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V8 1973 VW Beetle Project

825K views 836 replies 88 participants last post by  V8 Super Beetle 
#1 · (Edited)
Hello all!

I'm in the process of building a V8 Bug out of my 1973 VW Super Beetle. I know this is possible because it's been done before. I'm on the v8bugs.com forum where you can find a handle full of example and different ways to accomplish this, but I still have questions. There's a lot more traffic here so hopefully I can get some help. I'm pretty much a beginner hot rodder that's a DYI kinda guy.

I'm looking into building a custom 2"x3" tube chassis for my build. I've took some measurements from my bug and designed a chassis in Illustrator to size. I'm trying to design the frame so it'll use the stock suspension up front.

I currently have a 283 SBC and th350 to put into the bug, but at the moment the motor is the block, with pistons and all, and heads. The motor is at my old mans (he works nights) so I don't have access to measure the motor off for mounting and what not.

Could anyone tell me, ballpark figure, about how much distance I'll need from each frame rail to fit the engine with mounts and shorty headers?

Here's my frame design, the distance between each frame rail is exactly 27.5". Also I intend on mounting the motor to the crossmembers that hold in the front control arms / suspension. Is this enough distance? Could I bring the distance between the two main frame rails closer? How should I mount the engine to the cross member with then motor mounts I have (see picture below)?



Here's some pics of my beetle and progress. I'm still working on cutting out the trunk!





 
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#502 ·
Wow, most people, I think, don't catch onto that. Original plans were a 2"x3" tube chassis, a 283, and a th350. As you said it's amazing how the plans have changed. The car now has a 383, S10 chassis, and I had to buy a th350.

I would've stuck with the 283 but it had 13:1 pop up pistons and that just wouldn't work with the new vortec heads I bought. Plus it would have cost about the same to build a 383 vs a 283. That's 100 more ci I gained. :D

The reason why I went from tube chassis to S10 frame was cost, tools, and skills. I didn't have the tools to properly fabricate a tube chassis and there are a lot more welds involved. When I began I wasn't quite so sure about my welding abilities. I am now though. That and I couldn't pass up such a great deal on a S10 chassis. $150 for a rolling chassis. It needing rebuilding but that wasn't too bad.

And the th350 tranny my dad had for me was given to my uncle because he needed it sooner than I did. :D

Thanks for reading my thread. I'll have more soon. :thumbup:
 
#503 ·
V8 Super Beetle said:
When I began I wasn't quite so sure about my welding abilities. I am now though. :
Did I miss something or did you do all the welding (including bodywork) with a 110V stick welder? Most builders now seem to feel that you must have a MIG or even a TIG to do any kind of welding, esp. on sheet metal. How do you keep from blowing through on the thin stuff?
 
#504 ·
MScott said:
Did I miss something or did you do all the welding (including bodywork) with a 110V stick welder? Most builders now seem to feel that you must have a MIG or even a TIG to do any kind of welding, esp. on sheet metal. How do you keep from blowing through on the thin stuff?
Good eye. I did the frame work, about 95% of it, with a 110v stick welder. I also widened the fenders with the stick welder. I turned the amps way down and used 1/16 6013 rods. It worked OK but it was really hard to keep an arc at such low amps not to mention keeping the rod from sticking. It was very time consuming too.

As of now I have a MIG welder. I borrowed one from my bro, after I did the fenders because I didn't know he had one, it crapped out, and I recently bought a new MIG welder. a Lincoln 125 Pro Core. Works like a charm even on heavy stuff using flux.

If you're on a budget I would suggest the 110v stick welder. You can do both heavier, 3-16 - 1/4, metal and thin stuff using small rods. It's tough doing sheet though but it made me a better welder.
 
#505 ·
Not a whole lot of progress was made this weekend, but some. :)

I got the tranny completely taken apart and then found that the direct clutch piston spring, in the valve body, was broken. Probably the reason why the tranny was taken out of the car. It is a 5 clutch, heavy duty, th350, so that's good.

I decided just to go ahead and take the tranny to a professional shop because they could get it put together quicker, I don't have much "clean room" where I can assemble the tranny, and I get a 6 month warranty with the guys who did the work, that is if I can get it all going with six months time. Haha.


They did a really nice job and they were very informative about the parts I had and what to look out for. Basically the kit I had was a stock rebuilder kit repacked. Which is ok for my purposes. I dropped off the tranny Sat morning and they had it ready Monday after work.




I installed the tranny crossmember.




The tranny is ready to go in. I'm thinking I'll put the motor, hook the tranny up, and then install it as a unit...? I could just have someone help me pull it through the door rather than remove the engine. Hmmm...dunno which was would be easiest. Either way it wont be as bad as installing it in a car with a firewall and floor.

Also, I have a new radiator, fan, mounting hardware, etc. on their way. I bought a 22"w x 19"h aluminum radiator. I'm pretty sure I figured out a way to put my radiator up front. It'll be mounted low but wont be sticking out of the bottom of the body. Hopefully. The only way I see this working is I'll have to use a rack and pinion setup, which I'll have to buy.

Any advice on which rack to use for the S10 frame?
 
#506 ·
Use extreme caution in grafting a r&p from another production auto or truck. You can get into trouble in a hurry with bump steer and have to throw out everything you just did to start over. If you want it right from the beginning, order up a kit from Unisteer. It is pricey at over $1000, but the steering will be right from the git-go.

Might be cheaper to keep the worm/sector steering and re-think the radiator. It would not be beyond your capabilities to mount the radiator in the rear and run thin-wall tubing to and from the motor. I might even be tempted to use PVC.
 
#507 ·
techinspector1 said:
Use extreme caution in grafting a r&p from another production auto or truck. You can get into trouble in a hurry with bump steer and have to throw out everything you just did to start over. If you want it right from the beginning, order up a kit from Unisteer. It is pricey at over $1000, but the steering will be right from the git-go.

Might be cheaper to keep the worm/sector steering and re-think the radiator. It would not be beyond your capabilities to mount the radiator in the rear and run thin-wall tubing to and from the motor. I might even be tempted to use PVC.
Thanks for the advice. I'm going to consider other options so I can have a front mounted radiator just to keep it simple. I originally planed to put it in the back but I just might be able to get it up front. The only problem is the steering box is in the way.

With the radiator I have now (22"W x 29"H x 3"D) I can set it up front without the steering box. I ordered a 22"W x 19"H x 2.25" rad and I'm going to see if I can't make it work with the steering box in place. I might have some room to offset it away from the box.

I'd rather mount the radiator in back than have steering issues. Would moving the steering box back create problems? I know I'd have to have a shorter steering arm for the box. I'm guessing that would reduce the amount I could turn the wheels?

Thanks for the help.
 
#510 ·
Another quicky update. I got the transmission installed last night. Torque converter seated all the way down and it spins freely with the bell housing completely bolted up. Now I just need to crawl under the car and bolt the converter to the flex plate.

Believe it or not, I got the tranny in all by myself. I lifted it and sat it on my floor supports, got out a jack with a block of wood, raised the jack, instead the converter (after a quart of ATF), slid the tranny forward until it sat down on the jack / wood, then roll the tranny forward and mated them up. Easier said than done, but it worked.


Sorry, the night shots on my camera phone suck.



I still need to adjust the crossmember. It needs to go in the most forward mount holes so it'll bolt up.
 
#514 ·
marnell79 said:
I got my body mounted, engine and trans mounted. Master cylinder and Radiator. It all fits under the hood without a air cleaner. Also framed in the floor and dash. I started a web site at www.v8vwbug.9f.com.
It's coming along nicely! Congrats on the new house. Do you have any side shots of your bug at this stage? Keep it coming.
 
#516 ·
Small update. I didn't get as much time to work on the bug as I thought I would this weekend.

My low mount alternator bracket came in and seems it wont work either. The steering box is in the way. I'm not sure what my options are now for an alt bracket. I might just have to make one.

My radiator and fan came in so I started mocking it up to see if I can get it up front. I trimmed more of the front clip sheet metal away and squeezed it in, so to speak.






As you can see it goes in, but I don't think I'll have room to close the hood unless the radiator is sticking out the bottom by about 3". Even a little more so than in the picture. Also, from the looks of it, another problem is there's not enough room to squeeze in the electric fan. I'm going to see what I can do the make it work, but it's looking like it would be best and easier to set up the radiator in the back.

Any thoughts, suggestions?
 
#517 ·
Hello fellow houstonian, I have read through the majority of your thread here and like what i see. I'm currently building a "Pro-street" look beetle on an 87 s-10 chassis. I'll get into the detais later in my own thread if i have time.

I believe the best way to run your cooling system is w/ the radiator in the rear. No matter how you set it up, orientation and flow, you may consider adding an aditional flow pump in line. I work for GM at a local chevy dealer and can tell you that the added friction of heater/cooling hose will very quickly be too much for the pumps output at idle. You can see evidence of this on a tahoe/suburban w/ rear heat. The heater hardly operates at idle, but w/ the engine at 1500 R's and up the flow will get the hot coolant to the rear.

To recap - don't rely completely on the engine powered pump if you are running the radiators in the rear - yet the rear seems the only place to run them.

also look in to front engine bracketry from the 98-04 vette for the front of your engine. (i would slide mine back an inch or soo too)

hope i helped a little and if you need some help or info feel free to PM - i don't have much time for this internet stuff but i'll do my best to help out if/when i can.

good luck and congrats on a cool buggy so far

Hybridr-tele :sweat:
 
#518 ·
HYBRIDR-TELE said:
Hello fellow houstonian, I have read through the majority of your thread here and like what i see. I'm currently building a "Pro-street" look beetle on an 87 s-10 chassis. I'll get into the detais later in my own thread if i have time.

I believe the best way to run your cooling system is w/ the radiator in the rear. No matter how you set it up, orientation and flow, you may consider adding an aditional flow pump in line. I work for GM at a local chevy dealer and can tell you that the added friction of heater/cooling hose will very quickly be too much for the pumps output at idle. You can see evidence of this on a tahoe/suburban w/ rear heat. The heater hardly operates at idle, but w/ the engine at 1500 R's and up the flow will get the hot coolant to the rear.

To recap - don't rely completely on the engine powered pump if you are running the radiators in the rear - yet the rear seems the only place to run them.

also look in to front engine bracketry from the 98-04 vette for the front of your engine. (i would slide mine back an inch or soo too)

hope i helped a little and if you need some help or info feel free to PM - i don't have much time for this internet stuff but i'll do my best to help out if/when i can.

good luck and congrats on a cool buggy so far

Hybridr-tele :sweat:
Thanks for the help. I think I'm going to do just that, what you recommended. Where about are you located in Houston?
 
#519 ·
FRY ROAD AND HWY 290....

i just came across a manual steering rack off a new body Cobalt if you are interested. I'm planning on running mine w/ manual steering so i don't have to screw w/ the pump and the plumbing of the power steering.

If you want the steering rack its yours free... i have two of them w/ tie rods and all
 
#520 ·
HYBRIDR-TELE said:
FRY ROAD AND HWY 290....

i just came across a manual steering rack off a new body Cobalt if you are interested. I'm planning on running mine w/ manual steering so i don't have to screw w/ the pump and the plumbing of the power steering.

If you want the steering rack its yours free... i have two of them w/ tie rods and all
You're close. I'm off Barker Cypress and 290. I'll have to come check out your project some.

Thanks for the offer, but I have a manual box already. I agree, it's one less thing you have to worry about hooking up going with manual. I would take the rack off your hands only if the radiator fit without the steering box in the way. I went home during lunch to see if it would but it didn't. :(

Oh well, on to fitting the radiator in the rear. :thumbup:
 
#521 ·
TALKING bout a steering rack... not gear - i recall reading you were using a gearbox ( i may be mistaken, i didn't read everything thoroughly )

see pic of the two i just snagged at work (if it shows, first time posting here)

i work at the chevy place right near you (i chose not to post the name)

more of a project for you, but more room w/ a rack if you feel like workin it in.

:thumbup:

*EDIT* - I misread - i didn't catch that even w/ a rack u have no room
 

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#522 ·
HYBRIDR-TELE said:
TALKING bout a steering rack... not gear - i recall reading you were using a gearbox ( i may be mistaken, i didn't read everything thoroughly )

see pic of the two i just snagged at work (if it shows, first time posting here)

i work at the chevy place right near you (i chose not to post the name)

more of a project for you, but more room w/ a rack if you feel like workin it in.

:thumbup:

*EDIT* - I misread - i didn't catch that even w/ a rack u have no room
I'm just curious, would there be any narrowing or modifications I would have to make to the rack or spindles to make the rack work? Or would it bolt right up once I've fabricated a mount for the rack?

I'll play with the radiator some more tonight just to make sure I can't squeeze the radiator and fan in. I can move the engine back about half an inch and see if that would do it. :thumbup:

Thanks.
 
#523 ·
I don't have a clue on the fitment just yet - i just got them so i haven't had time to mock them up.

If the rod ends have to be shortened a little it's easy to hack a bit off, and if they have to be extended a lot it should be simple to adapt the s-10 outer rod to the cobalt inner - there is a grey area of fitment that i'm not sure of and would have to be mocked in place to measure out.

its free if you want it - if it doesn't work out, throw it in the trash

lmk

l8r

HybridR-Tele
 
#524 ·
HYBRIDR-TELE said:
I don't have a clue on the fitment just yet - i just got them so i haven't had time to mock them up.

If the rod ends have to be shortened a little it's easy to hack a bit off, and if they have to be extended a lot it should be simple to adapt the s-10 outer rod to the cobalt inner - there is a grey area of fitment that i'm not sure of and would have to be mocked in place to measure out.

its free if you want it - if it doesn't work out, throw it in the trash

lmk

l8r

HybridR-Tele
True. PM sent.
 
#525 ·
Did a little work last night. Mainly mocking up trying to figure things out which hopefully you guys can help.

I mounted the fan to the radiator. Do you think I'll need a shroud if I'll have a duct drawing air from under the car? See duct explanation below.






I picked up a manual rack from Matt, whom is building a V8 bug out of a S10 chassis believe it or not, and I'm going to see if I can't make it work. Seems like it might. Cross your fingers. Thanks, Matt!




With the steering box out of the way, in hopes the rack works out, I had enough room to mount my alternator with the low mount bracket I recently bought. High five!




Next, I mocked up the placement of the radiator out back. I'd like to mount it like the last picture, on an incline, so I can make the duct work better, I think. Also, what do you guys think about mounting it inclined and having an inline radiator filler neck in the engine compartment close by the top water neck that comes from the intake? Like the one pictured below. Do you think that would create any problems just keeping the rear cap on and filling the radiator using the inline neck? If I mount it at angle it'll be hard to access the radiator filler neck.

If worse comes to worse I'll mount it like the other picture.








The duct work will look like this, somewhat. Less boxy looking though.




All thoughts and opinions are welcome.
 
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