starter issues - Page 2 - Hot Rod Forum : Hotrodders Bulletin Board
Hotrodders.com -- Hot Rod Forum



Register FAQ Search Today's Posts Unanswered Posts Auto Escrow Insurance Auto Loans
Hot Rod Forum : Hotrodders Bulletin Board > Tech Help> Transmission - Rearend
User Name
Password
lost password?   |   register now

Reply
 
LinkBack Thread Tools
  #16 (permalink)  
Old 08-13-2011, 09:10 PM
pepi's Avatar
How’s that hopey-changey thing
 
Last wiki edit: Determining top dead center
Last journal entry: Quicky frame dolly
Last photo:
Join Date: Mar 2005
Location: Georgia ... USA
Posts: 1,835
Wiki Edits: 8

Thanks: 0
Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts
Sometimes you only need to put shims on one bolt, they are thin and can be cut, that will rotate the starter, You only need a paper clip thickness for clearance of the ring and starter gear..

Just to refresh, you put a 4 speed on, bell housing was change of course, but the question I have is why did you not reuse the original starter, it was working correct? Just for grins count the teeth on the starter gear, not the fly wheel. The new one and the old ones, all three, how many did you find?

One was from an auto trans and one from the manual. I do not think there is a difference in the tooth count, on the starter gear. I have never had to check that .

I do not think there is a different starter for auto and manual, he has the starter from the donor that he's got the 4 speed from. So if there is a difference it should be right in front of him to see.

    Advertisement

Last edited by pepi; 08-13-2011 at 09:15 PM.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Sponsored Links
Advertisement
 
  #17 (permalink)  
Old 08-13-2011, 09:17 PM
Registered User
 
Join Date: Aug 2011
Location: Maine
Posts: 22
Wiki Edits: 0

Thanks: 0
Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts
I tried my original starter first but none of them really worked. Have you ever heard of anyone having this much trouble with a auto to manual conversion?
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
  #18 (permalink)  
Old 08-13-2011, 09:20 PM
pepi's Avatar
How’s that hopey-changey thing
 
Last wiki edit: Determining top dead center
Last journal entry: Quicky frame dolly
Last photo:
Join Date: Mar 2005
Location: Georgia ... USA
Posts: 1,835
Wiki Edits: 8

Thanks: 0
Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts
So neither would engage the fly wheel ?
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
  #19 (permalink)  
Old 08-13-2011, 09:22 PM
pepi's Avatar
How’s that hopey-changey thing
 
Last wiki edit: Determining top dead center
Last journal entry: Quicky frame dolly
Last photo:
Join Date: Mar 2005
Location: Georgia ... USA
Posts: 1,835
Wiki Edits: 8

Thanks: 0
Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts
Both motors the same year?
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
  #20 (permalink)  
Old 08-13-2011, 09:25 PM
Registered User
 
Join Date: Aug 2011
Location: Maine
Posts: 22
Wiki Edits: 0

Thanks: 0
Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts
Thanks, what do mean by bearing retainer?
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
  #21 (permalink)  
Old 08-13-2011, 09:27 PM
Registered User
 
Join Date: Aug 2011
Location: Maine
Posts: 22
Wiki Edits: 0

Thanks: 0
Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts
No neither would fully engage and turn over the motor. NO both motors are not the same year. and both truck have crate motors so Im not sure of the year all i no is my truck has a two piece rear main and the donor truck has a one piece.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
  #22 (permalink)  
Old 08-13-2011, 09:38 PM
pepi's Avatar
How’s that hopey-changey thing
 
Last wiki edit: Determining top dead center
Last journal entry: Quicky frame dolly
Last photo:
Join Date: Mar 2005
Location: Georgia ... USA
Posts: 1,835
Wiki Edits: 8

Thanks: 0
Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts
Quote:
Originally Posted by 83 sierra classic
No neither would fully engage and turn over the motor. NO both motors are not the same year. and both truck have crate motors so Im not sure of the year all i no is my truck has a two piece rear main and the donor truck has a one piece.
Ok so the pinion gear was fully extending and not reaching the ring gear on the flywheel. That makes me think the flywheel is wrong for the motor in your truck. Not what you want to here, I am going to look up a part number be right back.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
  #23 (permalink)  
Old 08-13-2011, 09:40 PM
Registered User
 
Join Date: Aug 2011
Location: Maine
Posts: 22
Wiki Edits: 0

Thanks: 0
Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts
Also the bellhousing for the tranni is a truck housing and was on the donor truck and running up until I took it out. It bolted right up to my truck wihout a problem.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
  #24 (permalink)  
Old 08-13-2011, 09:43 PM
Registered User
 
Join Date: Aug 2011
Location: Maine
Posts: 22
Wiki Edits: 0

Thanks: 0
Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts
Quote:
Originally Posted by pepi
Ok so the pinion gear was fully extending and not reaching the ring gear on the flywheel. That makes me think the flywheel is wrong for the motor in your truck. Not what you want to here, I am going to look up a part number be right back.

NO it was reaching the ring gear but was and still is chattering and barely turning the engine over. Not even turning enough to start. and then when I stop trying to start the truck and go underneath to check its stuck in the flywheel and dosen't retract.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
  #25 (permalink)  
Old 08-13-2011, 09:49 PM
Bryan59EC's Avatar
Car? Truck? Who Cares
 

Last journal entry: First week of December
Last photo:
Join Date: Jun 2006
Location: San Antonio, Texas
Age: 54
Posts: 2,369
Wiki Edits: 0

Thanks: 2
Thanked 27 Times in 22 Posts
Bearing retainer---
When you mention Muncie 4 spd----I think of a car trans.
But in your defense---I have a Muncie in my 79 C-10----not a car trans.
It's that big ol' heavy truck granny trans.
Bearing retainer on the truck trans is larger than on a car trans.
That is the piece that bolts onto the front of the trans and looks kind of like a teepee---that the input shaft goes thru and the throwout bearing slides on.


As for flywheels-----not sure but I thought the one piece seal motors and the 2 piece seal motors used different flywheels .

They certainly do on the big block motors.

Starters are different----I have 2 73 Malibus----one AT and one a 3 spd manual----different starters

I would double check everything. When I went from an AT to a manual in my 79, waaaay back in 86, I don't recall running into any issues other than the trans crossmember (different on AT vs Manual) and installing a center bearing crossmember for my driveshaft. That was kind of a pain as that crossmember also supports the back of the cab. AND---my AT starter would not work.

Another option would be an aftermarket hi torque mini starter.
I have one in my 59 (454 and a 5 spd) and tht thing spins the motor just great----heat does not affect it, and it is easy to disconnect wiring and remove. The same cannot be said for a stock GM starter.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
  #26 (permalink)  
Old 08-13-2011, 09:53 PM
pepi's Avatar
How’s that hopey-changey thing
 
Last wiki edit: Determining top dead center
Last journal entry: Quicky frame dolly
Last photo:
Join Date: Mar 2005
Location: Georgia ... USA
Posts: 1,835
Wiki Edits: 8

Thanks: 0
Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts
http://www.summitracing.com/compare.aspx

take a close look at these two, one is for internal and the other is for an external balanced motor, are both motors balanced the same? The fly wheels look like one is thicker then the other, that could effect the way the fly wheel hangs off the back of the crank, and that would effect the ring gear placement to the starter.

You should take the number off the two blocks and see what you have, that number will be passenger side front where the head meets the block. This is sounding more and more like a mismatch of parts..
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
  #27 (permalink)  
Old 08-13-2011, 09:54 PM
Registered User
 
Join Date: Aug 2011
Location: Maine
Posts: 22
Wiki Edits: 0

Thanks: 0
Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts
Ok thanks. Yeah the flywheels are different which I mentioned earlier in my postings. I got the correct flywheel from a chevy van same era as my truck with a two peice seal. My crankshaft is externally balanced. The donor truck was newer and internally balanced and the crankshaft hole diameters are different.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
  #28 (permalink)  
Old 08-13-2011, 10:00 PM
Registered User
 
Join Date: Aug 2011
Location: Maine
Posts: 22
Wiki Edits: 0

Thanks: 0
Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts
Thank bryan and pepi. I really appreciate the help. Everyone seems to be confirming that everyhing SHOULD work. I'll have to do some more research and make sure I'm getting the right starter.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
  #29 (permalink)  
Old 08-13-2011, 10:02 PM
Registered User
 
Join Date: Aug 2011
Location: Maine
Posts: 22
Wiki Edits: 0

Thanks: 0
Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts
Quote:
Originally Posted by pepi
http://www.summitracing.com/compare.aspx

take a close look at these two, one is for internal and the other is for an external balanced motor, are both motors balanced the same? The fly wheels look like one is thicker then the other, that could effect the way the fly wheel hangs off the back of the crank, and that would effect the ring gear placement to the starter.

You should take the number off the two blocks and see what you have, that number will be passenger side front where the head meets the block. This is sounding more and more like a mismatch of parts..
What confuses me is I didn't think the wrong flywheel could bolt up to the wrong engine???
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
  #30 (permalink)  
Old 08-13-2011, 10:06 PM
pepi's Avatar
How’s that hopey-changey thing
 
Last wiki edit: Determining top dead center
Last journal entry: Quicky frame dolly
Last photo:
Join Date: Mar 2005
Location: Georgia ... USA
Posts: 1,835
Wiki Edits: 8

Thanks: 0
Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts
Quote:
Originally Posted by 83 sierra classic
NO it was reaching the ring gear but was and still is chattering and barely turning the engine over. Not even turning enough to start. and then when I stop trying to start the truck and go underneath to check its stuck in the flywheel and dosen't retract.

This is the original starter you are talking about here and you can not shim it out far enough to correct the problem, then my guess is that you will need 153 tooth flywheel.

http://www.summitracing.com/parts/SUM-700186/



Sounds to me it is not hitting home and just hanging and jammed, how much of the starter pinion is actually engage .. 1/4 1/2

it was reaching the ring gear but was and still is chattering and barely turning the engine over

Got to go need to get up a 530, I will check back tomorrow, we have certainly found some things to look into . My money in on the flywheel.

Last edited by pepi; 08-13-2011 at 10:20 PM.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message

Recent Transmission - Rearend posts with photos

Quick Reply
Message:
Options

Register Now

In order to be able to post messages on the Hot Rod Forum : Hotrodders Bulletin Board forums, you must first register.
Please enter your desired user name (usually not your first and last name), your email address and other required details in the form below.
User Name:
Password
Please enter a password for your user account. Note that passwords are case-sensitive.
Password:
Confirm Password:
Email Address
Please enter a valid email address for yourself.
Email Address:

Log-in

Human Verification

In order to verify that you are a human and not a spam bot, please enter the answer into the following box below based on the instructions contained in the graphic.




Currently Active Users Viewing This Thread: 1 (0 members and 1 guests)
 
Thread Tools

Posting Rules
You may post new threads
You may post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are On
Pingbacks are On
Refbacks are On


Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
starter issues mkjarobinson Engine 2 06-16-2008 09:40 AM
Starter issues........ muzzfactor Engine 20 06-19-2007 06:05 PM
starter issues ajh86 Engine 4 01-10-2007 11:52 PM
starter issues twisted91 Electrical 4 08-07-2006 01:06 AM
Some Starter Issues MrBBonz Engine 3 05-04-2005 09:44 AM


All times are GMT -6. The time now is 11:56 AM.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.7
Copyright ©2000 - 2014, vBulletin Solutions, Inc.
Search Engine Optimization by vBSEO 3.6.0 PL2
Copyright Hotrodders.com 1999 - 2012. All Rights Reserved.