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Old 10-23-2011, 01:57 PM
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Timing advise and help needed

I have a sbc 350/330 hp crate motot with Demon 3 duece setup and am asking if someone else has similar setup that could tell me what there timing is set at. I can not get this setup to run properly and am ready to go back to good old 4 barrel. Am using mallory no vaccum disstributor. Any advise or thoughts? Thanks.

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Old 10-23-2011, 03:16 PM
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Do a forum search. There are two different threads I can think of that had questions about that very subject.
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Old 10-23-2011, 05:47 PM
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Thanks cool daddy, I have tried search but no useful info, unless I asked wrong. I was thinking there may be someone who had the Demon Six Pak like I used who could tell me there settings or experience.
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Old 10-23-2011, 07:01 PM
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Timing advice

I curve lots of distributors and suggest the following curve:

Initial timing: 16-18*
Total timing: 36-38* (20* mechanical) full advance by 2800-3000 rpm
Vacuum advance: 10* max.

Ron
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Old 10-24-2011, 08:56 AM
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Thanks for the info Ron. I have a Mallory 5048201 distributor that has no vaccum advance cannister. First time I have used a distributor w/o vaccum cannister. Folks say 3 dueces take more btdc timing? What has been your experience. Have tried adjusting timing to every concievable setting. Changed plug wires yesterday, no help. Motor runs hot now with timing at 16* btdc.. Can't seem to find right settings. With the Demon six pack setup you can not put a distributor with vaccum cannister due to space requirements. Thanks in advance for your ideas and thoughts.
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Old 10-24-2011, 09:13 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by STUDE55DOG
Thanks for the info Ron. I have a Mallory 5048201 distributor that has no vaccum advance cannister. First time I have used a distributor w/o vaccum cannister. Folks say 3 dueces take more btdc timing? What has been your experience. Have tried adjusting timing to every concievable setting. Changed plug wires yesterday, no help. Motor runs hot now with timing at 16* btdc.. Can't seem to find right settings. With the Demon six pack setup you can not put a distributor with vaccum cannister due to space requirements. Thanks in advance for your ideas and thoughts.
If you're running an old 3 deuce manifold it could want additional initial timing, but the initial timing is more dependant on how much vacuum you have at idle. If it's low because your cam has a lot of duration/overlap then you'll need more initial. If the cam is mild, not so much so. But as long as the intake manifold is a decent design and doesn't suffer from distribution problems, it shouldn't be hard to tune for.

Are you using a progressive linkage set-up? Is it adjusted right?

IMHO you'd really do better w/a vacuum advance unless the cam is radical.

It should not run hot because of the timing w/it set to 16 BTDC. Makes me think the timing tab/damper mark isn't showing true TDC. DETERMINING TDC will allow you to be sure the timing tab and damper are correctly indicating TDC.

MAKE A TIMING TAPE to see what the total timing is, w/o needing to use a dial back timing light. You can also buy a timing tape, get one that matches the diameter of your damper.

What is the vacuum at idle and what cam is in it?
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Old 10-25-2011, 10:05 AM
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Thanks for the info Cobalt. I have progressive linkage and it is set up correctly. Vaccum at 900rpms is 18-19. The cam specs are
Lift-intake 435 exhaust 460
Duration @.050; intake 212 exhaust 222
Fuel pressure is set at 5
Will do the timing tape soon.
I look forward to your thoughts after seeing the above info. Thanks.
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Old 10-25-2011, 11:53 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by STUDE55DOG
Thanks for the info Cobalt. I have progressive linkage and it is set up correctly. Vaccum at 900rpms is 18-19. The cam specs are
Lift-intake 435 exhaust 460
Duration @.050; intake 212 exhaust 222
Fuel pressure is set at 5
Will do the timing tape soon.
I look forward to your thoughts after seeing the above info. Thanks.
You say you cannot get the engine to run right. Exactly what is it doing? Was the engine ever running right? You mentioned it's running hot. How much temp are you seeing, and under what conditions- idling in the drive, stop and go, light throttle cruise, HW/70 mph, or ?

There were a number of different timing tabs/damper lines used through the years that can mung TDC as seen at the timing marks. Have you verified TDC? You can get a close idea using a piece of copper wire a couple feet long (no way to fall into the cylinder) to indicate TDC as you carefully turn the engine over w/a socket and breaker bar on the damper bolt to see if the tab/damper line is at least in the ballpark. Then if there's ANY question (or you just want to be exact) you can use the piston stop method to nail it down exactly.
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Old 10-28-2011, 11:08 AM
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Colbalt, thanks again for your response. It continues to have a miss at any rpm, any speed, have changed distributor module, retimed. Gets hot when idling, driving in traffic, up to 260 plus. Have had the demon manifold replaced due to misalignment issues. Not sure where to go next. Have talked to others who have had tuning issues. Thanks again for your ideas and help.
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Old 10-28-2011, 05:31 PM
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Isolate the dead hole by pulling/replacing plug wires until you find the one that it runs the same, wire on or wire off. That's the dead hole.

Pull the plugs and do a compression test, and if it looks iffy, pull the valve cover and check for a broken spring or sticking valve, burnt valve/seat, etc.

Were the wires checked or changed and plugs changed?

What does a vacuum gauge show? Needle high and steady, or low, jittery, or what?

Is this crate engine the same as when it was new, parts-wise?
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Old 10-31-2011, 10:50 AM
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Colbalt, I replaced all spark plug wires, no dead cylinder. Vaccum is 18 and steady. Still have miss at idle and up. No changes to crate motor. Have not done a compression check. This motor has less than a thousand miles if that on it. I am going to try and find a distributor that has vaccum advance cannister and compare. Once again thanks for your suggestions.
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Old 10-31-2011, 08:27 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by STUDE55DOG
Colbalt, I replaced all spark plug wires, no dead cylinder. Vaccum is 18 and steady. Still have miss at idle and up. No changes to crate motor. Have not done a compression check. This motor has less than a thousand miles if that on it. I am going to try and find a distributor that has vaccum advance cannister and compare. Once again thanks for your suggestions.
If it has a miss, the vacuum gauge should indicate it by dipping every time it misses. So either your vacuum gauge is a well-damped "economy/MPG"-type gauge instead of an undamped "diagnostic"-type gauge, or it's something other than an actual miss you're hearing.

An exhaust leak comes to mind- that can sound like a miss, or a valve out of adjustment even.
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Old 10-31-2011, 09:04 PM
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Here...try this.......

With engine idling...spray water(from a spray bottle) on each exhaust port(on the header or manifold.) IF the cylinder is firing it will make the water sizzle....if not,that's the cylinder that ain't firing.
6sally6
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