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Old 11-08-2010, 06:35 PM
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timing answer, for better 1/4mil times!!

Hi again, hotrodders, hello, well i was in the track the last weekend and i didnt like it the time of 14.95, 2.4 60ft the car loose power up to 4000 in the 3d shift, the run was like this, second shift in 5500 rpm, 3rd shift in 5500rpm, and after that in the 4000rpm range loose a little the power, here the mods of the car....

my mods are, lunati voodoo .504,.492 lift 268/276, dish pistons, street dominator intake dual plane, street avenger 770 cfm carb, the rear axle is 3.73 and the diameter of my (very very old tires) is 27x10 inches, and the tranny its rebuild but stock, (original converter), the car is my daily drive got A/AC here is the video, http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MJ-s2V8v1BE

the tires are full street tires very old, the car its all complete.

THE QUESTION IS, the timing is in 12, how much you think would be nice for dont loose the power in high rpm?? wich racetires diameter you think would be good??

if you need more info, or i didnt explain, dont hesitate, i know my english its not the best, please if need something let me know...

and a lot of thanks!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

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Old 11-08-2010, 07:14 PM
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What type of cylinder heads? what exactly are the piston type and dish volume, you will need a healthy compression ratio for that cam, the stock converter is not helping.

What type of distributor? you could use more base timing more like 18 or 20, then you will need to limit your mechanical advance, depending on the type of heads you want about 34-36 total advance at 3000 rpm without vacuum advance.

There could be a thousand reasons you are running low ET's, is the car hooking up at all or are you smoking the tires off?
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Old 11-08-2010, 07:33 PM
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i know im not helping but the heads are stock with the necessary springs for the cam, a very very little ported, i wish i could give you numbers but here in this city its impossible, the pistons are morosa dish stock (but new)in .040 with 4 valve relief you can see it in the video, aint got the compression exactly but i know this cam at least needs 9.00 and i dont have it, i think i got 8 or 8.5, i know it works up to 2200rpm but for now i dont wanna use a converter for the $$, my distributor its the original with a msd 6a, the tires jump in the start and jump and drift in the second shift, when they loose the grip the first time my times where in the 15.30 and the 15.00...

the distributor works with vaccum, so if want to put the base in 18 or 20 i need to block the advance in high rpm?? the weights of the distributor are the stocks

i know the balance in my car its not the best for know, maybe with converter and compression i could reach the 13s here in the sea level, but for now i dont care run in 14, but i wish i could make the 14.70 more easy...

with the same tires but original cam and original springs and stock manifold and a stock quadrajet the car raced the 15.10 so... im a little pissed off... jejejeje
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Old 11-08-2010, 07:44 PM
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drag racing takes $$$$ to go fast!
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Old 11-08-2010, 07:51 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by BigRoy1978
drag racing takes $$$$ to go fast!
i know, go big or go home!!, but everyone makes what is in his range, this last months i spend a lot of money in the engine tranny and diff, thats why the converter needs to wait a littlee
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Old 11-08-2010, 08:26 PM
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why? its not gonna run like it should without the right converter, or good tires.

drag racing and dirt circle racing share a couple things....gotta have everything that works with everything else, and you HAVE to have a good set or tires...its the only part of your car that contacts the ground....think about it lol
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Old 11-08-2010, 08:41 PM
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The adjustments to the distributor may help you out some but it is not going to get you into the 13's, bigroy is correct.

but since you asked maybe you can find out some more about setting your timing

Make the adjustments to the base timing and the mechanical advance first, then add some vacuum advance after. The vacuum advance will not be in effect at WOT while making a pass anyhow

Make sure that you have verified TDC and that your timing pointer is accurate at TDC, get a timing tape on the damper that goes up to 60 deg BTDC

Test the amount the mechanical advance is adding,,,parking brake on, kids clear dude

Rev the motor to 3500+ or till it stops advancing the timing, and adjust the distributor till you read 36 BTDC, then without distributor moving let the thing idle at 700 rpm and take a base timing reading. Check it out and post what you find, imo chances are that you will need to limit the mechancial advance to run the correct base timing for that cam.
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Old 11-08-2010, 08:43 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by BigRoy1978
why? its not gonna run like it should without the right converter, or good tires.

drag racing and dirt circle racing share a couple things....gotta have everything that works with everything else, and you HAVE to have a good set or tires...its the only part of your car that contacts the ground....think about it lol
i know that, thats why im asking which diameter tires would be better, maybe with a 26 x10 run better without converter than a 28xXX without converter, i know its not the best cause the cam needs a converter and compression, but as i said, everyone fights in his range....
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Old 11-08-2010, 09:17 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Custom10
The adjustments to the distributor may help you out some but it is not going to get you into the 13's, bigroy is correct.

but since you asked maybe you can find out some more about setting your timing

Make the adjustments to the base timing and the mechanical advance first, then add some vacuum advance after. The vacuum advance will not be in effect at WOT while making a pass anyhow

Make sure that you have verified TDC and that your timing pointer is accurate at TDC, get a timing tape on the damper that goes up to 60 deg BTDC

Test the amount the mechanical advance is adding,,,parking brake on, kids clear dude

Rev the motor to 3500+ or till it stops advancing the timing, and adjust the distributor till you read 36 BTDC, then without distributor moving let the thing idle at 700 rpm and take a base timing reading. Check it out and post what you find, imo chances are that you will need to limit the mechancial advance to run the correct base timing for that cam.
Thanks!! this is very usefull, i will came the next time with a 26x10 slicks and a 28x10 slicks time to let you know how help and with the timing in better shape, i can get the tires just to try, thank you very much guys, really apreacciate.
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Old 11-08-2010, 09:28 PM
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Timing:

24deg base at idle 10-12deg of mechanical advance maxing at 34-36deg @2800-3200 rpm.

Shorten/limit the mech advance curve from 20 (stock) to 10-12deg. To allow the increased idle timing without excessive top end advance.

Vacuum advance needs to be shortened too to around 12deg.
Use ported vacuum. Get an adjustable vac advance.
Start by verifying true TDC using a piston stop. Correct the timing tab 0 TDC mark.
Them mark the balancer for 24deg (1/15th circumfrence) and 36deg BTDC (1/10th circumfrence) Or get a (Mr. Gasket) balancer timing tape.
Correct timing is critical. 34-36deg at max advance.

Do not "power brake" the car at launch. Launch at or very near idle rpm.

Get some sticky tires. P235-60-15 drag radials or ET streets.

Get some rear Air Lift "drag bags" and replace the rear control arm bushings.
Rear lower control arm relocation brackets to correct the lower control arm geometry will help too. Get a drive shaft safety loop. Replace the drive shaft U joints.

Stock heads flow like crap and need a ton of porting to flow. Not a little.
The cam needs a 10" 3500 stall converter and high compression .

If the heads are 76cc open chamber smoggers replace with a small chamber head,
If you are on a low budget find some #416 305HO heads FULLY PORT THEM w 1.94" in valves. Install with a thin shim .015" head gasket to max the cr.
Shave them down if you can.
Stock head casting use a Champion RV8C spark plug.
Do not waste your money by paying someone else to port your stock heads
Do it yourself and learn. Stock heads need FULL EFFORT porting to make any power.
Otherwise find some aftermarket high perf heads. The power is in the heads.

Get a 1" divided carb spacer or replace the manifold with a performer RPM.
The motor must have fuel at high rpm Carter P4594 elect fuel pump. 3/8" fuel line. Redo the in tank pick up tube. Flair or slash cut the end of the tube for max flow.
Carb: notched rear float and rear jet extensions.
Jetting 70-73 primary 78-84 sec 4.5 power valve.
vac sec spring: plain steel, purple or yellow is best.
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Old 11-08-2010, 09:40 PM
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What is the 1/8th mile et and mph? What is the 1/4 mile MPH?

Best max spark timing will be indicated by highest MPH. 34-35-36-37deg.

But you need 22-24-26deg base timing at idle to et the best.
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Old 11-08-2010, 09:48 PM
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This car needs a 4.56:1 gear with a 27" tire.

With just 3.73's this car needs a short short, short rear tire.
Consider a short but sticky P225-50-15 drag radial for drag racing.
With the "drag bags" and relocation brackets and a drive shaft loop
it will be a whole different animal at the track.. Put a little extra air in the right air bag.

Degree the cam and move to a 104 intake Centerline.
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Old 11-08-2010, 10:25 PM
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A lot of info here! and everything make sense, no doubt very usefull, i really apreacciate, thanks for all the things, F-bird, custom10, with this info i can reformulate a few things on my plans, now i have a north for my heads and with a few things more, i will check the timing as you said come with news in a few weeks after the next drag event!
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Old 11-08-2010, 10:35 PM
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i dont have the 1/8 mile, the track its starting after two years problems, and the speed its and estimate of 98mphr 100mphr cause im in 5000rpm at the end of the track, the ''teory'' says im in that speed for the ratio gears and tires, but i dont know how exactly its that, and the 4.56 sounds very very scary, this is my daily driver, really, i use my car 6 days for week, 4.56.... holy****!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! with a th350 jejeje!! damn it!
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Old 11-08-2010, 10:40 PM
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the tire you said for a 3.73 rear axle its 24 inches for 8, i've got a doubt, that size in the track would be a problem for the traction i think, 26x10 sounds better... =S what you think???????????
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