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Old 02-23-2010, 11:48 AM
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Urethane mounted windshields

an OEM urethane mounted windshield has a black edge to keep the UV from degrading the urethane.

How is it possible to replicate this on an "non urethane ready" windshield to be able to mount it with urethane?

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Old 02-23-2010, 12:13 PM
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tape it off and coat it with butyl primer. 3m makes it.
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Old 02-23-2010, 06:54 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by shine
tape it off and coat it with butyl primer. 3m makes it.
Is the butyl primer black? Should I etch the glass where primer is going to go?
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Old 02-23-2010, 07:22 PM
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yes it is black. just clean the glass really well. this is what it is made for.
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Old 02-23-2010, 07:59 PM
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I don't believe it is "made for it" at all. It is made for "priming" the metal exposed from scratches and such when the window is cut out. There are some products that are recommended for the glass it's self like "Single step primer" by 3M or "Black primer" by 3m.

The stuff you are talking about on the glass is called "Frit" and it is some pretty tough stuff! You can't scratch it off to save your life, it is TOUGH.

I would call 3M for more info. We are talking some serious stuff here. One screw up and you have glass flying out on your hood when you step on the brakes! And that is NOT an exaggeration, you could have THAT bad of adhesion if you put the wrong product on the glass.

Brian
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Old 02-24-2010, 05:33 AM
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butyl primer , also known as window weld , part #08643 . it is used to increase adhesion when butyl ribbon weld sealer is being used. it is applied to both glass and the metal. if your using urethane there is another one to use. i use ribbon weld to install windshields . it's a lot cleaner to work with .
what kind of car are we working on ?
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Old 02-24-2010, 06:14 AM
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No car at the moment, just curiosity.
I have seen street rods with the windshields and rear glass set and trimmed like a late model windshield, with the black area on the edge and the small black vinyl trim around it. I assume they are urethane set.
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Old 02-24-2010, 06:42 AM
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i do them with butyl rope and s10 trim . my 46 will have the glass mounted from the inside using rope.
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Old 02-24-2010, 06:57 AM
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glass prime

In the factory the aplicator was like a liquid shoe polish bottle with a guide finger to get and even application.
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Old 02-24-2010, 07:57 AM
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I don't believe 08643 is available anymore. And it would have to be sprayed to apply it so forget about the "show polish" applicator for "frit".

Old Fool, lots of people do a lot of things, that don't make it right. The "frit" you see on street rods is probably everything from REAL frit added by a custom glass manufacturer to a rattle can sprayed on the glass by someone not aware of how dangerous it could be.

Along the lines of what Shine was saying with the "single step primer" or something like that will adhere well I assume being it is used for both the glass and pinch weld. But I have tried to repair damaged frit and you can still see it through the glass. If you applied it in anyway other than spraying it would likely look like ever loving hell thru the glass.

A quality epoxy primer would be my first thought. That is exactly what is required for proper installation of a urethane mounted glass, epoxy over bare metal. So I have to assume that it would be the best choice.

Brian
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Old 02-24-2010, 08:42 AM
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08643 is not a spray-able product. it has a brush applicator made into the lid. i guess an undercoat gun might spray it. pretty thick. i try to use butyl instead of urethane. i don't do collision work so i don't care how those are done.
the butyl will hold the s10 trim in. those one piece windshields tell you to use black silicone. DON'T ! wont hold for **** and makes a god awful mess.
don't know if 08643 is still available. but i will use whatever my glass supplier suggest. i've been buying from the same place for over 30 years.

on a side note. most all windshields are still available through a glass supply. check first before you drop several hundred dollars on one. the going price for the windshield in my 54 ford pu was 249+truck freight . i had one in 3 hrs local for 142 .
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Old 02-24-2010, 09:13 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by MARTINSR
I don't believe 08643 is available anymore. And it would have to be sprayed to apply it so forget about the "show polish" applicator for "frit".

Old Fool, lots of people do a lot of things, that don't make it right. The "frit" you see on street rods is probably everything from REAL frit added by a custom glass manufacturer to a rattle can sprayed on the glass by someone not aware of how dangerous it could be.

Along the lines of what Shine was saying with the "single step primer" or something like that will adhere well I assume being it is used for both the glass and pinch weld. But I have tried to repair damaged frit and you can still see it through the glass. If you applied it in anyway other than spraying it would likely look like ever loving hell thru the glass.

A quality epoxy primer would be my first thought. That is exactly what is required for proper installation of a urethane mounted glass, epoxy over bare metal. So I have to assume that it would be the best choice.

Brian
BarryK says epoxy degrades with UV exposure, so do you think it would hold up being under the glass? Is the glass a UV filter?
Dam I got a lot of dumb questions,lol.
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Old 02-24-2010, 09:25 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Old Fool
BarryK says epoxy degrades with UV exposure, so do you think it would hold up being under the glass? Is the glass a UV filter?
Dam I got a lot of dumb questions,lol.
Yep, it's right and I should have thought of that. The glass is not UV protection I wouldn't think, maybe with the right glass?

And Shine is right on an older car the Butyl tape is great, MUCH less trouble and a MUCH shorter learning curve. Urethane will KICK YOUR ARS with mess.

Of course, you could paint the frit on the OUTSIDE of the window? Taped off nice and sprayed with what ever auto grade 2K paint, it wouldn't look exactly like the factory frit, but close.

Brian
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Old 02-24-2010, 09:25 AM
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when you go the glued in smal rubber trim look or no trim look, all the glass has to be resized bigger because your eliminating the fat rubber seal.Glass has to be etched for anything to stick to it(a good example is rearview mirror glue).so just have the glass company that cuts your glass do the work you'll be much happier.doing that kind of glass work is tough ,its like doing your first paint job, if you do it yourself expect to screw something up and have it take a whole lot longer...Not to mention the mess that black glue makes...I made plexiglass templetes for mine then called a few glass men took their advice (Those rubber trim pieces come in many sizes and shapes) Then had the one I trusted most do the job...flat glass is fairly easy around here to get made to order....I was even able to have the same company make a one piece windshield instead of two halves with a strip in the middle....
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Old 04-09-2010, 06:16 AM
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UPDATE:
Came across this info on another forum and thought it may help some on this site.
PAGE 2 specifically addresses using urethane on a NON frit windshield.

http://www.technologylk.com/images/p...c-CRL950FC.pdf

Overall procedure (pg16 addresses the primer on non frit glass)
http://crlaurence.com.au/datasheets/...R_tech_man.pdf

Last edited by Old Fool; 04-09-2010 at 06:30 AM.
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