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  #331 (permalink)  
Old 08-11-2008, 12:00 PM
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Deuce,

I think we're on the same page of thinking here. It's just the good common courtesy to appreciate another's car when we learn that they've built it themselves, even if we don't agree with thier stylistic choices.

I do know what you mean about the naysayers as I've already seen these pessimists at car shows. If there's anything that will kill our already small hobby as it is, it will be these people. Plain and simple, just brush 'em off. I do.

"It's the Man who built something that'll be remembered. Not his detractors."

Don't know the origin of the phrase or even if I got it right, but that's it in a nutshell.

Jay K.

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  #332 (permalink)  
Old 08-11-2008, 12:25 PM
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If anyone is building there rods to please someone else well good luck!!! I have learn though the years of building, That there is someone out there that's ready to cut your car down.And it usually the one's that are jealous of you!!! I never build a car to please anyone else.I'm the only one that need's to like it!!!!!!And some times that hard.The one's that builds there cars.I may not like it,But I will never tell them that.But I can appreciate the work they put into it.
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  #333 (permalink)  
Old 08-11-2008, 01:04 PM
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My .02 worth on this subject.

My cars are built to satisfy my need to do this project. I do want it to be nice looking, so I do make an attempt to have it be pleasing to most folks. I do like to hear nice things about what I "made" with my own hands. But - THAT IS NOT WHY I BUILT A CAR. I built it for me. I may think that your car is a piece of junk. You wont hear that from me as I am all to well aware that it is your pride and joy, that you put your efforts into building that car for your pleasure, not mine.

Me, I guess I've said often enough that I don't care for the Street Beast offerings - but with that said, I have seen some very nice versions that are well done. With our member here, Jay, I hope his car turns out nicely, and I think it will. I hope he asks lots of questions - I know that I have during my current build and have gotten great help from the folks here and another forum that I spend way too much time on as well. Could I have done it without that help - probably, except for the painting, but it sure is nice to have other opinions .

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  #334 (permalink)  
Old 08-11-2008, 01:51 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Henry Highrise
JGK95, I was just reading your thread on your build progress Street Beasts '34 build starts I sincerely hope that StreetBeasts replaces the bad front hub that was in your kit. Keep us informed please.

Of course we will, also check out , username 41Willys , on this site, has done a drop dead 41willys of ours , documented the whole project with pics
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  #335 (permalink)  
Old 08-11-2008, 04:15 PM
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There's a lot of hate out there.

Allow me a second of your valuable time, I used to work for Classic Motor Carriages oh way back when they first build their first street rod, and I will call it a street rod instead of a kit car because it was one.

It was a piece of crap. the body was warped, none of the fenders fit(oh yes the fenders and all the pieces that made up the fenders were separate pieces, you know like the "original" cars) nothing fit right, the original ford hardware didn't fit the body everything looked like it was put together by a monkey with a hammer and a bucket of glue. It had an original frame but it wasn't design to handle a "modern" V-8 and it had adapter brackets that allowed newer (automatic) transmissions to be used but no thought was given to drive train geometry at all that was up to the customer to figure out. I cried when I saw how this thing had been put together, the rear axle and the transmission were both pointed down almost 20 degrees and were so horribly out of phase that I was glad the motor barely ran because that meant I wouldn't have to test drive it. It overheated, the brakes sucked, nothing worked the way it should and did I mention that this street rod was a 32 coupe came from a street rod company that shall remain nameless because quite honestly I don't remember whose body it was.....

But I'll tell you this much from my experience back in the 1980's that was the quality of street rod product you got when you bought a fiberglass rod and any one here old enough to remember those days knows what I am saying is absolutely true.

Part of the pride in owning a street rod at that time was overcoming all the hurdles of what you had to deal with in building one of those cars, and the same is still true with, dare I say it, "real steel" cars, the hours upon hours of fitting and body shimming, of cutting, grinding, and welding and fabricating pieces that have to work perfectly each and every time that they need to.

Classic Motor Carriages looked at what they had purchased and said "we are not going to build cars like this, we are going to build something different".

It was a bold move, for one thing they decided to build a body with the fenders in a combination bigger and stronger then anything they had ever build before. The only thing that came close was their tiny Speedster. and they had to make it easy to build.

Easy to build...

let me tell you, you have no idea how hard it is to try to build something that is "easy to build" especially when it involves fiberglass and steel and some guy out in the middle of nowhere that bought your car out of a magazine, but we tried and we fought with each other and compromised and actually designed our first 34 coupe.

I was quite proud of it, I still am, without the body the chassis and the steel cage almost looked like a dirt track car, with the body on everything worked the way it should and we even upgraded things like the door latches going instead to the double bear claw style instead of the funky ford two step design and we designed it around modern running gear, Mustang II front suspension and Fox body Mustang rear suspension with a pinto/mustang II steering column and brakes. but the best thing about it was the ride everything was tight and smooth with no quirks.

I built 15 of them two prototypes one red and one white, (one ford and one chevy) 12 static displays for airports, and one for a local Miami customer (I have pictures if you would allow me to post them). and then we started build more versions like the 33 Vicky, the 34 Cabriolet and then we redesign the 34 Coupe to be more like the Vicky and the Cabriolet each of which were improved over the other to make them easier to build and to give them a better finish. and I sat doWN and wrote the Manuals on how to build them.

Oh Yes I'm the guy you get to blame for the manuals, sadly fifteen+ years after I wrote them they look tired and old and some stuff in them has been upgraded with out the text being rewritten but I wasn't around to fix it and didn't have the chance.

You see when Classic closed their doors for a short period of time I went out and got another job and no one bothered to call me back, so for the last fifteen years I have been restoring Mustangs and now I am back.

And I plan to rewrite the manuals and improve as much as I can to make our cars what we designed them to be, rugged, easy to build and fun to drive, a tall order for ANY FIBERGLASS CAR OR STREET ROD OR FOR ANY CUSTOM CAR FOR THAT MATTER!

And I just like to say one last thing to all the people that looks down on and says anything nasty to those that build and drive our cars.....

Could you do better with one of our cars?
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  #336 (permalink)  
Old 08-11-2008, 04:45 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Grandpa Cobra
There's a lot of hate out there.
We don't hate Streetbeasts, we're just discusted by their sales tactics and poor design.


Quote:
Originally Posted by Grandpa Cobra
And I just like to say one last thing to all the people that looks down on and says anything nasty to those that build and drive our cars.....

Could you do better with one of our cars?
I'll make you guys a deal. I've been one of your loudest critics for years but..... If your company is willing to provide me with a Cobra kit free of charge (no way I'd do one of your 33 coupes or Vickys), I'll come to Miami and pick it up. Then I'll document the complete build with totally non biased commentary for the general public to read. I'll post it here or wherever you want and I'll let you guys preview the comments and discuss any heart burn you might have with them before they are posted. I'll call out all the good and the bad without editorializing in any way. Now that's fair. Deal or no Deal???
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  #337 (permalink)  
Old 08-11-2008, 04:52 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Grandpa Cobra
and I sat doWN and wrote the Manuals on how to build them.

Oh Yes I'm the guy you get to blame for the manuals, sadly fifteen+ years after I wrote them they look tired and old and some stuff in them has been upgraded with out the text being rewritten but I wasn't around to fix it and didn't have the chance.

And I plan to rewrite the manuals

Could you do better with one of our cars?
Yes I can!!! And I'm doing it now...I have changed alot of things on mine...And a lot of people in the hot rod world has been here and seen it and said I have Improved that car 100%,And still have more to do to it.At least after 5 to10 years down the road,I can remove my body if I need too.As for the Manuel,Don't even get me started!!!!!!

MANUEL !!!!! That's one of the biggest problem's with the car!!!!!

Last edited by NEW INTERIORS; 08-11-2008 at 05:09 PM.
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  #338 (permalink)  
Old 08-11-2008, 05:03 PM
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Streetbeast folks -- while all are welcome here, I would think that the best strategy might be to choose a single person to represent Streetbeasts from your IP address.

Grandpa Cobra -- we've been working on a wiki article to document this controversy, here: Streetbeasts. As you've been with Streetbeasts since the Classic Motor Carriages days, I'm hoping you might be able to help me interpret some of the stuff I've been reading around the web.

There is a gentleman named "Christopher Aguilera", who says he was the Parts Manager at Classic Motor Carriages in 1996. He's written a very interesting article here: http://www.geocities.com/aztec7fan/s..._aguilera.html , about Classic Motor Carriages, and he's been posting on the Fiberfab/CMC message board on Yahoo, such as in this post: http://autos.groups.yahoo.com/group/...CMC/message/22 .

Among the allegations in his article:

--The sales people at CMC were told to Anglicize their names. Thus, Christopher Aguilera presented himself on the phone as "Christopher Edwards".

--The sales people repeatedly pressured people into putting down a deposit by threatening a price increase, but it was a "total scam".

--The managers instructed the sales people to "crank call" another kit car company, Classic Roadsters, to intentionally tie up their phone lines so they couldn't sell their kits.

Are those things true?

Also, Streetbeast has repeatedly been saying that they "bought" Classic Motor Carriages. Which may be technically true, but doesn't seem to be The Whole Truth. The article in the Miami New Times says that, in 1994, the Florida Attorney General's Office sued CMC, and they were forced to close down the following November. The article goes on to say that, after they were made to pay nearly $3 million in fines for fraudulent business practices, the owner of Classic Motor Carriages, George Levin, launched a new company called Auto Resolutions, and then "quietly began selling cars under the brand name Street Beasts".

So, it looks like they're saying that the owner of Classic Motor Carriages just started StreetBeasts after he got in trouble for fraud, so he could sell the same cars under a new name.

Is that true?
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  #339 (permalink)  
Old 08-11-2008, 05:37 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Centerline
We don't hate Streetbeasts, we're just discusted by their sales tactics and poor design.


I'll make you guys a deal. I've been one of your loudest critics for years but..... If your company is willing to provide me with a Cobra kit free of charge (no way I'd do one of your 33 coupes or Vickys), I'll come to Miami and pick it up. Then I'll document the complete build with totally non biased commentary for the general public to read. I'll post it here or wherever you want and I'll let you guys preview the comments and discuss any heart burn you might have with them before they are posted. I'll call out all the good and the bad without editorializing in any way. Now that's fair. Deal or no Deal???
You have a deal , as long as when the car is finished we can auction it off for charity of my choice, probably like NPFA .......sound Good
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  #340 (permalink)  
Old 08-11-2008, 05:42 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by StreetbeastOptsMan
You have a deal , as long as when the car is finished we can auction it off for charity of my choice, probably like NPFA .......sound Good
He** I'll do it if you throw in a 41 willys!!!! And you supply all parts and labor!!!!!

Last edited by NEW INTERIORS; 08-11-2008 at 06:22 PM.
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  #341 (permalink)  
Old 08-11-2008, 06:01 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by StreetbeastOptsMan
You have a deal , as long as when the car is finished we can auction it off for charity of my choice, probably like NPFA .......sound Good
I put forth a deal and you try to set conditions. Sorry but I'm not falling for that. Like I said before I was born but not yesterday. You want me to provide all the work, drivetrain and everything else and you get the tax deduction??

No. My original deal stands. Take it or leave it.

Last edited by Centerline; 08-11-2008 at 06:40 PM.
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  #342 (permalink)  
Old 08-11-2008, 06:02 PM
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First off I am but a small cog in the machinery of Street Beasts and my one saving grace is I know how to build cars.

But rather then build one of our car perhaps Centerline could create his own Street rod "kit" that is as complete as ours is and sell it in competition, let's say for instance a 32 coupe with the fenders molded to the body and an unique frame using the same sort of running gear that we use. There is a real challenge do what we do and do it better than we do.

Jon as for the wiki articles I only have so many hours in a day and once I start rebutting what has been said I'm afraid it could become a full time job.

I will say this about Christopher Aguilera's article, I never met him but his first sentence is a lie.

Quote:
I was the Parts Manager at Classic Motor Carriages when they purchased Fiberfab (ed. approx. 1996).
IN 1996 Classic Motor Carriage was already out of business and all of it's assets had been moved to where Street Beasts is today. As for the Aztec 7 Molds, When I joined CMC in 1986 the molds were already ruined, unusable, and breeding grounds for Mosquitoes, Fiberfab, I believe was acquired prior to 1980 maybe even 1975 although I am not sure when. I visited the CMC factory in November of 1980 with the purpose of buying a Speedster only to be totally ignored by Classic's "cutthroat" sales staff while I wandered around their sales floor for over an hour sitting in the cars and generally inspecting everything.

As for Classic Roadsters most of Classic Roadsters people were stolen from CMC when Classic Roadsters was in Miami around 1990 and I don't know if they crank called each other but I do know that we (the factory types) were not allowed to talk to them at all or anyone that left CMC to join Classic Roadsters.

The New Times is one of those free "progressive weeklies" complete with gay sex, strip clubs and other types of liberated sexual ads That I could not leave around small children. If you want I would be glad to send you a copy so you could critique for yourself it's general content, I prefer to think of it as writers not yet ready for the Miami Herald.

As for CMC's sales tactics I spent my entire time there building cars and rarely talked to sales people, I suspect though that building our cars is easier then selling a car in a box over the phone.
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  #343 (permalink)  
Old 08-11-2008, 06:05 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by JGK95
Deuce,

I think we're on the same page of thinking here. It's just the good common courtesy to appreciate another's car when we learn that they've built it themselves, even if we don't agree with thier stylistic choices.

I do know what you mean about the naysayers as I've already seen these pessimists at car shows. If there's anything that will kill our already small hobby as it is, it will be these people. Plain and simple, just brush 'em off. I do.

"It's the Man who built something that'll be remembered. Not his detractors."

Don't know the origin of the phrase or even if I got it right, but that's it in a nutshell.

Jay K.
I agree.I build my car for me.Yes it is nice when others appreciate it but you can't please everyone so you have to please yourself.
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  #344 (permalink)  
Old 08-11-2008, 06:09 PM
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  #345 (permalink)  
Old 08-11-2008, 06:09 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Grandpa Cobra
But rather then build one of our car perhaps Centerline could create his own Street rod "kit" that is as complete as ours is and sell it in competition, let's say for instance a 32 coupe with the fenders molded to the body and an unique frame using the same sort of running gear that we use. There is a real challenge do what we do and do it better than we do..
So you won't take my deal...... Actually its not surprising that your company is reluctant to accept a deal that might expose once and for all what kind of product you sell. But.... it does follow StreetBeast's established pattern.
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