot times would impove with a Edie performer or Performer rpm.

The convertor will help get you rpm up into the range of the intake. That 268H cam is to small for the air gap.

mechanicodell 10-28-2006 01:17 AM

Stock rear?
 
Think he might snap an axle or something else with a 3000? Stock parts. He doesn't have endorsements to pay for the parts you know.
I don't want my gas to burn, I want it to explode.

onovakind67 10-28-2006 02:05 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by mechanicodell
Think he might snap an axle or something else with a 3000? Stock parts. He doesn't have endorsements to pay for the parts you know.
I don't want my gas to burn, I want it to explode.

How do you know he doesn't have endorsements?

mechanicodell 10-28-2006 02:56 AM

Test and tune
 
To start with, he went up against a different class. Dodge Neon.
He also stated he is running a 268 cam with 1.6 rockers. In all fairness he's running too high of resulting lift, negating Torque for that truck which is required in order for it to leave the line. His 0 to 60 time has got to be horrible and by the time the engine is finally going the race is over with. Now this is only my opinion from what I read. But the different class race is a sure sign of midweek racing. Hey, I don't have a race car, just a mild mannered truck, Thursday night is fine by me. Never driven a race car and don't plan on it. Though I do plan on building engines for guys like Pat Hanley running around on dirt or asphault. Since its already on post, I believe that a tightened up 700r4 would help in getting through 1st and second faster. Though tranny was not a question.

48 Dodge 10-28-2006 08:08 AM

Detonation?
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by mechanicodell
Think he might snap an axle or something else with a 3000? Stock parts. He doesn't have endorsements to pay for the parts you know.
I don't want my gas to burn, I want it to explode.

If your fuel explodes, that would be detonation. You are looking for the controlled burn that causes the rapid expansion of gasses in the chamber, not a big bang that breaks things.

onovakind67 10-28-2006 08:21 AM

How would running against a Neon negate the possibility of endorsements? If I go to Wednesday night grudge racing I have to have no sponsors?

He also stated he is running a 268 cam with 1.6 rockers. In all fairness he's running too high of resulting lift, negating Torque for that truck which is required in order for it to leave the line.

In all fairness I think you should explain how a mild 224/230 cam with 1.6 rockers is going to be lacking in torque. The physics of this are beyond me.

mechanicodell 10-29-2006 04:57 AM

Oops
 
Read it quickly, thought the cam was a Comp 268 duration with 485 lift, I did not notice Xe, I just noticed the 268. That small of a duration? what is the lift, I am curious, I do not know of what cam he has in there.

mechanicodell 10-30-2006 05:35 AM

Them cam specs?
 
Xe268H-10 would be an intake duration (advertised) 268 duration at .050 is 224. Exhaust duration advertised is 280 and at .050 exhaust is 230. This particular cam has an an intake lift with using 1.5 at 477 and an exhaust at 280 using 1.5. Him using that bump stick with 1.6 would give him a result of a lift of 508 to 509 lift on the intake and 512 on the exhaust. I hope he has some good springs in there so they don't collapse on him. my personal thought, as well that there is no horse power for him or torque. 1.5 rockers would have given him a better result on his times. Using a 2000 to 2500 stall convertor with using 1.5 would be a good choice. With the 1.6 that engine is just starting to produce at somewhere around 2300 to 2500. He is driving a heavy truck, not a light car. He could have been producing close to 375 to 400 horse out of that engine with the 1.5 and might have beaten the Dodge Neon. Yeah, as it goes he probably needs a 3000 stalll convertor to get off the line with enough oomf, though his stock drive is going to get ripped apart.
Also where might his peak horsepower be at right now? Maybe 6000 rpm? If he is lucky. Let's see what snaps when he pushes it to 7000

onovakind67 10-30-2006 08:57 AM

The Chevy S-10 is a small truck, probably weighs about 3600# with a V-8. Running 15.30 @ 90 mph tells me he is way down on power. The mph should be well over 100 easily.

The power peak of an XE268 in a 350" motor will probably be less than 5500 rpm, no need to go beyond 6K.


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