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  #16 (permalink)  
Old 12-13-2007, 09:27 PM
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Just out of curiosity what happens when you turn one over backwards?
Shane

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Old 12-13-2007, 09:40 PM
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http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/ws/eB...181323011&rd=1

What about this one? worth messing with two of these?
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Old 12-13-2007, 09:48 PM
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try www.car-part.com search for stuff like the old daytona turbos and any other turbo car you can think of and check prices. some good deals to be had there.
Shane
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Old 12-13-2007, 10:23 PM
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That's pretty close to stock compression. I ran 10:1. Honestly, you don't have to change the internals unless its worn out.

The 12s come carburated in early cars, & EFI in later ones. The carbed cars ran 1.75 inch CV sidedrafts. You can easily upgrade them to 2" SU sidedrafts from a 3.8 or 4.2. Just have to bore the manifolds. (there are 4) I ran an MSD7, and I can explain to you how to drive it.

There was also an "HE", which was about 11 or 12:1 compression, but it was a lean-burn & you'd have to run the computer & everything intact. Oh.. Later XJ12s were 6.0, in case you want some more inches.

As I recall, the overall length is about 39", and its about 25" wide Note, the EFI sits on top, making EFI motors very narrow, while the carbs hang out over the cam boxes, making the carb engines very wide. (maybe 3') Don't trust me, grab a tape. They do have a very long sump...

Please don't saddle it with a slushbox...
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Old 12-13-2007, 10:29 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Chevrolet4x4s
Just out of curiosity what happens when you turn one over backwards?
Shane
Breaks the cam chain tensioner & then when you start it it bends a lot of valves. That's why I rebuilt mine with high compression & the new cams.
Ran over a ski rope & entangled the jet pump. I turned it backwards to unwind the rope.
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Old 12-13-2007, 10:43 PM
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Here, this might give you some perspective on size. This engine bay normally held a 454 or 460. Width was easy, length took some black magic in the drive.
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Old 12-14-2007, 06:11 AM
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Fits quite nicely if you ask me

I have the HE version, stock its 11.5 for the usa and 12.5:1 for the overseas motor. The heads are somewhat restrictive but the unique design allows up to 13.5:1 compression on pump gas. My motor being 8.5:1 should be able to run 10 - 12 pounds of boost on pump gas without any problems.
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Old 12-14-2007, 09:08 AM
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Holy Bat-Shoehorn, Batman, that's a tight fit!
Sure you don't want to tunnel it into a firewall a few inches?...
Bravo to you for taking this on.

So you have the HE.. The May cylinder head isn't really a performance piece... I'm afraid if you lean on it with boost, there'll be Hell to pay. The reason they got away with the high CR was a lean mixture & a highly turbulent intake port. You may recall these cars came with 4 CatCons to clean up the exhaust...
The other 12s have flat heads like a diesel, with the combustion chamber in the piston. So, the 2 systems don't interchange well.

I'm wondering how you plan to cool it. I can only think of 1 radiator that has a snowball's chance in Hell of keeping it cool in that tiny space. I think the company is Brassworks. They are made of hundreds of axial tubes with the holes facing forward-soldered together. They made a replacement radiator for 454 Chevy trucks & it was maybe 18 inches (roughly round)

Oh yeah.. Don't forget to run all 4 pipes all the way out the back together... if you turn 'em out the side, it'll sound like a six.

I'm very stoked by what you are doing.. I often thought of doing in in a 240Z. That would have been too easy!
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Old 12-14-2007, 10:27 AM
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Your dead right about the exhaust, you have to run them together if you want the V12 sound. Im going to use an X tube to bring it back out to dual exhaust for looks.

Cooling it shouldnt be too bad. Im dropping compression from standard 11.5:1 to 8.5:1 which will help out a little bit.

As far as the heads my understanding was that they can handle high compression ratios because of the recessed exhaust valve and sparkplug angles which causes turbulents on the exhaust side. Your right about it not being big on performance but Im not building a drag race motor either. Iv built so many drag cars im bored with doing that, I want something streetable, sporty, fast, and different. I think in a 2300 pound miata 450hp should still give me somewhere in the 12's.
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Old 12-14-2007, 01:07 PM
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What type of transmission are you planning on running?Where do you get the belhousing at?Is the bolt pattern the same as any american engines?

Shane
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Old 12-14-2007, 05:17 PM
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The bell housing is an aftermarket bell housing for V12's allows you to use any FORD 5-speed, tremec, or TKO manual transmission. Kit comes with an aluminum flywheel that lets you use a 302 ford mustang clutch and pressureplate.
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Old 12-14-2007, 07:41 PM
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Cooling it shouldnt be too bad. Im dropping compression from standard 11.5:1 to 8.5:1 which will help out a little bit.

As far as the heads my understanding was that they can handle high compression ratios because of the recessed exhaust valve and sparkplug angles which causes turbulents on the exhaust side.


Damn...I don't want to be cold water, really I don't ..
There would be no purpose to turbulence after combustion, so the May head was designed to do it during intake and combustion by tumbling all those gasses in a vertical swirl into that recessed chamber. There are 2 problems with the HE head. First, they only flow enough to make about 300 HP. If you try to overcome that by boost, you make heat.
Second, when you lower the piston crown, you eliminate the squish band that made the chamber detonation-resistant in the first place.
Third, they were only detonation-resistant because the mixture was very weak & the timing slow. Not the environment your turbo will provide, as you wouldn't dare run 16:1 mixture under boost. The idea was mileage, not power. Every element worked together, and I don't think they will work separately.
I would very curious to see what an "8.5:1" piston for the HE looks like.. got a pic?
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  #28 (permalink)  
Old 12-14-2007, 08:36 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by brainsboy
The bell housing is an aftermarket bell housing for V12's allows you to use any FORD 5-speed, tremec, or TKO manual transmission. Kit comes with an aluminum flywheel that lets you use a 302 ford mustang clutch and pressureplate.
How pricey are those roughly?
Thanks
Shane
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Old 12-14-2007, 09:19 PM
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check out what the dodge diesel guys got, a holset turbo, hx35 or a hybrid hx40 would run your engine very well at about 14 psi and not really run out on top, no cooling water, oil only, and they are factory pieces capable of 300k miles, when used properly, oh and a turbo making 300 diesel horses is like 400 or better gas horsepower with killer torque
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