Starting on a project - 30 highboy - Hot Rod Forum : Hotrodders Bulletin Board
Hotrodders.com -- Hot Rod Forum



Register FAQ Search Today's Posts Unanswered Posts Auto Escrow Insurance Auto Loans
Hot Rod Forum : Hotrodders Bulletin Board > Tech Help> Hotrodding Basics
User Name
Password
lost password?   |   register now

Reply
 
LinkBack Thread Tools
  #1 (permalink)  
Old 12-17-2012, 04:54 AM
Registered User
 

Last journal entry: Better late than never
Last photo:
Join Date: Feb 2006
Location: Palm Beach, FL
Posts: 237
Wiki Edits: 0

Thanks: 0
Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts
Starting on a project - 30 highboy

So, I am not sure this is the right place to post this but here goes.

I purchased a very original 1930 Model A (see photos) a couple of months ago with intentions of turning it into a highboy, my preferred style of hotrod. Now, I should stress that although I have tinkered with cars for 25 years and am comfortable pulling/rebuilding engines etc I have never 'built' a rod. The car has sat in the workshop these past two months whilst I try to decide on whether to tackle it or simply sell it and buy one that is done. Trouble with that is I haven't seen many I truly like and the couple I have are VERY expensive, say 70k!

I am looking for an old school rod...no billet/expensive paint, basically as it would have looked if built 30-40 years ago. I am not looking for a rat rod, just an old school rod.

In case it helps, I have a '55 264 nailhead sitting in the workshop and can use that.

A couple of images that show the type of thing I am after:

http://image.rodandcustommagazine.co...ghboy+side.jpg

http://image.streetrodderweb.com/f/f...front_left.jpg

So, I guess the big question is this. If I am NOT looking for a show queen but a simple but solid rod I can drive and have fund in (isn't that what they were always for?!) how big a job is this?

I know that is a big question but specifically, how much work do I NEED to do to the frame? Do I NEED to switch the frame for a 32 which seems to be 'the' way to go can I simply use the existing frame (boxed). How do I achieve the highboy rake/stance using the existing body/frame? Does this require cutting/welding/fabrication or something simpler? Will simply removing the fenders give me something like the look I am after?

Based upon the images of my ideal look I suspect the biggest job (unless I am about to hear of a dozen others!) is to chop the roof. Looking at the image I am guessing it needs to come down maybe 4-5 inches?

That and getting the drivetrain into the frame appear to be THE big jobs or am underestimating this?

Any feedback will be much appreciated.

I will post back as I move forward as I am sure there are others out there that don't have tons of experience in building a rod but want to do so.

Paul
Attached Thumbnails
Click image for larger version

Name:	IMG_0082.JPG
Views:	121
Size:	980.4 KB
ID:	69854   Click image for larger version

Name:	IMG_0076.JPG
Views:	94
Size:	1.02 MB
ID:	69855  

    Advertisement
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Sponsored Links
Advertisement
 
  #2 (permalink)  
Old 12-17-2012, 05:56 AM
Richiehd's Avatar
JS-70
 
Last photo:
Join Date: Jun 2011
Location: Jupiter FL
Posts: 859
Wiki Edits: 0

Thanks: 176
Thanked 59 Times in 52 Posts
Wow! looks like a nice car. I am a die hard hotrodder from way back. Had a Model A of my own many years ago. I just have to tell you, it would be a crime to cut that car up. I know some guys will blast me here, but its not like you found this car chopped up in a barn or something. This looks like a nice easy restoration project for someone.. Go buy a Duece frame and glass body if you want a nice highboy!
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
  #3 (permalink)  
Old 12-17-2012, 07:03 AM
Registered User
 

Last journal entry: Better late than never
Last photo:
Join Date: Feb 2006
Location: Palm Beach, FL
Posts: 237
Wiki Edits: 0

Thanks: 0
Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts
Quote:
Originally Posted by Richiehd View Post
Wow! looks like a nice car. I am a die hard hotrodder from way back. Had a Model A of my own many years ago. I just have to tell you, it would be a crime to cut that car up. I know some guys will blast me here, but its not like you found this car chopped up in a barn or something. This looks like a nice easy restoration project for someone.. Go buy a Duece frame and glass body if you want a nice highboy!
Richiehd, I wouldn't blast you. Everyone is entitled to their opinion and I respect yours. Sorry but glass doesn't do it for me. Be it this car or another, steel is the way I want to go.

The car is nice, I will agree. There are many of them in the $10k-$12k range on eBay so I don't feel like I am cutting up an endangered species but again I understand many will disagree.

Paul
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
  #4 (permalink)  
Old 12-17-2012, 07:21 AM
Registered User
 
Last wiki edit: General Motors transmissions Last photo:
Join Date: Mar 2006
Location: near Yellowstone park
Posts: 4,378
Wiki Edits: 27

Thanks: 12
Thanked 266 Times in 248 Posts
deuce frame ?

If you are going for a highboy, a deuce frame looks best and they make them with the pinched front rails. narrowed to better fit the model A body. It is your choice, When I was 13 or 14 I used to stop and lust after the 2 chopped and channeled A coupes in front of the Gm dealership in town. built by a couple guys that worked in the shop. One metallic red and one metallic blue, one with a caddy and one with and olds, I put an olds in my first T bucket and my brother put a Caddy in his. When we built the olds powered 31 chrysler roadster we channeled it. To us, channeled meant YOU BUILT it. The roadster would be called a rat rod today, It didn't get the bullet holes hammered out or painted, we just started driving and racing it. A high boy meant you just unbolted parts and thru them away. That was our opinion. I have already notched the 31 nash roadster for channeling when I put the steel sub-structure in replacing the wood., My son has gathered up a lot of old steel, he has the quarters and cowls from some unknown makes, and a couple of touring cars. Old doors are hard to find. this winters project is doors for the nash.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
  #5 (permalink)  
Old 12-17-2012, 07:48 AM
Registered User
 

Last journal entry: Better late than never
Last photo:
Join Date: Feb 2006
Location: Palm Beach, FL
Posts: 237
Wiki Edits: 0

Thanks: 0
Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts
timothal thanks for the feedback.

To be honest I am less looking to spend countless hours making the rod MINE and more trying to understand the workload required to achieve a simple, old school highboy look. From your comment above it would almost appear that a highboy is easier than some, consisting of primarily removing parts and having the right stance.

I dont feel the need to do more than is necessary. I am happy to spend time installing the drivetrain etc but am clueless when it comes to what is NEEDED to be done to the frame. Needed is the main word...

I know many opt for the 32 frame but are there examples of a 30 highboy with original frame. Does it looks THAT different or worse with the standard frame? In the 50s and 60s I would imagine there were countless rods running around with original frame...

I know forums can be a difficult place to articulate things sometimes and maybe this is one of those times. Not sure I am getting across what I meant to.

Paul
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
  #6 (permalink)  
Old 12-17-2012, 08:54 AM
dinger's Avatar
Hotrodders.com Moderator
 
Last wiki edit: Health and safety in the shop or garage
Last journal entry: 36 Ford painting
Last photo:
Join Date: Jan 2002
Location: Visalia, Ca.
Age: 61
Posts: 2,711
Wiki Edits: 1

Thanks: 104
Thanked 111 Times in 77 Posts
Deuce (a member here) builds a nice car and has a ton of photos in his journal.
Hot Rod Photo Journal - Deuce's Journal

There's a ton of info here, do a search. Boxing the frame is a must, there's a lot of info for available cross-over parts to use for the old school look.

Also, check out the HAMB site, old school guys, a bit cliquish but if they like your project, they can be helpful. Lots of info there also.

Hokey *** Message Board - THE H.A.M.B.

Good luck with your project, I hope that you build the car and make it your "own". You have a good start, that's a beautiful car to start a project. And I wouldn't worry too much about chopping up an original, Henry made a gazillion of those cars and you certainly will not create a shortage. Keep us posted, please! Dan
__________________
"When I was younger, I could remember anything, whether it had happened or not." - Mark Twain
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
  #7 (permalink)  
Old 12-17-2012, 09:25 AM
Irelands child's Avatar
Registered User
 
Last wiki edit: Ford engine specifications Last photo:
Join Date: Jan 2005
Location: Upstate New York
Posts: 4,931
Wiki Edits: 8

Thanks: 15
Thanked 214 Times in 193 Posts
I, too would have a hard time cutting up a nice car like that, but - it is yours to do as you wish.

Time - lots. And that's just for planning on where you want to be when done.

Building it - a heluva lot - especially if you have never done a ground up build. Once that body comes off, the interior out, you may find that there was some body work that covered a multitude of rust pain.

Budget - it WILL cost in the realm of $30,000 and most likely more by the time you get a reliable engine, transmission, differential, brakes, gas tank, new interior, gauges, cooling system, boxed or replacement frame, exhaust system wheels, tires, paint etc, etc, etc. And then there are the changes you decide are better then your first idea(s). If anyone tells you it's different then this - they are dead wrong. Especially for a newbie.

This '31 of mine - well up in cost and I did everything but the upholstery:

Dave W
__________________
Irelands child
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
  #8 (permalink)  
Old 12-17-2012, 09:49 AM
Registered User
 

Last journal entry: Better late than never
Last photo:
Join Date: Feb 2006
Location: Palm Beach, FL
Posts: 237
Wiki Edits: 0

Thanks: 0
Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts
Thanks guys, food for thought. None the wiser as far as utilizing the current frame but will certainly look at the HAMB to see if I can get anything there.

Totally agree that a lot of time is likely involved here although I am sure the 'it will cost in the realm of 30k' is influenced to a large extent on specs etc but I am not fooling myself that this can be done for 10k. To be honest cost is less of an issue than time... again I suspect the required investment in terms of both time and cost varies massively depending on objective.

I will indeed perform more searches. I spent an hour searching this morning and came up empty handed as far as converting original to highboy.

Thanks again for all input, appreciated.

Paul
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
  #9 (permalink)  
Old 12-17-2012, 01:18 PM
studeelover's Avatar
Member
 
Last photo:
Join Date: Jul 2003
Location: Chilliwack, B.C.
Posts: 37
Wiki Edits: 0

Thanks: 4
Thanked 4 Times in 4 Posts
One of my bookmarks.

This has some good information.


Hot Rod Model A build
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
  #10 (permalink)  
Old 12-17-2012, 01:47 PM
techinspector1's Avatar
Senior Curmudgeon
 
Last wiki edit: DynoSim combinations Last photo:
Join Date: Oct 2005
Location: Hemet, California, USA
Age: 72
Posts: 13,082
Wiki Edits: 326

Thanks: 775
Thanked 1,057 Times in 879 Posts
Quote:
Originally Posted by Richiehd View Post
Wow! looks like a nice car. I am a die hard hotrodder from way back. Had a Model A of my own many years ago. I just have to tell you, it would be a crime to cut that car up. I know some guys will blast me here, but its not like you found this car chopped up in a barn or something. This looks like a nice easy restoration project for someone.. Go buy a Duece frame and glass body if you want a nice highboy!
Times 2, I hate chopped tops anyway. Monkey see, monkey do.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
The Following User Says Thank You to techinspector1 For This Useful Post:
Richiehd (12-17-2012)
  #11 (permalink)  
Old 12-17-2012, 02:40 PM
Registered User
 

Last journal entry: Better late than never
Last photo:
Join Date: Feb 2006
Location: Palm Beach, FL
Posts: 237
Wiki Edits: 0

Thanks: 0
Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts
Quote:
Originally Posted by studeelover View Post
This has some good information.

Hot Rod Model A build
Thanks, a useful reply. I will check that site out.

At the risk of, as an earlier poster said...being blasted, this thread was to try to understand the scale of the project and steps required rather than start a debate on whether I should use this car or buy a new body.

Taste is obviously very subjective and despite some posters stating a preference for a new frame and glass body it is most decidedly NOT something that appeals to me. As we used to say back in the UK, it just isn't my cup of tea.

On the topic of chopped tops, I do agree that a large chop is not, purely in my opinion, something I want but a 3'ish(?) inch reduction is probably what was shown in the image I posted this morning (repeated below) and so IS something I would consider.

http://image.rodandcustommagazine.co...ghboy+side.jpg

Thanks again to all those that provided relevant input. I will be checking the links provided.

Paul
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
  #12 (permalink)  
Old 12-17-2012, 03:02 PM
Registered User
 
Last wiki edit: General Motors transmissions Last photo:
Join Date: Mar 2006
Location: near Yellowstone park
Posts: 4,378
Wiki Edits: 27

Thanks: 12
Thanked 266 Times in 248 Posts
classic highboy

A friend of mine's son. (I am old enough that some of my old buddies kids are now into building cars) had me stop by at his project A, It was a drivable A coupe like yours that needed restoration, after crunching the numbers, he removed the body and sold everything else except radiator, grill shell and hood. He then bought another A frame that had been stripped of running board and fender brackets, ready to box. He said selling a complete running chassis brought more money than trying to piece out the things he wasn.t going to use. Next locate a dropped 40's ford front suspension pieces , spring over axle pieces, an 8 in maverick- comet rear are cheap. then decide on the engine and trans you are going to run. I have a 401-or 425 nailhead ( casting numbers are the same ) I just haven't decided which project to put it in. I had a nailhead in my willys years ago, and put a 401 in my 56 cameo years ago. It's either hard to find old parts or expensive to buy new pieces to run something other than an old dyna-flo trans.

Last edited by timothale; 12-17-2012 at 03:09 PM.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
  #13 (permalink)  
Old 12-17-2012, 03:06 PM
Irelands child's Avatar
Registered User
 
Last wiki edit: Ford engine specifications Last photo:
Join Date: Jan 2005
Location: Upstate New York
Posts: 4,931
Wiki Edits: 8

Thanks: 15
Thanked 214 Times in 193 Posts
Quote:
Originally Posted by studeelover View Post
This has some good information.


Hot Rod Model A build
That looks like a decent buildup after I did a quick look through.

There are a couple of statements the author made that tell me he needed to do some additional homework before and during his build.

Handful to drive - huh! Why? I'm at well over 300Hp and not a bit difficult to handle at road speed and twisty roads (Upstate NY has them) and not a bit squirrely at full throttle acceleration.

Noise, vibration and harshness. Again, why? Yeah, I'll agree to some noise with my '31. Open hood, roadster with and without a top, mufflers contribute. Vibration and harshness on a properly built chassis are not necessary. Yep, I have IFS, but even a solid front axle work well if the correct springs and shocks are used. Coil over rears are probably the best way to alleviate much coming from that end.

Paul - that's what I meant in my first post about doing lots of planning. Get it right, the car wont be a chore and a physical pain to drive and enjoy.

Dave W
__________________
Irelands child
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
  #14 (permalink)  
Old 12-17-2012, 03:39 PM
Registered User
 
Last wiki edit: General Motors transmissions Last photo:
Join Date: Mar 2006
Location: near Yellowstone park
Posts: 4,378
Wiki Edits: 27

Thanks: 12
Thanked 266 Times in 248 Posts
more input

on the hot rod model A build , My 2 cents worth, I don't like the ford biscuit style front motor mounts. they can generate some clutch chatter from the engine moving, on a ford flathead with an enclosed drive line, the engine trans and drive shaft were all bolted solid together, No movement. The 40's ford drum brakes he used on the front are not the best. If you have to rebuild the brakes go to the hamb and check out how to use early 50's F1 or lincoln brakes., or later chevy 12 in rear wagon drum brakes or just go to front disc's. but as you have read so far, lots of different opinions on what to do..... JUST DO IT YOUR WAY . and good luck.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
  #15 (permalink)  
Old 12-17-2012, 03:53 PM
Registered User
 

Last journal entry: Better late than never
Last photo:
Join Date: Feb 2006
Location: Palm Beach, FL
Posts: 237
Wiki Edits: 0

Thanks: 0
Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts
Quote:
Originally Posted by Irelands child View Post
That looks like a decent buildup after I did a quick look through.

There are a couple of statements the author made that tell me he needed to do some additional homework before and during his build.

Handful to drive - huh! Why? I'm at well over 300Hp and not a bit difficult to handle at road speed and twisty roads (Upstate NY has them) and not a bit squirrely at full throttle acceleration.

Noise, vibration and harshness. Again, why? Yeah, I'll agree to some noise with my '31. Open hood, roadster with and without a top, mufflers contribute. Vibration and harshness on a properly built chassis are not necessary. Yep, I have IFS, but even a solid front axle work well if the correct springs and shocks are used. Coil over rears are probably the best way to alleviate much coming from that end.

Paul - that's what I meant in my first post about doing lots of planning. Get it right, the car wont be a chore and a physical pain to drive and enjoy.

Dave W
Dave

Please don't take my most recent post as a jab, it wasn't mean to be one. I do appreciate every post made in this thread. I totally agree that planning is required and lots of it. I have also spent some time perusing a solid book (How to Build a Traditional Ford Hot Rod) which is providing more answers, AND questions.

The more research I am doing (and will continue to do) the more I am actually coming to the conclusion that I might sidestep the Buick nailhead and instead keep the banger. Cant get more old school than the original engine huh? It (keeping the banger) wasn't even something I had considered. Would appear to simply things a tad.

As for the whole chop/no-chop discussion, i have spent the last while looking at unchopped A's and have to admit, I am wavering...!

Paul
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message

Recent Hotrodding Basics posts with photos

Quick Reply
Message:
Options

Register Now

In order to be able to post messages on the Hot Rod Forum : Hotrodders Bulletin Board forums, you must first register.
Please enter your desired user name (usually not your first and last name), your email address and other required details in the form below.
User Name:
Password
Please enter a password for your user account. Note that passwords are case-sensitive.
Password:
Confirm Password:
Email Address
Please enter a valid email address for yourself.
Email Address:

Log-in

Human Verification

In order to verify that you are a human and not a spam bot, please enter the answer into the following box below based on the instructions contained in the graphic.




Currently Active Users Viewing This Thread: 1 (0 members and 1 guests)
 
Thread Tools

Posting Rules
You may post new threads
You may post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are On
Pingbacks are On
Refbacks are On


Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
starting new project josiecogburn Introduce Yourself 6 09-26-2012 05:10 PM
New project starting soon!!!!!!!! NEW INTERIORS Hotrodders' Lounge 33 11-04-2008 07:18 PM
Starting a new project PackratMT Introduce Yourself 3 08-17-2008 04:55 PM
starting my first project. popman886 Introduce Yourself 7 03-19-2008 03:23 PM
just starting a project willysboy Suspension - Brakes - Steering 4 11-04-2003 09:36 PM


All times are GMT -6. The time now is 09:57 AM.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.7
Copyright ©2000 - 2014, vBulletin Solutions, Inc.
Search Engine Optimization by vBSEO 3.6.0 PL2
Copyright Hotrodders.com 1999 - 2012. All Rights Reserved.