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  #91 (permalink)  
Old 01-05-2009, 01:56 PM
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re: "European" cars with Buick 215-derived engines

Okay, I apologize for being very late to the party on this one... but if you guys are really into trivia perhaps you'd like a slightly more complete answer on the question "Name TWO production European cars that used a sixties Buick V8 in them. One of them had that motor up until just three or four years ago. One of their models may still have it for all I know."

Rover originally bought the design rights to the Buick aluminum V8 so that they could use it in their "P5" sedans. (They'd call them "saloons".) The P5 was later replaced by the "P6" model, which was later sold in the U.S. and Canadian market as the "3500S". (You might recognize the P6 as THE British police car... it appears in a lot of old movies including Monty Python's "Holy Grail".) Still later, Rover installed the same basic engine in their "SD1" model which was also exported to the U.S.A. and Canada.

Rover 3500S


Rover SD1


FWIW, it's not really accurate to call the Rover engine a "sixties Buick" because some details were redesigned or manufactured differently. Rover's version of the engine was produced in England, and was sand-cast whereas the original Buick design was made on semi-permanent tooling like a transmission case.

Of course Rover DID install their aluminum V8 in several generations of Range Rovers, ultimately bored and stroked up from 3.5L (215cid) to 4.6L. (After BMW bought Rover, Range Rovers were built with BMW engines. Now they're built with Ford engines.)

As mentioned by someone else already Rover sold their Buick-derived aluminum V8 to Morgan for use in the "Plus 8" model which was produced from 1968 through 2004.

Rover sold the engine to another independent manufacturer, TVR. TVR used Rover engines with displacements from 3.5L to 4.4L from 1983 through 1991. After that, TVR built their own engines. (Redesigned, but based on the Rover...)

A third tiny specialty manufacturer to use the Rover engine is "Westfield", who use (yes, still to this day!) it in their "SEight" model sports car. These cars looks like a Lotus "7". They've been built with displacements from 3.5L to 5.2L. Although Westfield sells "kit cars", most SEights are actually completely built to order for customers in Westfield's own shop.

Rover was part of British Leyland, and various British Leyland divisions used the Buick-derived Rover engines.

MG used the Rover V8 in two different models. The first was the "MGB GT V8" which was produced from 1973-76. MG planned to export this car - 11 left-hand-drive prototypes were built, it was engineered for U.S. crash and emissions requirements, and it was even shown at the New York Motor Show before British Leyland corporate management pulled the plug on all export sales due to internal politics. Specifically, the MGB GT V8 would have embarrased the heck out of Triumph because it seriously outperformed the TR6 and the Triumph 3L V8 "Stag". The second MG production model to use the Rover V8 was called the "RV8". It was produced from 1993-95. This car was also only produced in right-hand-drive configuration, but a large proportion of RV8's were exported to Japan.

MGB GT V8


MGB RV8


For serious trivia buff's, it might be interesting to note that in the early eighties some MG "Metro" subcompact hatchbacks were fitted with a special 90-degree all-aluminum V6 engine that was based on the familiar Buick/Rover V8. (It didn't use any parts from the Buick V6.) For about a month, these little cars completely dominated their rally racing class... until the rules were rewritten to prohibit them. They weren't really a "production car", but they were at least built by the "factory".

British Leyland's Triumph division used the Rover V8 in the TR8, which was mostly an export model (for North America).

After Rover stopped producing their version of the Buick-derived aluminum V8, TVR started and continued production of their own versions of it for awhile. The engine is still in production on an aftermarket basis - it can be bought as a "crate engine".

Incidentally, a trivia buff might argue that England isn't really part of Europe in the strictly literal sense. If you buy that argument, there's no correct answer to the original question. So, we might as well talk about Australian vehicles. The Australian division of British Leyland produced their very own, unique version of the Buick-derived Rover V8 for the P76 car. (Produced between 1973 and 1976.) Interestingly, the P76 had a stroker crank and displaced 4.4L. Australians are particularly nuts about the Buick/Rover aluminum V8. You'll surely recall that Jack Brabham contracted with an Australian firm called Repco to build custom cylinder heads that he mounted on GM blocks. He used these Repco/Buick engines to win the 1966 Formula One championship. Repco re-engineered the engine (i.e. produced their own blocks) and Brabham used that Buick-derivative to win the 1967 Formula One championship. To this day, Repco still builds engines derived from the Buick aluminum V8!

The Buick aluminum V8 has a lot more racing heritage than most American enthusiasts realize. Did YOU know that Mickey Thompson's team raced a Buick 215 powered car in the 1962 Indy 500 - with rookie driver Dan Gurney at the wheel? It was the production engine that broke Offenhauser's monopoly. An Olds version of the 215 was raced by Jim Hall in his Chaparral II (circa 1965). Some of that history is here: http://www.britishv8.org/Articles/Ro...ar-Article.htm

Jim Hall's Olds 215 (from his Chaparral II, circa 1965)


If you're curious about ANY aspect of these little aluminum V8 engines or the cars they've been installed in, we have literally HUNDREDS of articles about them in one convenient place: http://www.britishv8.org/

In fact, if you're interested in hot-rodded British sports cars, you really need to check out BritishV8!!!

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  #92 (permalink)  
Old 01-05-2009, 02:25 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by dinger
What's the name of the book?

Who's the author? (HR.com name is the same as in the book.)

What page is his story on in the book?

What's the name of his story?
D
All American Hot Rod
Henry Highrise
Chapter 5, I forget the page but I can get it.
True Confessions
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  #93 (permalink)  
Old 01-05-2009, 02:31 PM
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Cool! I was beginning to think I screwed up. page 169. How did you find the answer?

The floor is all yours.
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"When I was younger, I could remember anything, whether it had happened or not." - Mark Twain
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  #94 (permalink)  
Old 01-05-2009, 03:07 PM
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I rememberer the old thread when we discussed it a while ago.

Ok... this one should be easy.

Who am I?

I was the US Attorney who investigated Preston Tucker for Fraud before being jailed for fraud myself. Who am I?
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  #95 (permalink)  
Old 01-05-2009, 03:20 PM
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Otto Kerner, Jr.
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  #96 (permalink)  
Old 01-05-2009, 03:28 PM
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Brian,

Here's a little follow up to your torque tube question:
I asked a GM Mechanic friend of mine what was the last GM car with an old fashioned torque tube rear axle. Without hesitation, he replied "1987 Chevette."

I looked it up in an old Motor's manual I had, Here is what I found.



It uses an intermediate drive shaft between the torque tube and the transmission, so it's not quite the same as a '60 Buick. But it's very similar to a traditional torque tube.

Not disputing your question/answer, just thought this was interesting.
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  #97 (permalink)  
Old 01-05-2009, 03:47 PM
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Who are you my wife?

No, just kidding, that IS very interesting. I don't know the late Vettes well and thought they had a transaxle back there. That one makes me go hmmmmmmm.

On that book, I will be putting in an order for one, sounds like a great book and I can see Henrys contribution, very cool.

Brian
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  #98 (permalink)  
Old 01-05-2009, 03:48 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by BritishV8
In fact, if you're interested in hot-rodded British sports cars, you really need to check out BritishV8!!!
I found some of the photos (or all of them) that I posted on that site. VERY cool site indeed!

I am a big Buick fan and have always loved those little motors. American just wasn't ready for an Aluminum block, too bad.

Brian
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  #99 (permalink)  
Old 01-05-2009, 04:10 PM
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Otto Kerner is right... Joe, the floor is yours.
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  #100 (permalink)  
Old 01-05-2009, 05:12 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by MARTINSR
Who are you my wife?


Quote:
Originally Posted by MARTINSR
.... I don't know the late Vettes well and thought they had a transaxle back there. That one makes me go hmmmmmmm.
Just to clarify, I was talking about CHEVettes not CORvettes.






Next Question:

What is the year, make, and model of the car pictured below?

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  #101 (permalink)  
Old 01-05-2009, 05:56 PM
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LOLOL, I remember that rear in a Chevette, you should have told me that is Chevette.

On your car, without googling it, I say a 42 Cad.

Brian
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  #102 (permalink)  
Old 01-05-2009, 05:58 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by MARTINSR
....without googling it, I say a 42 Cad.

Brian


Close, but no cigar.
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  #103 (permalink)  
Old 01-05-2009, 06:05 PM
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1941 Cad

Brian
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  #104 (permalink)  
Old 01-05-2009, 06:08 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by MARTINSR
1941 Cad
You are 2/3rds correct.

What series?
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  #105 (permalink)  
Old 01-05-2009, 06:09 PM
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I have always loved "working cars" like cop, ambulance, that sort of thing. This page has an 41 Cad example of why I love the hearses, they were works of art!
http://www.hearse.com/vehicles/motor.../pages/pa.html

Brian
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