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Old 05-08-2006, 11:20 AM
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trans question

have a c4 automatic trans that wont go in to gear,when put it on I didn't put any fluid in the torgue converter. I'm not sure but will it fill up or do I have to take it back apart? Tried putting fluid in while running didn't do anything.

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Old 05-09-2006, 03:39 AM
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Alright, C4 installation 101. When you put the torque converter in, make sure it's ALL the way in. You'll feel it and you'll know. You're using ATF Type F right? Bolt it all up right. When you fill up the transmission through the dipstick, the converter will fill up. Fluid is constantly running through the transmission, in and out of the torque converter... everywhere. You're checking the transmission fluid level while it's running and in park right? I can tell you that there's not enough fluid in the transmission right now. Fill it up with about 4 quarts, start it, check the fluid, and keep adding fluid, WHILE it's running, until you're perfectly full with fluid. Do not overfill. When you get the right amount of fluid in it, you'll shift into gear, and drive away! =) Did you do a full rebuild on it? The C4 in my '65 is beautiful, and it's a great transmission. Let me know how it goes.
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Old 05-09-2006, 04:10 AM
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Iīve bought several torque convertors and the instructions require you to add fluid to the convertor before mounting it.
Here are some instructions from TCI recommending one quart be poured into convertor before installation.
Run it without prefilling and you will fry it, I know
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Old 05-09-2006, 04:15 AM
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I work at a tranny shop, R&R. I put the torque converter in, and fill it up through the filler tube, start it up, and start fillin' it up right after 'til it's full. It's nice to have a pump that comes down from the ceiling. But yeah, fill it, start it, fill it up all the way, put it in gear, drive it around for 5 or 10 minutes, put it in park, check the fluid, make sure it's full, turn it off, and check for leaks. If you're not leaking and you're shifting good, you're in business. Hopefully you didn't run the tranny too long without enough fluid in it.

Last edited by 65Stanger; 05-09-2006 at 04:44 AM.
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Old 05-09-2006, 05:33 AM
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Itīs important to fill the convertor before installation, it needs to be primed.
Mine showed full didīnt leak, shifted but later on the convertor croaked big time.
Boy did that convertor rattle, it was a TCI piece and my fault for being to hasty.
Here, check out step four page two of this Art Carr instruction sheet.

Last edited by malc; 05-09-2006 at 05:58 AM.
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Old 05-09-2006, 07:42 AM
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65stanger,
it's great that you want to post and help.... but wiser if you run the question by the guys in the shop first.....you and we will all learn more...post an answer after school and work

in this case, fattyford didn't give a clue about the tranny or tell what he has/has not done to it to tell why it's not going into gear

not even...was it fine before he removed it
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Old 05-09-2006, 08:10 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by fattyford
have a c4 automatic trans that wont go in to gear,when put it on I didn't put any fluid in the torgue converter. I'm not sure but will it fill up or do I have to take it back apart? Tried putting fluid in while running didn't do anything.
the average c-4 trans holds roughly 8 1/2 to 9 1/2 qts depending on the pan and wether or not it has an auxillary cooler. 65stanger is accurate on fillup procedure, (although type F is rarely used anymore)
check the fluid with car off, see if u can read on the stick, if so, start it, and recheck, if it has gone down, the pump is working and u just need to finish filling it up. the fluid level should be within the crosshatches when hot idling, in park...
whats the year,make, and model of the car u put it in? if its late enough, it may be a c-5, it looks basically the same as a c-4, but has a clutch in the torque converter. (also can hold up to or around 10 1/2 qts of fluid, and does NOT take type F)

p.s. 65stanger, keep up the efforts man, R&R is a very unrespected position in the trans business, ive been doing it for toooooo long. grew up in a trans shop and have been giving builders fits for years. (especially primadonas..)
got into diagnostics a few years ago, and have enjoyed it a bunch. not just from what ive learned, but the experience itself can rewarding especially when u figure out a problem and fix it. seeing happy customers has always made my day.
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Old 05-09-2006, 08:23 AM
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First off thanks for the replies,bought the trans used supposedly working did everything your talking about filled to the dipstick cranked car up filled to crosshair let run for little longer then tried to put it in gear and nothing, shut motor off and fluid started coming out any where it could like it was overfull.
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Old 05-09-2006, 08:29 AM
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yeah, do keep up the efforts
65stanger...not meaning to be negative....but as an example of why to ask at the shop first.....

I do have a bad case of CRS....I do phone or email friends to double check often....your talking about tech info that's now 40+ years old....nobody (?) can recall correct/exact that far back

ps: original C4 clutches material needs "F", slim chance his clutches are the original material...
and we all mess up sometimes, on about 5 posts last week I said mount a crystal clear plastic "Fram" gas filter to catch the crap coming from the tank before the pump if you don't have filter already...it's not a Fram,,,,, it's Puralotor filter!

Last edited by red65mustang; 05-09-2006 at 10:57 AM.
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Old 05-09-2006, 08:44 AM
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fattyford,
don't need to pull it if overfilled....

one of my "check simple first"....is the pump working at all....5 gal bucket, 2 lengths of 3/8" hose, disconnect the two lines at the radiator and start the car

should be a steady stream of fluid for roughly 2-3 qts....which will get the fill level back below normal

(add a "T" with a pipe plug on the pump side connect at the radiator makes a handy way to add 2-3 "new" qts if you beat on the tranny alot, change oil/change 2-3qts tranny fluid)
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Old 05-09-2006, 08:49 AM
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I just have the trans pump lines tied together so it pumping out then right back in this is in a 48 ford that is not done yet. But if the pump is pumping there is no reason why it shouldn't go in gear is there.
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Old 05-10-2006, 12:29 AM
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Very true. I just like to try and help out if I think I know the answer. The way that I read it was that he had just rebuilt the tranny before he put it in the car (I wouldn't put a used tranny in a car without having it overhauled so I kind of put my mindset to it), and that it wasn't going into gear. Same thing happened to me, and when I had it filled up correctly, everything was fine. Yeah I asked about the whole filling up the torque converter thing. My boss said that by the books yeah you're supposed to, and that he knows a few R&R guys who do it, but since the factory pre-lubes the converter it's okay to just fill'er up through the tube. Also, yeah, I wasn't thinking that his clutches probably weren't original! My C4 was all original when I serviced'er last (which I found out was DEFINITELY true once we opened it up.) and my boss filled her up with I think... +5? I don't recall exactly what it was, but it runs like a dream now. I should have gotten the information first before I ran my mouth! Live and learn. You're not being negative, you're helping me out alot by guiding me! I'm young, and still learning and learning. Oh, by the way, I'm 18 now! =) I've had my car for a year next month! Thanks for all your help Red. I really appreciate it and try to actually hear it, not just let it go in one ear and out the other. Or in one eye and out the other?

Last edited by 65Stanger; 05-10-2006 at 12:35 AM.
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Old 05-10-2006, 12:34 AM
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Thanks tnsmith10! You brightened my day! Yeah I know the feeling. Some guy came in leaking tons and tons of oil, told me it was tranny fluid and everything, usual "I think I know what's wrong but I have no clue" customer. Hehe. Whoever put his oil filter on his engine put it on wayyyy too tight , and it was leakin' out of it and down onto the trans (Front wheel drive Jetta I think it was). What I really enjoy more than customers though is when a friend's broken down somewhere (I know that sounds terrible) but I can get out to them and get them moving again. Makes me feel great. But yeah, I LOVE R&Ring, and after I pull it the builder lets me watch and I have learned tons about rebuilding. Currently learning transmission dissassembly and cleaning/resealing.
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Old 05-10-2006, 04:42 AM
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Happy B'-day 65 stanger....pm me a email address, wanna' send you a (a very useful) B-day present....complete/correct/easy to read wiring diagrams for your car....improving the worn out electrics are worth while projects for making your car run better (versus cleaning the gas tank)

fattyford, my $.02,

you don't know what caused the problem that made somebody remove the tranny period and not just repair and re-install it,
you don't know how many miles on the tranny and was it ever serviced and/or rebuilt (correctly)

pull it and take it to a shop for a teardown inspection, can be just 1 (or more) of 20(?) causes for not going into gear,...
shift shaft broken in the case (from "power shifting" the crap out of it?), plugged valve body, both?, etc.. etc...
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