StreetBeast rod kit's - Page 31 - Hot Rod Forum : Hotrodders Bulletin Board
Hotrodders.com -- Hot Rod Forum



Register FAQ Search Today's Posts Unanswered Posts Auto Escrow Insurance Auto Loans
Hot Rod Forum : Hotrodders Bulletin Board > General Discussion> Hotrodders' Lounge
User Name
Password
lost password?   |   register now

Reply
 
LinkBack Thread Tools
  #451 (permalink)  
Old 08-13-2008, 02:34 PM
Grandpa Cobra's Avatar
Registered User
 
Last photo:
Join Date: Aug 2008
Location: Miami Florida
Posts: 5
Wiki Edits: 0

Thanks: 0
Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts
Jon, you didn't answer my question.

Do you have proof George Levin pled guilty?

If you are going to ask me that question I think it is only fair that I get to ask you if you are attempting again to lead me into lying.

As for spin I have been honest in all the answers I have given.

Which is the bigger fraud?

the company sells a kit that it knows can be built, has been built, and wants the new customer to buy and build

or

A publisher tells the customers of the same company that their cars cannot be built, that they are junk, and takes steps to ensure that the customers don't get what they need to build their cars by trying to cut off their supply of outsourced parts.

    Advertisement
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Sponsored Links
Advertisement
 
  #452 (permalink)  
Old 08-13-2008, 02:44 PM
Registered User
 
Last wiki edit: Mopar tapered axle rear brake conversion
Last journal entry: What I'm doing now...
Last photo:
Join Date: Jan 2002
Posts: 4,267
Wiki Edits: 49

Thanks: 0
Thanked 5 Times in 5 Posts
Quote:
Originally Posted by JGK95
.......Dirt diggers like Jon and "Extreme Right of Center"..........
Thanks for the complement.


Quote:
Originally Posted by JGK95
Jon,

Simple question... What year is it?


What was the year of that case?

Your hard-on for trying to pin the judgement on StreetBeasts really doesn't bode well for the board's ability to stay impartial. Really, it doesn't.

At 31, I'd think you'd have some ability to feign impartiality.

Jay K.
For those individuals on this board who seem to want to bury your heads in the sand.... let me see if I can summarize things as I understand them.

Way back when George Lavin purchased a small kit car manufacturer in South Florida called Fiberfab and Innovative Street Machines / Classic Motor Carriages was "born". While this company operated they expanded their line of products to include what some people might call kinda sorta Street Rods, a 41 Willys and a Cobra kit along with a few others. They also dropped several offerings that Fiberfab had been producing.

As time went on Classic Motor Carriages (CMC) transformed itself into a high pressure high volume sales company who's main goal was to sell as many "kits" as possible....unfortunately it seems at the expense of the consumer. As a result CMC began amassing hundreds (around 900 or so) consumer complaints ranging from poor quality and missing parts to down right non-delivery.

After a campaign by Curt Scott at KitCar.com and others the State of Florida finally got off the dime and filed suit against Mr. Lavin and forced CMC to shut its doors. As a result and in order to satisfy the Florida Attorney General Mr. Lavin set up a new company called Auto Resolutions Ltd. to provide the 900 or so customers the parts or in some cases entire kits they had not received. Shortly after this Auto Resolutions began doing business as Street Beast. So essentially CMC through some legal wrangling becomes Street Beast and continues selling the exact same kits using the exact same molds with basically the same sales staff and management structure as CMC. In other words essentially nothing changed, CMC = Street Beast.

There is also a reason this company operates in Florida. Florida is one of the few states with laws that will allow a person such as Mr. Lavin, who owned a company that had these types of problems, to basically just change the name of the company, move it from Ft. Lauderdale to Miami and then continue operating just as before. Florida makes it easy to disguise the true ownership of a company and although its not impossible to dig up the truth, it sure seems that Street Beast has gone to great lengths to try to hid this information. Why? Because if potential customers knew that little had changed as far as ownership and apparently management style since the days of CMC they might just think twice about buying a Street Beast product. Well, the truth is out now.

Hopefully this thread and the Wiki will help educate the consumer so that he or she can make an educated decision when it comes to purchasing a "kit" car. After reading about the history of the company and its campaign to hide the truth from the consumer they may, just as I have, come to the conclusion that Street Beast, Classic Motor Carriages, and Auto Resolutions Ltd. are really THE SAME COMPANY, and they are OWNED BY THE SAME GUY. After all, if you don't understand history you are destined to repeat it.

Personally I think its time for Street Beast to stop the charade and fess up to the facts about its ownership and the company's real history. Stop the lies and start telling the consumer the TRUTH. If Street Beast has indeed changed its ways, and their participation in this thread would indicate they haven't, then they should have nothing to fear by being honest.

It's pretty obvious that Street Beast's customer service has improved since the days of CMC. If it handn't people would be screaming about it all over the internet. However, this is not enough. As far as I can see their sales tactics and kit designs have not changed much. It seems to me, based on their slick advertising campaigns, Street Beast is still targeting the newcomer to the hobby. Unfortunately they also seem to still be using the same old high pressure sales tactics CMC used. Tactics which are designed to convince novices that Street Beast kits assemble easily. Easily as we all know is a relative term, however if someone thinks that the "kit" he just purchased will "bolt" together easily when indeed the actual assembly will require much more work than he was led to believe, this can not be good for the hobby.

One can only hope that a potential customer will read the Wiki and this thread and educate himself before making a purchase..... but its my opinion that Street Beast is counting on just the opposite.

Caveat Emptor!
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
  #453 (permalink)  
Old 08-13-2008, 02:50 PM
Jon's Avatar
Jon Jon is offline
Hotrodders.com Administrator
 
Last wiki edit: Removing stuck fasteners Last photo:
Join Date: May 2001
Location: Colorado
Age: 37
Posts: 3,206
Wiki Edits: 7314

Thanks: 0
Thanked 15 Times in 12 Posts
Grandpa Cobra -- No, I don't have proof that Levin pled guilty. I've certainly been hearing it from multiple reliable sources, so I asked you, before I dig up the docs. What's your answer? "You don't know"? Can we get an official response from StreetBeasts? Or is it just "no comment"? StreetbeastOptsMan? Any comment?

You haven't been honest at all. Specifically, you guys have been telling people that StreetBeasts "bought the molds" from CMC, when, really, StreetBeasts was just a new company started by the owner of CMC. Out of all the company people that we've seen on this board, you guys are among the most dishonest.

You can huff and puff all you like in a 30-page forum thread. What goes in the wiki article is what counts, because that's what's going to be top-ranked in Google for searches for the word "StreetBeasts".

You want good customer relations? Start telling the truth.

In addition, Grandpa Cobra, I'm curious as to your identity, and I'd appreciate it if you could identify yourself with your real name, so we can verify some of the claims that you've been making.

Also, still waiting patiently to see if you have any information on the involvement of the Florida BBB that you'd like to reveal.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
  #454 (permalink)  
Old 08-13-2008, 03:23 PM
Grandpa Cobra's Avatar
Registered User
 
Last photo:
Join Date: Aug 2008
Location: Miami Florida
Posts: 5
Wiki Edits: 0

Thanks: 0
Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts
quote where I said Street beasts bought the molds Jon.

I never said that at all.

You say you guys as if I am everyone


What claims of mine would you like to investigate?
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
  #455 (permalink)  
Old 08-13-2008, 03:39 PM
JGK95's Avatar
Registered User
 

Last journal entry: Test Entry
Last photo:
Join Date: Sep 2007
Location: Chicago
Posts: 244
Wiki Edits: 0

Thanks: 81
Thanked 52 Times in 49 Posts
Quote:
Originally Posted by Jon
Grandpa Cobra -- No, I don't have proof that Levin pled guilty. I've certainly been hearing it from multiple reliable sources, so I asked you, before I dig up the docs. What's your answer? "You don't know"? Can we get an official response from StreetBeasts? Or is it just "no comment"? StreetbeastOptsMan? Any comment?

You haven't been honest at all. Specifically, you guys have been telling people that StreetBeasts "bought the molds" from CMC, when, really, StreetBeasts was just a new company started by the owner of CMC. Out of all the company people that we've seen on this board, you guys are among the most dishonest.

You can huff and puff all you like in a 30-page forum thread. What goes in the wiki article is what counts, because that's what's going to be top-ranked in Google for searches for the word "StreetBeasts".

You want good customer relations? Start telling the truth.

In addition, Grandpa Cobra, I'm curious as to your identity, and I'd appreciate it if you could identify yourself with your real name, so we can verify some of the claims that you've been making.

Also, still waiting patiently to see if you have any information on the involvement of the Florida BBB that you'd like to reveal.
Jon,

Grandpa Cobra is Mike S. from Street Beasts

StreetBeastsOptsMan is Marc Gold from Street Beasts.

I've spoke to both over the phone and will stand by what I've typed.

Jay K.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
  #456 (permalink)  
Old 08-13-2008, 04:11 PM
killerformula's Avatar
Hotrodders.com Moderator
 
Last wiki edit: Carburetor
Last journal entry: Clean up
Last photo:
Join Date: Oct 2003
Location: Northeast
Age: 34
Posts: 3,486
Wiki Edits: 3

Thanks: 13
Thanked 27 Times in 18 Posts
While I do think there's something to be said for "getting it from the horses mouth" there are many different types of "second-hand" information. Not everything second-hand is by definition unreliable. I don't need to be in Iraq to understand that there's danger there. I don't need to sniff a porta-poty to know that its going to smell bad, and I don't need to buy a kit car to know that know matter how excited you are about this build, I would probably choose another product.

This type of cautionary information comes in many different forms, as I said before, of varying reliability. For road cars we've got edmunds, consumer reports and other independent review sites. But where do you find reviews and end-user information about hotrods, hotrod compoents and build information? The answer to that is the whole reason any one of us came to this site in the first place, and the reason that Jon has created the crankshaft coalition and wiki. Forums like this one are UNFUNDED. That means that there is no corporate or monitary drive forcing certain information to the top of the list and not other. I would argue that for this reason, this "second hand" information is very valuable.

Every time you post a question, start a thread, read a wiki or hit the search button, you're reading about projects and information second-hand.

K
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
  #457 (permalink)  
Old 08-13-2008, 04:26 PM
Grandpa Cobra's Avatar
Registered User
 
Last photo:
Join Date: Aug 2008
Location: Miami Florida
Posts: 5
Wiki Edits: 0

Thanks: 0
Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts
Jon as an administrator you have access to my home e mail address and have been able to shoot me an e mail at any point during this discussion with questions on my claims.

I can only assume that if you want my real name you want to pass it on to someone else who may have information on me.

If you want I will give it to you. I was not a well known person (Big Wig or sales person) at CMC since I spent my entire time there as part of the Factory crew working on the assembly line, in R&D, technical support and believe it on not building maintenance.

Most my knowledge of the events comes from my contact with actual customers vendors and those above me like Ben Harrington a fellow Marine Veteran who has since passed away.

If you doubt I was a Marine and you were a Marine there is a web forum only for Marines and Marine Veterans with strict access to kept out posers and trolls where I use my real name and former rank. I will be happy to talk to you there as well.

Of course it is possible for you to call me direct at Street Beast if you are so inclined I answer tech calls from 2:30EST until 5:00 EST for any of our customers but would be willing to squeeze you in if it is that important to you.



Me At CMC with our prototype 34 Cabriolet
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
  #458 (permalink)  
Old 08-13-2008, 04:30 PM
Jon's Avatar
Jon Jon is offline
Hotrodders.com Administrator
 
Last wiki edit: Removing stuck fasteners Last photo:
Join Date: May 2001
Location: Colorado
Age: 37
Posts: 3,206
Wiki Edits: 7314

Thanks: 0
Thanked 15 Times in 12 Posts
Grandpa Cobra -- In my previous post, I said: "you guys have been telling people that StreetBeasts 'bought the molds' from CMC".

In this post, StreetbeastOptsMan said:

Quote:
Originally Posted by StreetbeastOptsMan
we bought the molds and equipment from CMC
And, in this post on TwoGuysGarage.com, another StreetBeast rep said:

Quote:
Originally Posted by zenmaster on TwoGuysGarage.com
Innovative Street Machines purchased the molds and tooling they used
Thus, I think it's fine to say "you guys", in reference to StreetBeast reps. However, yes, allow me to clarify, that I haven't seen you personally make such a statement.

Also, I just checked the court docs for USA v. GGL, from 1999, in Florida's Southern District Court. I'm seeing a Fraud by Wire case, a guilty plea entered in January of 1999, and a sentence of 2 years probation, with a restitution of $2.5 million. Anyone else can double-check that using the publicly-available PACER database.

Which, by the way, aligns perfectly with what I've been hearing.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
  #459 (permalink)  
Old 08-13-2008, 05:46 PM
Deuce's Avatar
Hotrodders.com Moderator
 
Last wiki edit: Choosing a trailer
Last journal entry: Jan 13 2013
Last photo:
Join Date: Aug 2002
Location: Deuceland USA
Age: 66
Posts: 5,657
Wiki Edits: 6

Thanks: 0
Thanked 9 Times in 9 Posts
Quote:
Originally Posted by F&J
This thread seems to be centered around the past, versus the present.

Quote:
Originally Posted by JGK95

The year is 2008, you two historians, please join us in the present day and move forward.

Thanks,

Jay K.
The past has a direct connection to NOW ... especially when dealing with one's reputation and trust. The past is a good indicator of future performance ... when buying stocks or dealing with companies. The same for politicians.

Just look at the political futures of John Edwards, Bill Clinton and Gary Hart. Add in Jim McGreevey, Wilbur Mills and Bob Packwood. They lied ... ( a lot of them under oath ) ... do you trust their word now. I doubt it. Ted Kennedy is one of the few who ever really succeeded after a sex scandal and all the lying. If that 1969 Chappaquiddick " incident " happened in 2008 ... I believe the outcome would be very different.

StreetBeast has a very tainted and checkered past. No one here associated with Hotrodders.com has slandered the " new company "
Questions ( legitimate IMHO ) have been raised about their current business practices ... and quality. A good name and good reputation has to be earned ... after it has been in the mud and had all the certified legal issues it has had.

I find it very interesting that this thread is 7 - 8 years old but has really taken off in the past 2 to 3 weeks. Mainly after two employees of StreetBeast came on the board and tried to SPIN ... the past and paint a rose colored glasses view of the future. I see no one other than JGK95 trying to aid their cause.

After ( and when ) JGK95 finishes his Beast ... and is still a big fan of StreetBeast ... then ... and only then will his rosey opinion of StreetBeast carry any real weight with me.

Hopefully, this will be my statement on this subject ... as I believe most of the parties here are dead-locked ... I am off the build a car ...



Yes ... one of them
__________________


"I won't be wronged . I won't be insulted, and I won't be laid a hand on. "






Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
  #460 (permalink)  
Old 08-13-2008, 08:42 PM
schnitz's Avatar
Member
 
Last wiki edit: Building a new shop
Last journal entry: Christmas 2008 came early!!!
Last photo:
Join Date: Jan 2004
Location: Wausau, Wisconsin, in a house...
Age: 40
Posts: 1,163
Wiki Edits: 54

Thanks: 8
Thanked 1 Time in 1 Post
Quote:
After ( and when ) JGK95 finishes his Beast ... and is still a big fan of StreetBeast ... then ... and only then will his rosey opinion of StreetBeast carry any real weight with me.

Hopefully, this will be my statement on this subject ... as I believe most of the parties here are dead-locked ...
Here's my final take. Jay is currently building a Streetbeasts kit. Questions concerning build quality/ customer service/ name/ reputation could be answered by only one person, right Seemingly he's the only one with a new kit-- Jay, please look below before reading more.... If the kit is being marketed to the "kit-car newbies", where better to hear all about it than from a newbie? That would also give SteetBeasts the opportunity to publicly show how they improved customer service. Which could in theory also rebuild a really tarnished reputation.

Jay, this is more for you than any other reader. First and foremost, I'm in no way intending to "throw you into the fire" by my suggestion. That is not my intent. You are the only one currently building a SteetBeast kit-- at least the only one currently active with it. As such, you'll have the hands-on opportunity in working on a car that is marketed at "new builders". That will give both sides a solid, real-world build-up to follow.

Ultimately, you'll have a car to enjoy (which in building with your dad is pretty cool), StreeBeast can show how they now have better quality kits and improved customer service, and lastly, we as members can observe and maybe learn a thing or two. I for one would like to know how Grandpa Cobra helped you along on your wheel stud issue.

Let us know if you're up to it.



In a while, Chet.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
  #461 (permalink)  
Old 08-14-2008, 12:02 AM
Grandpa Cobra's Avatar
Registered User
 
Last photo:
Join Date: Aug 2008
Location: Miami Florida
Posts: 5
Wiki Edits: 0

Thanks: 0
Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts
Jon,

Since I have more experience then Marc does in at least how the molds are used and maintained, let me say this....

The molds currently being used by Street Beasts may not be the original molds used at CMC. In fact they may be a third or fourth generation set of molds off of the original plug. When we were at CMC we had four molds for each type of car, Street Beasts does not have that many by my count, and I have seen evidence in the form of scrapped mold cradles that some of the molds have been destroyed.

There is a certain life expectancy to every mold, a finite number of times it can go through the molding process before it is removed from service and restored or scrapped, and every mold is closely monitored by the fiberglass shop foreman for condition before it is ever used.

The 41 Willys, the King (stretch) Cobra, and the Cobra Coupe are all purely Street Beast creations that did not exist when CMC was in business. There are even two new types speedster molds reflecting upgrades made to the Speedster frame that were made within the last two years. There is also a prototype plug that I cannot talk about which is in pre-production and has yet to be molded.

And there is even a set of molds we bought for yet another car type that has yet to be used.

In all fairness to Marc I don't think he would know the difference between a Street Beast Mold and a CMC mold and there are differences it the way they are constructed and assembled based upon changes made in the materials used to make the molds. In some cases even the color of the mold's gel coat liner has changed.

By the way don't consider me a rep for anyone but myself after working hours or even during, I spend most of my day building kits for customers and get to answer our customer's questions and sometime complaints until I go home usually still covered in fiberglass dust.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
  #462 (permalink)  
Old 08-14-2008, 07:38 AM
Grandpa Cobra's Avatar
Registered User
 
Last photo:
Join Date: Aug 2008
Location: Miami Florida
Posts: 5
Wiki Edits: 0

Thanks: 0
Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts
The biggest complaints I see about the body is that it isn't true to the "original" design of the 34 ford, and it seems to me that most of the people making that complaint have no remorse what so ever about modifying a 34 Ford or buying a modified version of a 34 Ford from other sources.

I'm trying to understand the basic hypocrisy of that argument so could anyone help me out here?

If you take a 34 ford and modify it so that the original parts don't fit on it and cannot be fit on it after god forbid an accident without the same sort of major modifications and repair that it is going to take to rebuild it anyway how is that any different then street beasts body design?



Anyone? Bueller?
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
  #463 (permalink)  
Old 08-14-2008, 08:59 AM
JGK95's Avatar
Registered User
 

Last journal entry: Test Entry
Last photo:
Join Date: Sep 2007
Location: Chicago
Posts: 244
Wiki Edits: 0

Thanks: 81
Thanked 52 Times in 49 Posts
Quote:
Originally Posted by schnitz
Here's my final take. Jay is currently building a Streetbeasts kit. Questions concerning build quality/ customer service/ name/ reputation could be answered by only one person, right Seemingly he's the only one with a new kit-- Jay, please look below before reading more.... If the kit is being marketed to the "kit-car newbies", where better to hear all about it than from a newbie? That would also give SteetBeasts the opportunity to publicly show how they improved customer service. Which could in theory also rebuild a really tarnished reputation.

Jay, this is more for you than any other reader. First and foremost, I'm in no way intending to "throw you into the fire" by my suggestion. That is not my intent. You are the only one currently building a SteetBeast kit-- at least the only one currently active with it. As such, you'll have the hands-on opportunity in working on a car that is marketed at "new builders". That will give both sides a solid, real-world build-up to follow.

Ultimately, you'll have a car to enjoy (which in building with your dad is pretty cool), StreeBeast can show how they now have better quality kits and improved customer service, and lastly, we as members can observe and maybe learn a thing or two. I for one would like to know how Grandpa Cobra helped you along on your wheel stud issue.

Let us know if you're up to it.



In a while, Chet.

Chet,

Not only am I up for the challenge, being a perfectionist, I gladly will charge forward to build the best Street Beasts with my father that we can! One of my biggest focuses will be the gap spacing between the doors and the hood. They must be set correctly or it'll drive me nuts! Do you recall Ford's GT that was sold back in 2005 /2006? The gaps were so bad that some cars were sent back to the factory to have the panels rehung!

The rest of the car looks well thought out as I mentioned earlier and I'll definitely keep the updates coming.

Thank you for the impartial challenge. WE ACCEPT!



Jay K.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
  #464 (permalink)  
Old 08-14-2008, 09:01 AM
Member
 
Last wiki edit: Ford axle ratio codes
Last journal entry: Rear Suspension
Last photo:
Join Date: Aug 2005
Location: Prattsville
Posts: 6,415
Wiki Edits: 31

Thanks: 2
Thanked 61 Times in 57 Posts
A fiberglass Ford from another source ( Outlaw, Downs, Wescott, Bebobs ect... ) stay true to the original, except for chopped tops and sometimes lengthened doors, and because of that, reproduction fenders from any company can be used... Deuce on here had an incident where his '32 Ford was smacked around the inside of his trailer destroying the fenders.. if the car was a street beast '34, the fenders would have to come directly from Street beast.. your grilles are diffrent also, making that yet another peice that has to come from Street Beast, instead of the many suppliers of grilles that follow original dimensions... Street Beasts can be nice, but there certinly are a boatload of diffrences between them and originals, unlike the other glass companies.. I don't belive that they are close enough to the original to be considered a Ford, under your product titles, there not altho they are in product descriptions.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
  #465 (permalink)  
Old 08-14-2008, 11:27 AM
Grandpa Cobra's Avatar
Registered User
 
Last photo:
Join Date: Aug 2008
Location: Miami Florida
Posts: 5
Wiki Edits: 0

Thanks: 0
Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts
So what you are saying is you could take a part from each of the other companies and build a complete 34 ford coupe without any modification to insure a correct fit to any of the parts.

I find that hard to believe however I am willing to build a such car and donate the proceeds to charity if you can get each of the other companies to donate a separate piece or pieces of theirs to the cause.

I would also need all the other parts necessary to build a 34 ford

My Cause being the Wounded Warrior project

However should I have to modify any part from any company to make it fit correctly, I would be paid for my time and services by those that insist that the fiberglass from any of the other companies is so perfect and so original that every other companies product is interchangeable with the other companies product.

The car still goes up for auction and I receive nothing from the proceeds the car sells for all money being paid to The Wounded Warriors Project.

Everyone that bets it can be done has to pay me for my time any expenses I incur in the building process and the cost of painting the completed car.

If it can be done all I ask for is the cost of having it painted and the parts to build it. All labor (except for paint and body work necessary to ensure a show quality finish) will be performed by me alone and documented via video and pictures.

Real simple
you get the parts,
give them to me
I build the car,
You also pay for the paint job
if I have to make any modifications to any of the parts you supply from other companies you pay me to build the car
all moneys from the sale of the car go to The Wounded Warrior Project
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message

Recent Hotrodders' Lounge posts with photos

Quick Reply
Message:
Options

Register Now

In order to be able to post messages on the Hot Rod Forum : Hotrodders Bulletin Board forums, you must first register.
Please enter your desired user name (usually not your first and last name), your email address and other required details in the form below.
User Name:
Password
Please enter a password for your user account. Note that passwords are case-sensitive.
Password:
Confirm Password:
Email Address
Please enter a valid email address for yourself.
Email Address:

Log-in

Human Verification

In order to verify that you are a human and not a spam bot, please enter the answer into the following box below based on the instructions contained in the graphic.




Currently Active Users Viewing This Thread: 1 (0 members and 1 guests)
 
Thread Tools

Posting Rules
You may post new threads
You may post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are On
Pingbacks are On
Refbacks are On



All times are GMT -6. The time now is 07:39 AM.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.7
Copyright ©2000 - 2014, vBulletin Solutions, Inc.
Search Engine Optimization by vBSEO 3.6.0 PL2
Copyright Hotrodders.com 1999 - 2012. All Rights Reserved.