Using a Flow Coat - Hot Rod Forum : Hotrodders Bulletin Board
Hotrodders.com -- Hot Rod Forum



Register FAQ Search Today's Posts Unanswered Posts Auto Escrow Insurance Auto Loans
Hot Rod Forum : Hotrodders Bulletin Board > Tech Help> Body - Exterior
User Name
Password
lost password?   |   register now

Reply
 
LinkBack Thread Tools
  #1 (permalink)  
Old 12-24-2005, 10:14 AM
Registered User
 
Last wiki edit: How to title a hot rod Last photo:
Join Date: Jul 2003
Posts: 189
Wiki Edits: 6

Thanks: 0
Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts
Using a Flow Coat

Hi,

I'm about to squirt what for me is a high dollar car (66 vette) for a customer.
Normally I just shoot 3 coats of our high solids clear and cut and buff that.
It works excellent and I very seldom get much peel. But I do
get some puddlies (urethane peel) usually on the top surfaces. Of course I'll try to control that by not piling it on.
Anyway, I see quite a few are now using a flow coat for a better finish. So I have a couple questions for those who do this.
- Is it worth the extra time, effort, and risk of contamination?
- Do you just squirt one flow coat?
- What happens with your final cut and buff? If you sand through that flow coat is it noticable?
- This car will be silver (OEM color). Will it be worth the effort considering that color kind of hides the surface defects moreso than a dark color would?

Thanks!

Larry
www.autopaintdirect.com

    Advertisement
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Sponsored Links
Advertisement
 
  #2 (permalink)  
Old 12-29-2005, 05:48 PM
Registered User
 
Last wiki edit: How to title a hot rod Last photo:
Join Date: Jul 2003
Posts: 189
Wiki Edits: 6

Thanks: 0
Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts
Last chance for any input. I'm shooting the sucker hopefully tomorrow night.

Larry
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
  #3 (permalink)  
Old 12-29-2005, 06:17 PM
Custom builder and painter
 

Last journal entry: Another test fit of the axle
Last photo:
Join Date: Nov 2005
Location: Sw Michigan
Age: 34
Posts: 327
Wiki Edits: 0

Thanks: 0
Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts
well no one seems to have any answers.. what clear are you using... I just sprayed some Spi universal clear and it looks unbelievably flat, I don't think it'd need the flow coat..lol... Here's what i'd suggest... spray 3 coats of your HS clear... and then make a call if you look at it and say it looks excellent.. just wet sand and buff it as you normally would.. if you'd like to get a better finish, wet sand it it with 400 and re-clear with a MS clear of some sort.. but from what I understand you'd want to put 2 coats of clear on so that way you can wet sand and buff, and still have enough mill build for longevity..

If you are planning on doing it with the same clear.. just reduce it like 5% when you do the final coats.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
  #4 (permalink)  
Old 12-29-2005, 06:55 PM
OneMoreTime's Avatar
Hotrodders.com moderator
 
Last wiki edit: Health and safety in the shop or garage
Last journal entry: Yard Dog pic
Last photo:
Join Date: Jul 2004
Location: Washington State
Age: 69
Posts: 7,379
Wiki Edits: 3

Thanks: 48
Thanked 151 Times in 143 Posts
Main thing on a high dollar job is to be patient and observe the flash times and do not try and run the material on too quickly and get a pile up..Saying that I would rather have to deal with a run than deal with orange peel..

If you have been getting a good result and are comfortable with the material you are presently using go for it..

With some materials a bit of reducer helps it to flow out a bit better but in no case would I go over 5% with the reducer..

OMT
__________________
I have tried most all of it and now do what is known to work..
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
  #5 (permalink)  
Old 12-29-2005, 07:24 PM
Member
 
Last photo:
Join Date: Apr 2004
Location: Georgia
Posts: 3,578
Wiki Edits: 0

Thanks: 10
Thanked 61 Times in 39 Posts
Larry,

Not real up on exactly what a flow coat as far as ratio is but sometimes in the last coat too a quart of mixed clear I will add 2-4oz of 885 or 895.

Mostly do it to keep last coat open a little longer if I'm really loading the clear on. Not sure it does much good but it sounds good.

Make that vette look good!
Barry
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
  #6 (permalink)  
Old 12-29-2005, 07:25 PM
Bee4Me's Avatar
Problem Child,Hard Case
 

Last journal entry: Strangest job I've ever done
Last photo:
Join Date: Jan 2005
Location: ARK.
Age: 57
Posts: 1,773
Wiki Edits: 0

Thanks: 0
Thanked 1 Time in 1 Post
As asked, WHAT product are you shooting?
Different clears need different reduction.
A flow coat IS and over reduced clear or lesser solid clear made to FLOW out.
10% is the normal reduction for "most" clears.
UC-35 HOk is their basic clear and does a great job but if your flow coating you will 5-600 wet sand and use the UFC-35 which is a flow clear designed especally for this.
The SPI universial is also reduced 10% for each flow coat,not just the last according to Jim (mrcleaner6) who did this on the yellow Firebird awhile back.
One of the main reasons for flow coats is to smooth or flatten out the main clear job with sanding and add a luster coat which adds extra depth and shine to the job.
The advantage to flow coats is that your shooting over a clear (same) base instead of a paint which means you can hammer the flow clear pretty good as it sticks to itself a lot better than paint so the likelyhood of run's is less than the first go around.
It's also a chance to fix any last mistakes missed.

FWIW, Mike.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
  #7 (permalink)  
Old 12-29-2005, 07:44 PM
Member
 
Last photo:
Join Date: Jan 2005
Location:
Posts: 3,707
Wiki Edits: 0

Thanks: 0
Thanked 2 Times in 2 Posts
It's worth the extra work IMO. Apply your normal three coats then block the car with 400 or 600 depending on how much urethane peel needs to be removed. Then apply one or two flow coats. When colorsanding and buffing if you sand or buff through the last stage of clear and into the first you won't see any differences, no rings, etc.

The flow coat allows you a chance to put a nice smooth coat of clear over a perfectly smooth and flat surface that has already purged most of the solvents out. The more coats that are applied in one session make for more chance of texture stack up, urethane peel/waves.

Silver doesn't hide surface imperfections more than a dark color, In fact silver highlights surface texture problems, scratches, peel, etc. The reflection silver provides will show much more surface irregularities than any dark color. Silver needs a completely smooth, flat, straight and scratch free surface.

Last edited by baddbob; 12-29-2005 at 07:50 PM.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
  #8 (permalink)  
Old 12-29-2005, 07:53 PM
Custom builder and painter
 

Last journal entry: Another test fit of the axle
Last photo:
Join Date: Nov 2005
Location: Sw Michigan
Age: 34
Posts: 327
Wiki Edits: 0

Thanks: 0
Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts
wow that amazes me that if you sand thru you won't see any ring, or have any peeling problems.. it's still a thing layer over the top and if you sand thru you are slowly tappering it down to nothing.. and it seems like the edge where your going thru would be 400 grit and that would be hard to buff.. hmm.. learn something everyday.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
  #9 (permalink)  
Old 12-29-2005, 10:21 PM
crashtech's Avatar
Technician
 
Last wiki edit: Epoxy primer
Join Date: May 2005
Location: Idaho
Posts: 701
Wiki Edits: 17

Thanks: 0
Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts
I think when the clear is only a day or two old the next coat just bites in and pretty much melts any sanding marks and becomes one with the substrate. I've seen jobs done that way, they look awesome and give peace of mind as to mil build and UV blocking.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
  #10 (permalink)  
Old 12-30-2005, 08:09 AM
Bee4Me's Avatar
Problem Child,Hard Case
 

Last journal entry: Strangest job I've ever done
Last photo:
Join Date: Jan 2005
Location: ARK.
Age: 57
Posts: 1,773
Wiki Edits: 0

Thanks: 0
Thanked 1 Time in 1 Post
You will rarely cut thru a flow coat as it's generally VERY smooth and o'peel is almost nonexistent.Usually a light 1500 or 2000 then a 3 or 4K "pad" then buff. This is another one of the reasons to use them.
Some painters will even shoot straight reducer for the "last" coat on the top flat panels to flow it out smoother.I'm not recommending it but some do. I've done it on some small projects that are not kept outdoors and it does flow it out smooth and requires no buffing IF you don't have any trash in it. For a real world car,I'd just keep it at the first shooting if it looks good.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
  #11 (permalink)  
Old 01-01-2006, 08:30 AM
Registered User
 
Last wiki edit: How to title a hot rod Last photo:
Join Date: Jul 2003
Posts: 189
Wiki Edits: 6

Thanks: 0
Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts
Thanks for the responses!
I still haven't shot the car as I keep finding tiny things to fix.
I want it perfect so it's taking a ton of extra time. I normally do
three blockings on a car and then shoot. We did six on this one so
I'm really tired of sanding. But if it comes out better than the rest
in town it will probably lead to alot of work down the road.

So today is paint day!

I'm using Valspar AC4400, it mixes 2:1:1. I suspect but can't get verification that it's the same as HOK UC35. We are a jobber for both. Urethane peel is something I have always had a problem with no matter what brand of clear I've used. I'm pretty sure I just put it on too heavy. So I'll watch that as I spray. We don't do alot of volume as selling paint is most of the business, but I normally spray a couple times a week. This one is not my first kinda high dollar car or Vette but the others were my cars, not a customers. For some reason this one has me unusually concerned about perfection.

Larry
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
  #12 (permalink)  
Old 01-01-2006, 09:08 AM
Member
 
Last photo:
Join Date: Jan 2005
Location:
Posts: 3,707
Wiki Edits: 0

Thanks: 0
Thanked 2 Times in 2 Posts
Use the slowest reducer you can get asway with and let each coat tack up. Get your gun adjusted so you can apply the smoothest thinnest coat possible. If everything goes right you might not want or need the flow coat. The worst urethane peel seems to be a product of too fast a reducer with the required bombing the product on thick to get it to appear smooth and poor gun atomization. JMO I've never used Valspar, maybe someone with product experience on this one will chime in and give a few pointers. Bob
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
  #13 (permalink)  
Old 01-01-2006, 04:36 PM
Registered User
 
Last wiki edit: How to title a hot rod Last photo:
Join Date: Jul 2003
Posts: 189
Wiki Edits: 6

Thanks: 0
Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts
Well, it's painted. I don't see much peel but I think I might do the flow coat anyway. There's one spot that I don't like so I could rebase that lightly beforehand. I guess it depends on how abmitious I am in the AM.
Thanks for the help!

Larry
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
  #14 (permalink)  
Old 01-02-2006, 10:28 AM
crashtech's Avatar
Technician
 
Last wiki edit: Epoxy primer
Join Date: May 2005
Location: Idaho
Posts: 701
Wiki Edits: 17

Thanks: 0
Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts
Hey, if you rebase anything you'll need at least 2 coats of clear over that to achieve UV protection, but you probably know that...
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
  #15 (permalink)  
Old 01-02-2006, 10:36 PM
Registered User
 
Last wiki edit: How to title a hot rod Last photo:
Join Date: Jul 2003
Posts: 189
Wiki Edits: 6

Thanks: 0
Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts
Looks like it will work pretty slick. Sand and buff tomorrow.

BaddBob,
I'm in Escanaba, only an hour or so from you. If you drive like I do.

Larry
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message

Recent Body - Exterior posts with photos

Quick Reply
Message:
Options

Register Now

In order to be able to post messages on the Hot Rod Forum : Hotrodders Bulletin Board forums, you must first register.
Please enter your desired user name (usually not your first and last name), your email address and other required details in the form below.
User Name:
If you do not want to register, fill this field only and the name will be used as user name for your post.
Password
Please enter a password for your user account. Note that passwords are case-sensitive.
Password:
Confirm Password:
Email Address
Please enter a valid email address for yourself.
Email Address:

Log-in

Human Verification

In order to verify that you are a human and not a spam bot, please enter the answer into the following box below based on the instructions contained in the graphic.




Currently Active Users Viewing This Thread: 1 (0 members and 1 guests)
 
Thread Tools

Posting Rules
You may post new threads
You may post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are On
Pingbacks are On
Refbacks are On


Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
"Basic of Basics" How do you properly apply filler? Centerline Body - Exterior 2 02-10-2006 12:22 AM
body line cole5_0 Body - Exterior 13 10-14-2005 03:57 AM
sandpaper... 38 special Body - Exterior 14 10-11-2005 04:30 PM
laminating- gel coat pre-release powderbill Body - Exterior 5 06-12-2005 05:59 PM
Cam Help black66 Engine 3 05-12-2003 06:15 PM


All times are GMT -6. The time now is 02:37 AM.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.7
Copyright ©2000 - 2014, vBulletin Solutions, Inc.
Search Engine Optimization by vBSEO 3.6.0 PL2
Copyright Hotrodders.com 1999 - 2012. All Rights Reserved.