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Old 07-02-2009, 10:56 AM
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Vacuum Delay Check Valve for 2004R Lockup

I read on another forum that GM part no. 14020691 was a vacuum delay check valve that could be placed on the vacuum line to the vacuum switch that controlled TCC lockup. This valve would cause a few seconds delay in the lockup to help prevent a cycling lock-unlock situation under moderate to heavy throttle. The GM part is $15.

Does anyone know if this part from Advance Auto serves the same function -- called a Vacuum storage switch.

http://shop.advanceautoparts.com/webapp/wcs/stores/servlet/product_Vacuum-Storage-Dorman_5707110-P_N3110_A|GRP2037____

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Old 07-02-2009, 07:33 PM
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Found out the GM part has been discontinued, but some auto parts store, indluding Advance Auto, have a replacement made by Borg Warner, EC342. NAPA also has one by Echlin, CRB 22983. Cost is $6-8.
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Old 07-03-2009, 07:22 PM
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I'd like to know how this works! My ride is about roadworthy and all I have is a 4th gear switch...

Russ
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Old 07-03-2009, 07:53 PM
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I got the BW EC342 part and tried it today. I don't think it will work. It seems to be a one way check valve, not a delay valve. I put it in-line with a vacuum gauge to maniforld vacuum. In one position the vacuum gauge never saw any engine vacuum. Reversing it in-line the vacuum gauge jumped to 20 hg and just stayed there when I turned the engine off. Truly a one-way check valve, not a delay valve.

S10xGN, are you running your TC lockup power through the brake switch and a vacuum switch as well as a toggle switch?

These two switches make the TC lockup fairly automatic. I am just looking for this additional delay switch to keep it from locking up immediately when vacuum is high.

John
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Old 07-04-2009, 07:32 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by JohnTN
...S10xGN, are you running your TC lockup power through the brake switch and a vacuum switch as well as a toggle switch? ...John

Just a 4th gear pressure switch in series with the brake switch. I've heard several horror stories on using a vacuum switch in line with it. Was hoping your solution would push me into trying the vacuum too. I haven't driven it yet, but got the plates and registration this week.

Russ
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Old 07-04-2009, 09:38 PM
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S10xGN,

The vacuum switch makes the car much more driveable -- I don't know of any negatives associated with it.

If you need more power for climbing a hill or accelerating, just give it more throttle and the vacuum switch will disengage the lockup, giving about 200 more rpm and more power.

At slow steady speeds (30-40 mph on winding country roads or in city traffic) in OD with lockup the car can tend to lug a little. In such situations, I just disengage lockup by turning if off with the toggle switch. Or it will cut in and out thru the vacuum switch operation -- but this can be kind of jerky if it keeps cutting in and out.

So, I was hoping the vacuum delay valve might reduce the frequency of cycling in these slow speed situations without using the toggle switch to turn it off. I highly recommend the vacuum switch, though.
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Old 07-08-2009, 07:29 PM
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Time Delay Relay

I found the best solution to delay the lock up is with a 12v time delay relay. I used a IDCC part #GT5Y-4SN6D12. you can set the delay for anywhere from 1 sec. to 60min. It cost $33.00. I have mine set for 8 sec. and it works great.
There is an adjustment knob on it so you can set it for what ever suits you.
If you want more info, let me know
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Old 07-09-2009, 11:23 AM
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Clue us in! Are you running this delay in series with a vacuum switch or is it stand-alone? Is it delaying the lockup or unlock? Can you upload a wiring diagram?

TIA!

Russ
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Old 07-09-2009, 12:48 PM
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The approach of using an electrical time delay sounds like the best -- not dependent on vacuum fluctuations with engine load.

But I have already ordered a DSV35 from an EBay store and it arrived today.

First I connected it to a manifold vacuum and tested it in both orientations. With the DIST side toward the carb, vacuum slowly increased (about 1" hg/sec) to 18" at idle and this is what I wanted in order to delay lockup.

But, when I put in into the vacuum line from ported vacuum to the vacuum switch the trans never locked up. I then put a vacuum gauge on this ported fitting (low on front passengers side of QJet) and discovered the vacuum was zero at idle but only 4-5" at 1000 rpm and 8-9" at 1500 rpm, apparently not enough to activate the vacuum switch with the delay valve installed. (The trans lock ups up quickly off this port without the delay valve).

So, I guess I will see if there is another ported fitting on the QJet that has stronger vacuum with the throttle opened.


John
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Old 07-09-2009, 01:10 PM
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S10xGN,

I would think the electrical delay would be wired in series between the vacuum switch and the transmission. So, when high vacuum from the carb/engine activates the vacuum switch power flows to the electrical delay switch and 8 seconds elaspes before the current is actually passed on through to the transmission for lockup.

Run a vacuum line from the carb ported vacuum source to the vacuum switch, then the electrical wiring is:

12 v power source--->brake switch--->vacuum switch-->elec delay--->trans

(You can also insert a toggle switch between the brake switch and vacuum switch to completely disable the lockup function if desired.)

So lockup only occurs when the throttle is open under low or moderate load (providing vacuum to the vacuum switch), the toggle switch is in the ON position, and the brake pedal is not depressed. If any of these conditions is not met power cannot get to the lockup solenoid and the lockup disengages.

John
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Old 07-09-2009, 06:31 PM
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This is how I hooked up the time delay relay. I started with the TCI vacuum switch set up. I use the ported side on the carb, and adj. the vacuum switch to close with minimum vacuum. I also have a mode switch tied in with this circuit, but for simplicity purpose I will leave out of this discussion. The time delay relay contacts are in series with the +12vdc going to Pin A on the tranny plug. The coil of the relay is paralle to the TCC solenoid in the Tranny.
Here is the way it is hooked up, then I will explain how it works.

One side of the TDR (time delay relay) is wired to Pin B on the tranny plug
(this will be ground when the vacuum switch is closed)

The other side is wired to a +12vdc fused source

I then installed a jumper wire from the +12vdc coil terminal on the TDR to the common terminal of one of the sets of contacts.

The contacts have a normally opened & normal closed. Use the NO contacts.

From this terminal run a wire to the A pin on the tranny plug (this will provide +12vdc to the TCC Solenoid after the delay.

Her is how it works:

With you foot on the gas will close the vacumm switch.

When the tranny shifts to fourth gear, the 4th. gear pressure switch will close completing a ground circuit through pin B to one side of the TDR coil.

This will cause the relay to energies because there is a constant +12vdc to the other side of the coil.

This sets up the time delay which is set with the knob on the TDR (this can be set any where from 1 sec to 60 min mine is set for 8 sec.)

If you want to unlock the converter, you let off of the gas quickly and get back on it, and the time delay will start over.

I have a draft schematic that took me a while to figure it out. I soon as I clean it up, I will post it.

If you have any questions, let me know
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Old 07-09-2009, 06:33 PM
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Hey JohnTN, I forgot to ask you where are you located in TN? I am in the Nashville area.
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Old 07-09-2009, 06:44 PM
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Ted, I am in west Knoxville.

Your setup sounds more complicated that I suspected. Couldn't the relay be in series in the external wire to the transmission between the vacuum switch and transmission?

And would this one work:

http://www.fadfusion.com/selection.p...er=20084200370

Shipping adds $7.

John
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Old 07-09-2009, 07:00 PM
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JohnTN it is not really that complicated, and it is all external of the tranny.
I origional tried to hook it up in series with the vaccum switch, but I couldn't make it work. I can't remember why right now. With this circuit you only have to hook up three wires and a jumper.

I quickly looked at the pulse delay you suggested. I think it is just that, a pulse. You need something that holds the circuit like the TDR.
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