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Old 08-26-2009, 04:12 PM
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sugar in the fuel tank, finally have now seen what it does...

ok well after all these years of wrenching on cars for ppl it finally happened.

got a car in the shop today right now up on the lift that has been sabotaged with sugar in the tank!

and now personally get to see exactly what happens in the tank of an electric in-tank style fuel tank when sugar is put in it

it clogs up the filter sock screen really super badly with slimey nasty sticky goo and burns up the pump until it quits and therefore disables the car

we had just put a new pump module assembly in this car in early june for the lady who owns it. a really great running 99 lumina with 3800 engine and 161k miles

she said is was losing rpm slowly until it would go no more and stopped on the highway about 8 miles out from town here

the new pump module assembly had been making a VERY loud screeching high pitch noise for a long while

we noticed this when we had the car in the shop a couple days ago because the CEL was flashing and the engine was in limp mode

ended up being a clogged over bad condition injector on number 6

so swapped it for a good used one from another injector rail we had laying around

also put new plugs and wires on it because all were real old and number 6 one was also covered caked in crud

i am thinking maybe it was burnt sugar

she is in the middle of a divorce and child custody battle and so she is not surprised one bit this has happened and knows who did it.

shes a nmice old church kind of lady who never has done anyone wrong ever that i could ever tell and i cnt beleive what a person can or will do to good people,. its crazy how evil and vindictive so many people are in this world, something like this just reminds you how much so its true.

anyways, she is coming to town to the shop to see it here in a bit to see the parts and damage, so i have to leave and go over there now, but i have internet over there as well now.,


she will have to file it with the police as a report of damage etc and try to file it on her insurance, since we cannot claim it as being a defective pump at the parts store since it was sugared

the pump cost 372 dollars with tax- the most expensive one ever to date that we have replaced

now i have a question regarding the fuel in the tank

we are going to buy a used tank for 30 bucks at the yard since it will be cheaper and quicker than having it flushed out at the radiator shop.

the fuel i wonder if it may be safe enough to use the top half of it from the tank if i filter it with a silk or cotton fabric filter


they say that sugar does not dissolve in gas in which i dont deny,,
but i have to differ to a certain degree because it at least halfway dissolved in this tank of fuel. enough so to turn into alot of goo slime crap nasty crap yet i also see many grains of sugar undissolved as well, feels like sand on the tank baffle inside.

supposedly it only dissolves down enough to have a teaspoon in a 15 gallon tank

or so i have read on a site on the net.

but who knows how accurate their test was.

all i know for sure is that it severely clogged up the screen sock filter on the module.


any facts or suggestions would be great.

kind of hate to waste all of 16 gallons of new fuel

thanks

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Last edited by fast68; 08-26-2009 at 04:20 PM.
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Old 08-26-2009, 05:09 PM
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This brings back 'sweet' memories

Back in '95, I worked on a '94 Ford Mustang. It had been sugared.

His insurance company sent over a inspector to survey the damage. After he saw all 8 of the stuck fuel injectors, and the sugar granules in the fuel tank fill tube, they paid for a new engine, 8 injectors, and a new fuel rail, and the cleaning of the fuel tank, and supply lines. They also paid for a new fuel pump. The customer had to purchase the new fuel filter though.

Over all, I thought his insurance company treated him like their 'chairman of the board'.
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Old 08-26-2009, 05:54 PM
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I would rather waste $35 worth of gas than screw it up again.
Just my .02

Shane
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Old 08-26-2009, 06:10 PM
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I agree put new gas in it's not worth the risk (do you really want to do it all over again for free?)
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Old 08-26-2009, 07:49 PM
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X3 on that one buddy. It's much better to charge her (or the shop) 35$ in few fuel, instead of messing it all up again and having to start from scratch. Gas, like water, can dissolve things, and i'm sure that dissolved sugar is still bad for a car
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Old 09-04-2009, 12:26 PM
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http://www.snopes.com/autos/grace/sugar.asp
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Old 09-04-2009, 01:22 PM
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That Snopes article, does not say anything about dissolved sugar water's effect.

That Mustang had traces of sugar syrup in all 8 injectors, and they were stuck, and would not click during a manual test. What was in the fuel filter, and the fuel tank, was not sugar granules. It was a thick sludge.

What was in the fuel inlet, was dry sugar that was clumped together, and some sugar granules.

Last edited by carsavvycook; 09-04-2009 at 01:29 PM.
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Old 09-04-2009, 01:31 PM
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It says sugar will not dissolve in gasoline, or at least not in any appreciable amount.

Solubility of organic compounds

The principle outlined above under polarity, that like dissolves like, is the usual guide to solubility with organic systems. For example, petroleum jelly will dissolve in gasoline because both petroleum jelly and gasoline are hydrocarbons. It will not, on the other hand, dissolve in alcohol or water, since the polarity of these solvents is too high. Sugar will not dissolve in gasoline, since sugar is too polar in comparison with gasoline. A mixture of gasoline and sugar can therefore be separated by filtration, or extraction with water.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Solubility
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Old 09-04-2009, 01:41 PM
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What you just posted, also does not say anything about previously dissolved sugar, and gasoline.
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Old 09-04-2009, 02:00 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by carsavvycook
What you just posted, also does not say anything about previously dissolved sugar, and gasoline.
I was replying to this in particular: "Gas, like water, can dissolve things, and i'm sure that dissolved sugar is still bad for a car". Which implies gas can dissolve sugar. It can't.
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Old 09-04-2009, 09:11 PM
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I have had the debate about sugar in gas, I've been doing this since the 60s and had never seen it so assumed it was something that happened in older type fuel systems. I have a different opinion now days. About 8 years ago I had a customer with a 7 liter 1966 Ford and the car had ran fine when he was out for a summer drive and when he started it the next day the carb flooded over. After cleaning the mess up and trying a restart, he bent a pushrod. He changed it and promptly bent another. I told him to pull the heads and bring them in. Every valve, stem and head, as well as combustion chamber was coated with a caramel substance and I had to use a propane torch to melt the stuff enough to remove half the valves. Caramel for those that aren't into confections is a substance made when sugar is heated up. I did not have the material analyzed, maybe it wasn't sugar but it had a very confectionery smell when heated up. There aren't any other materials I can think that would create such a sweet a sticky substance. I use snopes regularly, but I have also found them to be very wrong on occasion. Wikipedia...well ANYONE can edit and post and have no knowledge of the topic whatsoever, I have seen several errors there as well...make that a lot. It is unlikely that all the sugar dissolves but it doesn't take much to turn to caramel in the heat of combustion.
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Old 09-04-2009, 10:08 PM
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How much sugar would it take to do that?

What is the operating temperature inside a combustion chamber?

Last edited by Rendus; 09-04-2009 at 10:14 PM.
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Old 09-06-2009, 03:52 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Rendus
What is the operating temperature inside a combustion chamber?
Not sure about in the chamber, but 1400 degrees F would not be uncommon in the exhaust header. Might be 1700-1800 in the chamber.
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Old 09-06-2009, 04:41 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Rendus
It says sugar will not dissolve in gasoline, or at least not in any appreciable amount.
The snopes article does say however:
"Yet even though the sugar will not reach the engine in either syrup or solid state, it can clog the fuel filter or fuel injectors, a circumstance which could stop a car."


Jon
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Old 09-06-2009, 09:13 AM
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E 85 ?

what about new blends of fuel. My older brother told me that when he was a kid someone was stealing gas out of my dad's tractors. dad sugared the tanks in the fall when they were parked and waited until a couple of kids cars had gummed up engines carmel inside. as described , drained and rinsed the tractor tanks and used the old gas to burn weeds along the ditches.
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