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  #16 (permalink)  
Old 10-19-2004, 08:06 AM
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A) When you tried to run the welder, was it set at 110 or 220?

B) If you used the 220 setting, did you have 220 wiring to the welder plug...did you have a red wire, a black wire, a white wire and an uninsulated wire to the plug?

C) If you were trying to run at 220 are you coming off a 220 breaker in your box (basically just two normal breakers hooked in tandem)? What is the amperage of the 220 breaker and what size wiring are you using to your plug? Also, how much amperage do you have running into your main fuse box and what is the rating on the main fuse (breaker)?

D) If you were trying 220, does the plug wire coming out of your welder and going into the plug have 4 wires (one wire to the blue neutral on our welder, one to the green/yellow ground, and two live conductors connected to two brown wires in you welder?

E) If you had the welder set at 110 for your fatal test run, what size breaker are you running from in your fuse box and what size wire do you have from your fuse box to the plug?

F) If you were set at 110, how were you wired from your welder to your plug?

Again, pics would help - and a detailed description of how your breaker box and your wiring is set up (sizes etc.).

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  #17 (permalink)  
Old 10-19-2004, 05:51 PM
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110

110 volt ... blue, brown and yellow/green wires ... into a plug.. and then into an extension cord with a surge protector on it.

I'll have to look at the breaker etc
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Old 10-19-2004, 06:09 PM
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Are you using one of those surge protector extension cords like they plug computer stuff into? My guess is that has a pretty low resistance breaker and will pop pretty quickly. I'd try plugging the welder directly into the wall socket...providing you have the proper breaker in your fuse box for the wiring to the socket. Or is that what you did when you blew out all the lights?
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  #19 (permalink)  
Old 10-19-2004, 08:38 PM
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Yes and no

I tried it first with the extension cord ... it shut down all the time.. as soon as I got the metal stick to get stuck on the metal (due to no arc) .. it blew

I got used to resetting it

Then I tried getting away from getting the stick stuck .. so I decided to do the "scratching" .. sliding sideways thingy with the stick against the metal... in order to get the arc going ... last time i did it .. that's when the lights went down ..
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Old 10-20-2004, 08:03 AM
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vorgarh-What size rod are you using? What power setting?
I looked at the description that you posted and the rod size limit is only 3/32" which is quite small but about the limit for a 110 volt machine, anything bigger will pop a breaker almost instantly and at the power setting required to burn even a rod that size the machine will have a very short duty cycle. That rod size limit also confirms what I already suspected that the 65 to 250 amp claim is wildly exaggerated with 30 to 90 amps being closer to reality with a short duty cycle on 110 volt but somewhat better on 220 volts. I assume that this machine is also AC only which will make it a bit harder to weld with but used within limitations it should work just fine. The proper type electrode(rod) is very important as some types are extremely difficult to use with AC so I would suggest a 1/16" E7014 or 1/16" E6013 for ease of use, the E7014 being the best in my opinion.
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  #21 (permalink)  
Old 10-20-2004, 06:39 PM
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Smile hmmmmm

It is actually labelled .. in the manual.. and on the welder .. as a 225 Amp welder ...

hmmmm I have to check what rods I did get ... I'm rather sure I already got the 1/16 6013 ... but I'll double check that one.. and post about it here

Thanks !!
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Old 10-20-2004, 10:56 PM
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The color code is definitly european and they are usualy 220 from hot to neutral. I strongly suggest you find an electrician to check that thing out.
BTW, 14 mm is a legitmate wire size and is comparable to 6 gage. Sounds like a high amp circuit.
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Old 10-21-2004, 07:58 AM
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Quote:
Originally posted by julmer
and they are usualy 220 from hot to neutral.
Hey julmer,

What exactly do you mean when you say the european wiring is "220 from hot to neutral" and how would it be different from U.S. wiring?

Dewey
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Old 10-21-2004, 03:27 PM
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Yes .. but

BUT ... would an Arc welder have a ground wire going from underneath it ... to ground somewhere ??

When I already have the work piece (metal to weld) grounded from the welder ... plus the plug is a three wire (green/yellow is ground)
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Old 10-21-2004, 10:38 PM
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cboy,
standard house current in most of Europe is 220 volts so everything like lightbulbs and coffee pots are 220 volts. In the US, residential wiring is basically 110. There are 3 wires comming into an average US house. The two black wires are both 110 measured to the neutral and 220 volts measured between themselves. All the normal outlets are connected between one of the blacks and neutral. For hi-power appliances, they connect across both blacks.
The European eqivalent is just 2 wires comming in - 220 and neutral. (I'm ignoring any grounds for this discussion) so every outlet is 220.
There are good arguements for both systems but the key is they are different. The standard color codes are different and the ones described for this welder are not the US standard.
If you have ever wondered why most computers have a switch on the back for 110 or 220, it is because they are used all over the world and have to cope with the different power setups.
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  #26 (permalink)  
Old 10-22-2004, 12:14 AM
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But

but I should still be able to wire it the normal way ... right ?

However I will try smaller rods .. and if that doesn't help ... hmmm check the breaker in the fuze box inside the house

BTW, the breaker runs the garage, fans in the kitchen, fan in the laundry room, and also light in the laundry room
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  #27 (permalink)  
Old 10-22-2004, 08:23 AM
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Thanks for the description julmer. It raises a question about vorgath's welder. If that machine is set up with European wiring doesn't it expect European 220 coming into it (one wire carrying 220 volts rather than two wires carrying 110 each) and might it therefore have a "conversion box" somewhere inside it that converts the 220 to 110? I'm just wondering it it will work properly at all with just one 110 wire feeding into it (which the conversion box might not handle correctly).

The symptom vorgath describes (the rod sticking to the metal rather than striking a good arch) sounds like what happens if you try to run a U.S. made buzz box with only one side wired in (one 110 wire attached rather than two). The rod will just stick to the working surface.

I could be way off base here (due to my very limited knowledge of electronics)...just trying to piece together your description of European wiring and vorgath's symptoms.

Also, it sounds like you might have too much load on that breaker you are attempting to use, vorgath. If that one circuit is running everything in the garage and a few things in the house as well...it won't take much to trip it when you add the welder on. If you have room in your box, I'd try to add a dedicated breaker for the welder and the proper wiring to the garage.
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Old 10-24-2004, 11:29 PM
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From all the descriptions, I wonder if if it wants a high amp 110 circuit like 30 or 50 amp. I suggested an electrician just because one should be able to look at things for a very short period of time and figure out what needs to be done. This is one of those that is a little tough to troubleshoot sight unseen. Messing with circuits can be awfuly dangerous if you don't have some background.
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Old 10-25-2004, 07:32 PM
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OK here it is now

I had to go to W A L M A R T .. to get 1/16 rods ... increible ... Home Depot's smallest ones are .. 3/32 ... and Tool Depot had .. F O U R packs of welding rods

OK OK OK .. anyway... tried it with 1/16 rods ... i still have to be quite careful with the rod not sticking to the metal .. but once i drag it a little bit and get an initial spark ... if i manage to keep the rod at the perfect distance from the metal .. yeah i can weld

Of course if the rod sticks .. and i let it sit... yeah... kaboom there goes the power again

Now... 3/32 rod hmmmmm still no luck really with that one ....

But to this equation you guys also have to add this ... I'm new to this .. and stick welding is not the easiest of all welding processes


The closest I did to stick welding before .. was to try a Naval cutting unit ... where ya have a rod .. ya strike the arc ... the arc stays on .. all time ... and the rod burns faster when it doesn't touch the metal ... and anyway... it goes through inches of steel in a second or so
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  #30 (permalink)  
Old 10-25-2004, 10:34 PM
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Re: OK here it is now

Quote:
Originally posted by vorgath
But to this equation you guys also have to add this ... I'm new to this .. and stick welding is not the easiest of all welding processes
From the sound of things I don't think this is the problem. Yes, stick welding is not the easiest way to weld...but it also shouldn't be as difficult to strike and maintain an arc as you are describing. But there is a quick and easy way to find out. Try out a friends stick welder or if need be, stop in at a small welding shop, explain your situation, and I'll bet they will let you try out one of their stick welders on a couple pieces of scrap metal. My guess is, with a properly wired buzz box, you'll be able to strike and maintain an arc almost immediately.

Seems to me the real problem is still in your wiring - either within the welder or the house wiring to the welder.
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