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  #76 (permalink)  
Old 02-26-2012, 09:54 AM
maverickmechanic13's Avatar
I'll have a beer with that.
 

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I thought thats where the 13.2 second time came from. For a 3600 pound chevelle that is awesome in my opinion. my car weighs at best 2300-2500 pounds. Thers not much to it... fiberglass hood (or no hood at all), plastic bumpers, no interior, smaller fuel cell, no ac system, no heater box, no actual dashboard, nothing under the dashboard, no wipers, and an air freshner.

13.2 seconds is good enough for me... maybe a little lower maybe a little higher. It would be a start at least.

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  #77 (permalink)  
Old 02-26-2012, 10:50 AM
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I don't understand?
 

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i think you need to start over (in this thread)

heres what i want to accomplish
heres what i have
heres my budget $$$
whats my best way to spend my $$$ to get as close to my goal ?


just remember you can sell those heads, and use some of the money you were going to spend on a new intake etc. to get different heads
just throwing that out there
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  #78 (permalink)  
Old 02-26-2012, 02:10 PM
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Low 13s is impressive on street strip cars to me!! especialy on your first build when your young and learning! As time goes by you can tweek it! Change things and have fun doing it! Building a killer fast sometimes isn't as fun as the slow approach when your young! We (sorry I should say I) have fond memory's of my early builds, swap meet finds, buddies helping, using a newspaper delivery box as a scoop, water pipe cut outs with caps home made steel packs, Firestone recap slicks (yes some slicks were recaps back then), running low 13s and tweeking in the pits and running in the 12s on the next pass . A little 283 with a tunnel ram, 2 600s with the chock horns milled off , 202 power pack heads , General Kinetics cam (Ground at his garage in an alley in detroit), ram horn manifolds with just the header pipe, M22 4 speed, 4.11 gears (57 chevy housing), in a 50 ford junker LOL and running 13s at Detroit drag way when I was in my senior year 17 years old, I had 2 paper routes Detroit Free Press at 5am in the morning and Detroit News 3pm after school, and a 2 hr a day job sweeping a body shop after they closed at 5 pm. and spending all my money for cigarettes, premium gas, & burgers & fries and cherry phosphates on cruise nights at Dog & suds!! all the rest ($) went to parts for the 50 ford and every week it went just a little faster! If I had the money to build a 10 or 9 second car all at once I would have none of those old memmory's and the fun!

Theres nothing wrong with building slow and using what you can afford and have laying around! You can always upgrade as you go!! Last year I bought a brand new Weiand high ram still in the box for 100 dollars. So you can build cheep if you look around! I ended up running high 11 with that 50 ford before I joined the service! with that same 57 rear and a 4.88 gear among other changes,And beat guys with the ford 9" nodular! A lot of things work very well and you could be ridiculed for running LT1 202 camel hump heads but those heads helped me run 10.3 at 131 M.P.H. on a 327, mickey thompson cross ram with 2 950 Holley 3 barrels & Black jack headers borg warner liberty geared 4 speed and same 57 rear end and casler 10" slicks!! On a 2300# car !! I had a lot of fun LOL !

Jester
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  #79 (permalink)  
Old 02-26-2012, 03:27 PM
maverickmechanic13's Avatar
I'll have a beer with that.
 

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To answer Matts post:

Quote:
i think you need to start over (in this thread)

heres what i want to accomplish
No brainer - i wanna go fast. As fast as i can within reasonable limits. Im not planning on breaking 10s so if 13s or late 12s are feasible - thats my goal.

Quote:
heres what i have
I already mentioned what i have, but for a recap:
-350 4 bolt main block bored 030 over =355
-keith black pistons (P/N UEM-KB193 030) dished, two valve reliefs, +12.oo ccs
-a (pretty sissy) summit old cam :454lift int and ex, 216/216 int /ex @.050, 272 duration, 112 lsa
-trickflow twisted wedge heads (P/N 31400001) 170cc intake, 63cc chambers
-9.8:1 compression
-Weiand high ram with dual holley 450s (unaltered carbs)******
-rest of the drivetrain will be beefed accordingly

Quote:
heres my budget $$$
No set figure. I can swing a few hundred a month.

Quote:
whats my best way to spend my $$$ to get as close to my goal ?
do everything in moderation?...

If i can find a better cam, and play with the carbs, while using the rest of my engine to get my car to pull 13s - that would be fantastic.

****** Also - the T-ram setup is expendable. Let's say i have a good friend thats willing to buy my setup (T-ram intake and both carbs) at their original cost - approximatley $750, if the need to go to a different intake / carb setup should arise. If something else would be better suited for my setup so be it. Thats why Matt found my other post. I basically found what the Holley wild street setup would come with.

As always - thanks-a-million everyone

Last edited by maverickmechanic13; 02-26-2012 at 03:47 PM.
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  #80 (permalink)  
Old 02-26-2012, 04:02 PM
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The car should run 13.2 or faster now without changing anything.
(maybe add a high stall converter and gears and sticky tires.)
The motor (as it is now) needs tuning to run correctly.

Ignition timing curve, carb jetting and accelerator pump tuning.

its will never make big power but will run correctly with proper specific re tuning..

Get some 4.10's-4.30's and a 10" 3500 stall converter.

You do not need a $5000 bottom end to run a tunnel ram and make real power..
I built one using a basicly stock bottom end for less than $1200 including the t ram and two 750 edelbrock carbs and Isky Z-27 solid lifter street cam. It's not that hard to do.

Start the retuning by making this change to the distributor and report the results.

Lock out the mechanical advance and set the locked timing at 34-36deg BTDC.
(The "locked" timing does not move with rpm)
Install new spark plugs gapped at .035"
let the motor warm up completely after seting the locked timing using a timing light.
then reset the carb idle mix screws and idle speed screws and test the throttle response.
It should be much better after this change.
This may not be the final setup but this is where you start.
If its too much and pings when you rug it we can change that.
A t ramed motor needs a different timing curve with a very generous amount if initial spark advance at idle. Especially with those carbs that lack a rear sec accel pump shot.
Work with me on this.
It will work a whole lot better with a high stall converter. 10" 3500+ stall or better.
do not buy a 3000 stall.

next you will be dialing in the accelerator pump shot. you will need a few holley shooters or some pin drills to measure the holes and redrill as nessessary.

A AFR gauge and o2 sensor to read the air fuel ratio will allow you to dial in the carb jetting without guessing even a low cost narrow band type will work . It will help you be a carb-tunnel ram guru.

do the distributor first: How you lock it out depends on what distributor you got.

Last edited by F-BIRD'88; 02-26-2012 at 04:08 PM.
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  #81 (permalink)  
Old 02-26-2012, 04:15 PM
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I'll have a beer with that.
 

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Should I keep the cam or pitch it?
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  #82 (permalink)  
Old 02-26-2012, 04:15 PM
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I paid $200 for my T ram and 150each for the 750carbs.
The t ram was new. The deals are where you find them.
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  #83 (permalink)  
Old 02-26-2012, 04:19 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by maverickmechanic13
Should I keep the cam or pitch it?
Keep it for now. Its good enough for low 13's.
any larger new cam will probabily require VTP clearance correction. $$$.
( custom piston machining).
Any attempt to install a new cam will require VTP clearance verification with those goofy heads.

you need a high stall converter and gears to make a big cam work.
do not buy less than a 3500 stall do not buy less than 4.10's.

work on the distributor
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  #84 (permalink)  
Old 02-26-2012, 04:29 PM
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I'll have a beer with that.
 

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If memory serves its a msd distributor no vacuum advance magnetic pickup controlled by a 6al msd box.
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  #85 (permalink)  
Old 02-26-2012, 04:38 PM
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You need to know the actual as installed cam timing numbers.
( degree in the cam.)
You need to know the current valve to piston clearance you got now.
You need to know the exact crank position when the intake and the exhaust valve is closest to the piston ( near TDC)

You need to know the valve lift @TDC intake and exhaust.
From this info you can select a new larger cam that will fit without VTP interferience.

can you beg, borrow or steal a cam to trial fit?
even a old cam with a wiped lobe is good enough.
hyd cam 230 to 246@.050" 106 to 110LSA.

Solid cam 244 to 260@.050 102 to 112LSA

(you must use a solid lifter to do all degreeing and VTP clearance checking.)

guessing will get you smashed valves and pushrods.

don;t blame me, you're the one that bought these goofy heads LOL

You will need a piston stop, dial indicator and stand and a cam degreeeing degree wheel. a two solid lifters. A bigger cam to trial fit will shorten the learning curve. What do you or your friends got laying around?

Last edited by F-BIRD'88; 02-26-2012 at 04:47 PM.
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  #86 (permalink)  
Old 02-26-2012, 04:42 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by maverickmechanic13
If memory serves its a msd distributor no vacuum advance magnetic pickup controlled by a 6al msd box.
Download the instruction and read them for that distributor model. it shows you how to lock out the advance curve.

they do not come set up correctly, out of the box. You can fix that.
start by locking out the curve. timing 36deg BTDC at idle.

the MSD box requires proper wireing installation. If you did it wrong fix it.
proper box and engine grounding is critrical.
proper mag pick up wireing polarity is critical.

use premimum gas.
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  #87 (permalink)  
Old 02-26-2012, 04:49 PM
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I'll have a beer with that.
 

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Okay. Got it. Only scary thing so far is the carb tuning
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  #88 (permalink)  
Old 02-26-2012, 05:04 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by maverickmechanic13
Okay. Got it. Only scary thing so far is the carb tuning
A AFR gauge will show you the way. I made my own (narow band that plugs in the cig lighter) for under $100. I used a $30 NGK 3wire heated o2 sensor and a autometer AFR gauge. The wide band type are sweet. You do not need smaller carbs.
this and some patience and work will make it un scary.

if you buy carbs, buy larger carbs. a pair of used edelbrock 650 AVS thunder series or the 750 AFB's would be sweet. Don;t bother buying the 600's. They all suck.

the higher the converter stall speed the better the whole thing will work.
a 8" or 9" race converter would be sweet. ATI Racing
( yes it will drive fine on the street)
A 10" 3500 stall is the minimum you need to go fast with the T ram.
Do not buy a lame converter. Don;t waste you money.

I have some good recomendations on a new cam but need the VTP clerance info first. A trial fit cam would be sweet. ( fair big hyd or solid cam)

Last edited by F-BIRD'88; 02-26-2012 at 05:09 PM.
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  #89 (permalink)  
Old 02-26-2012, 05:42 PM
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I don't understand?
 

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Quote:
Originally Posted by maverickmechanic13
Okay. Got it. Only scary thing so far is the carb tuning
the carb or carbs will need to be tuned for top performance anyway, no matter how many you have
you will be able to make it work
these guys know their stuff

sounds like maybe work with what you have, get it tuned correctly
spend your first batch of dollars on a converter and some rear gears

what size were the headers/exhaust?
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  #90 (permalink)  
Old 02-26-2012, 05:49 PM
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I'll have a beer with that.
 

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1 3/4 primaries 3" collector, longtubes, most likely 45* dumps to come out of them. If not - duals with flowmaster 40s
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