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-   -   A test on primer color vs SOLID base color outcome (http://www.hotrodders.com/forum/test-primer-color-vs-solid-base-color-outcome-146458.html)

Bee4Me 10-11-2008 08:32 PM

A test on primer color vs SOLID base color outcome
 
I decided to prove a point on primer color and base color outcome reguarding primer color. Which IMO I believe I have proven that it really does not matter with SOLID colors and as long as you provide proper COVERAGE,it's a mute point.I realize that this is with ONE brand of base,SPI Red, but I find the same to be true with different lines as well.
I made the test panel from scrap sheet metal 3'x2',180 sanded,cleaned and masked off into 1/4's,This is EPOXY primer and with 4 colors.
White,Black,Light Gray,Dark Gray.
Here is the results.

#1 is the test panel with a 400 wet sand.

http://i29.photobucket.com/albums/c2...eds/panel1.jpg
Second is after the first coat. 1:1 shot with a Iwata LPH-400,1.3 with the purple cap at 20# air,2 3/4 turns out fluid and fan full turned in 3/4 turn.
http://i29.photobucket.com/albums/c2...eds/panel4.jpg
Another view.
http://i29.photobucket.com/albums/c2...eds/panel3.jpg
Finished panel. I shut the air down to 15# and around 3 turns out on the fluid and around 1 turn in on the fan. I did this to screw with the psi to see what if any difference it made,which was actually better IMO.This is with 3 coats total then,2 coats of Universial clear as shot,no fixing of anything with my other LPH-400-LV,1.4 at 25# air.
http://i29.photobucket.com/albums/c2...eds/panel6.jpg
Center shot of the panel.
http://i29.photobucket.com/albums/c2...nel5center.jpg
Black & White end.
http://i29.photobucket.com/albums/c2...ds/panel10.jpg
Gray's end.
http://i29.photobucket.com/albums/c2...eds/panel8.jpg
Overall oposite end.
http://i29.photobucket.com/albums/c2...eds/panel7.jpg
One more from a different angle.
http://i29.photobucket.com/albums/c2...eds/panel9.jpg

Bottom line is,Coverage IS coverage with SOLID colors and primer color has made NO difference IMO in the overall outcome of THIS color.
I'll check it out tommorow outside and SEE if anything changes,but I doubt it.
FWIW,MikeK.

MARTINSR 10-11-2008 11:07 PM

Awesome job!

Without a doubt this test is limited to THIS color, but at least you know using this color and this brand it is good. That is some awesome covering paint!

I wonder why Barryk didn't know this?

Brian

MAUSS 10-12-2008 08:01 AM

I was wondering about the SPI Red... my Trans Am (Mayan Red) is due for a paint job and I was considering it. Looks good.

BarryK 10-12-2008 09:06 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by MARTINSR
Awesome job!

Without a doubt this test is limited to THIS color, but at least you know using this color and this brand it is good. That is some awesome covering paint!

I wonder why Barryk didn't know this?

Brian

I had no idea it would cover that good and never tested for this.
I would have guessed 4-8 coats with that color for full hiding, and that is why we recommend a uniform white. If I decide to paint the vette this color it will be sealed with white and only two coats to get sun reflection I want-that is what the paint was made for not matching cars.

Great test Mike!

Bee4Me 10-12-2008 11:26 AM

I actually had good coverage after the second coat but really wanted to check if there was any difference in color. I flubbed that part as I got so involved with it,I forgot to take some pics of the second coat but after it flashed and sprayed a little waterbourn g&wr it did look "done".
Looks good on my shoes as well. :rolleyes:
I have the DeVilbliss bag set up in my base gun and when I flipped the gun upside down to check how much paint I had left,the corner apperantly didn't lock closed and dumped about 1/2 a pt all over the floor. :mad:
Main reason I have no pics of the second coat,was kinda busy cleaning up my mess.
I plan on repeating the test on the back side with some CrossFire Red for a comparison of the 2.
One other note.
The LPH-400 with the Purple cap is absoutly KILLER for base. I attribute some of the positive outcome due to it's transfer efficiency.Laying paint ON the panel instead of all over the booth.Another fact with the LPH is getting close in.I was averaging around 4" off panel and when doing test sprays backing off to 5-6" really made a difference in pattern and coverage. Iwata always states to get close and I have always been a 6-7" sprayer but after forcing myself to get in close,realize the difference.

baddbob 10-13-2008 09:34 PM

Like I've always said: full coverage is full coverage and it's the only way you'll achieve true color and consistancy-period. Repairability can be a real PITA if you're dealing with a job that was not sprayed to full coverage especially if it's over an undercoat that's way darker or lighter than the color itself.

Do your black and white test panel like Mike has shown, count how many coats are needed for full coverage-that is the minimum number of coats you should apply. If you find your paint needs 5-6 coats for full coverage then FIND A BETTER PAINT LINE

jcclark 10-14-2008 05:14 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by MAUSS
I was wondering about the SPI Red... my Trans Am (Mayan Red) is due for a paint job and I was considering it. Looks good.

From what I heard, SPI no longer sells that paint. :pimp:

baddbob 10-14-2008 05:28 AM

Yeah, that's a shame SPI basecoat is not going to be available anymore, the Viper Blue also reached full coverage in three coats.

MARTINSR 10-14-2008 08:25 AM

Maybe the PPG hitmen were sent out to rough up Barry! You know, just like the little guy who comes up with a gas saving device is silenced by big oil. :rolleyes:

Making paint is a whole different story from primers and clears. From what I understand SPI makes a great primer and clear, colors just cut into that too much.

"Do what you do best, and be the best at it" was probably said at one of their meetings. They decided to drop the paint line and do just that.

At least that is what I picked up on my hidden microphone. :evil:

Brian

Bee4Me 10-14-2008 11:42 AM

Some colors are still available as Barry used the last of his stash to finish up what he had. But,Yes it's a done deal for now.
Point I was making is coverage of SOLID colors over different primers and basically,just proving something to myself more than anything.
ANY quality base "should" cover in 3-4 coats IMO and like bob said,if it does not,you could be in for trouble later on.This would be true also doing a panel paint job.Less than complete coverage and your going to have a mismatched POS on your hands.
Then you get into the aspect of color shift in direct sunlight. This "can" be a custom effect and as Barry explained to me with this Red,When shot over White primer with 2 coats will achieve this as the sun goes thru the Red and the white primer brightens it up. Techinal stuff above me at work here as thats the way this base was designed but also addresses the idea of primer affecting the color outcome which goes back to less than complete coverage.
Back to SPI, Like you said Brian, He just had SO much on the plate as well as the fact that SPI sells to "anyone" and Barry being who he is,was just getting a lot of grief and expense from inexperienced and hack painters and decided the base line was more trouble than it was worth. Which is a shame.
Damn good product IMO,especially the SS Black.
Still got the C/F test coming up and if I have time,will do one on Chromabase.


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