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Old 12-01-2009, 07:48 PM
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Successful painting in cold weather....

Or at least what works for me.

When it comes to painting in cold weather unless you have a heated shop painting large objects like an entire body is probably not a good idea. However, you can paint moderate sized panels if you take some precautions first.

To begin with the temperature of the panel needs to be as warm as possible (within reason of course). I use heat lamps placed about 3 feet away (on both sides of the panel) and leave them on long enough to warm the metal to at least 75 degrees. You can see how I used these on my gas tank below.



Because modern paints need a temperature of at least 55-60 degrees in order for proper cross linking to take place it is important to not only preheat the metal but continue to use the heat lamps during and after painting. I leave them on for at least 4 hours after the last coat but 6 hours wouldn't hurt. Here's the finished product. One deuce gas tank painted 1964 Ford "Candy Apple Red". Its not really a candy but that's the name Ford gave it. In this case I used Martin Senour's Crossfire single stage urethane over a two part etching filler. Two mist (tack) coats followed by a medium wet coat and then a wet coat with 15 minutes between all coats. Outside temp 30 degrees, shop temp 50 degrees, metal temp at least 75-80 degrees.



The results were outstanding when you consider it was not painted in a booth and the conditions weren't optimum. I've used this technique in even colder weather and it seems to work just fine. Painted the cab on my pickup using heat lamps and PPG Omni single stage about 5 years ago and it still looks perfect.

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Last edited by Centerline; 12-01-2009 at 11:12 PM.
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Old 12-01-2009, 08:19 PM
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Lookin totally narly

Vince
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Old 12-01-2009, 09:05 PM
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Looks good centerline, but I think you are confusing epoxy and etching primer again. Etching primer isn't 2 part, okay it has 2 parts, a vinyl? resin/ zinc, and acid, but its not really a 2k product, and you really don't want to paint over it without using another primer first-most tech sheets I've seen give strict warnings against painting directly over them. Maybe you could paint over them or some manufactures say its okay after allowing plenty of time for the acid to leave, but most say its a no no. Etch primer usually has very little build and if you apply them heavy at all will be running all over the place.

Epoxy on the other hand is 2k . It doesn't contain an acid to etch the surface, its more like a glue, so surface should be sanded for adhesion, but much better then an etch primer and less chance of leading to any problems with other products or down the road.
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Old 12-01-2009, 09:09 PM
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He might be using SPI epoxy primer, it is sold as an etching primer also.

Vince
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Old 12-01-2009, 09:29 PM
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I've used it. I'm curious, So how, or what in it makes it etch? Is there an acid in it?
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Old 12-01-2009, 11:08 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by kenseth17
Looks good centerline, but I think you are confusing epoxy and etching primer again. Etching primer isn't 2 part, okay it has 2 parts, a vinyl? resin/ zinc, and acid, but its not really a 2k product, and you really don't want to paint over it without using another primer first-most tech sheets I've seen give strict warnings against painting directly over them. Maybe you could paint over them or some manufactures say its okay after allowing plenty of time for the acid to leave, but most say its a no no. Etch primer usually has very little build and if you apply them heavy at all will be running all over the place.

Epoxy on the other hand is 2k . It doesn't contain an acid to etch the surface, its more like a glue, so surface should be sanded for adhesion, but much better then an etch primer and less chance of leading to any problems with other products or down the road.
OK, the technical term is etching filler (I changed my original post to reflect that fact). Its Martin Senour Chromate Free Etching Filler Part # 15211 with 15212 hardener. It's a two part etching filler that Martin Senour recommends for bare metal, fiberglass, galvanized steel, cured body filler, aluminum, OEM enamels, and OEM lacquers. I like everything about it except the ugly green color.

Last edited by Centerline; 12-01-2009 at 11:14 PM.
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Old 12-01-2009, 11:22 PM
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Look's very good..
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Old 12-02-2009, 08:07 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by kenseth17
I've used it. I'm curious, So how, or what in it makes it etch? Is there an acid in it?
Not sure, but it is without a doubt the best epoxy primer on the market, hands down regardless of price. Far superior to anything PPG or DuPont has to offer.

Vince
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Old 12-02-2009, 08:48 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Centerline


The results were outstanding when you consider it was not painted in a booth and the conditions weren't optimum.
Looks excellent to me!

Good suggestions for folks like me that are trying to learn painting techniques.

How are you keeping the dust down?
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Old 12-02-2009, 09:40 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Frisco
.......How are you keeping the dust down?
Without a booth its always hard to keep dust down.... even in a booth you can get little dust nibs. What I do is blow the immediate area off and let the whole area sit for at least 20 minutes. Then I wipe down the piece with wax and grease remover before I shoot the paint. The trick is to move slowly around the area while you're doing anything so you don' t kick up any dust that might remain. Of course spraying will kick up some but that's why I try to spray as far above the floor as possible. If you notice the gas tank was mounted on a home made mini rotisserie above my welding table a good 4+ feet off the floor and the front edge of the table was covered with masking paper. That way, based on the direction I would be spraying any dust that was kicked up by spraying would (hopefully) move away from the piece.
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Old 12-02-2009, 11:03 AM
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Another trick I used when spraying small parts in my garage is to first dust the floor with a little clear to seal the dust to the floor. Yes it waste a little clear, but I figure it's a wash as now I don't have to sand some clear off to get rid of dust nibs.

Vince
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Old 12-02-2009, 11:16 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by kenseth17
I've used it. I'm curious, So how, or what in it makes it etch? Is there an acid in it?
Zinc Phosphate...it kinda etches but as with etching primer (phosphric acid),just spraying it on is not etching nearly as well as scrubbing ospho in by hand and then epoxying...I've tried it both ways...
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Old 12-02-2009, 05:56 PM
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Originally Posted by 302 Z28
Not sure, but it is without a doubt the best epoxy primer on the market, hands down regardless of price. Far superior to anything PPG or DuPont has to offer.

Vince
Other than price and Barry being available on the phone, Why do you say this? Proof? Experience?
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Old 12-02-2009, 06:19 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Centerline
OK, the technical term is etching filler (I changed my original post to reflect that fact). Its Martin Senour Chromate Free Etching Filler Part # 15211 with 15212 hardener. It's a two part etching filler that Martin Senour recommends for bare metal, fiberglass, galvanized steel, cured body filler, aluminum, OEM enamels, and OEM lacquers. I like everything about it except the ugly green color.
Guess I am wrong, does look like etch. Must admit not familar with nor have used any Martin senour products. Sorry.
And weird, the PDS says can be directly topcoat, not often you see that. I am guessing the 15212 is really an acid/reducer, not an activator?
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Old 12-02-2009, 06:28 PM
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Originally Posted by 48cad
Other than price and Barry being available on the phone, Why do you say this? Proof? Experience?
Because I tried a test. I had the metal four piece hood of my 34 primed with PPG DPLF epoxy primer. It had been primed for over three months sitting in my garage so you can't say it wasn't cured. After reading a thread in this forum about PPG DPLF wiping right off after cure with a lacquer thinner wet rag I tried it. Sure enough it came right off, I cleaned off all four pieces of my hood with a lacquer thinner soaked rag. I then primed it with SPI epoxy primer and let it cure for a week. Tried the same test as with the PPG epoxy. The SPI primer was unfazed, not even a mark. I challenge anyone who dis-believes this to try it and see. If you have never used SPI epoxy IMHO you have no right to challenge it. Use it and you will be convinced it is the best epoxy primer on the market.

Vince
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