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Old 03-09-2004, 10:51 AM
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Victor Jr vs. AFR heads?

Ok, I was talking with local speed shop and he said he can't make a good deal about AFR heads. Damn I'm really "in love" to those 195 or 210cc heads.

So he suggested me to think Edelbrocks Victor Jr or Pro Topline heads. Well from Pro heads I've heard so far just negative, so that turns me more to Victors.

So what would you suggest? Should I just go and ask from some one else to get me pair of AFRs or will I be as happy with Victor heads?

Thanks,
Jare

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Old 03-09-2004, 10:54 AM
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There both great heads, i haven't ever heard a bad thing about ether of them.
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Old 03-09-2004, 11:24 AM
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The Pro Toplines are no good. The company is going under, from down under... and they don't seem to honor any warranties. I think either the AFR or Victor Jr's would be great. I think the AFR heads are ported from the factory, so that would be why they have the high flow numbers, but I also know that the Victor Jr's have great flow rates without the extra porting. If you can get a good deal on either set, go for it... Let us know how it turns out.

Rick
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Old 03-09-2004, 12:32 PM
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I would go AFR's hands down. Quality is there, performance is there. Easy people to deal with later down the road.

Chris
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Old 03-09-2004, 12:43 PM
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I would call Dave at JDS performance and he will give you the best price available anywhere on the AFR heads. I got my AFR 195 w/upgrade springs for solid cam (part#8033), steam holes drilled, and free shipping for $1425
Here is the break down on what I paid:

AFR 195 part# 1036 $1250
Part#1260 Steam holes drilled $50.00
Upgrade to part# 8033, Solid Springs
Flat Tappet Springs 1.550 O.D. $125.00

http://www.jdsperformance.com/index....tem&inmake=all
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Old 03-10-2004, 12:53 AM
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I just ordered a set of the AFR heads for my project.Nice people, showed great interest in my project.We stayed on the phone for 45min. talking and making shure that was what I wanted. They also had some good suggestions for cam choice .The only thing I didnt like was the 6-8 week deliver time,but quality takes time.
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Old 03-10-2004, 08:52 AM
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Quote:
Originally posted by Delirious2000
The Pro Toplines are no good. The company is going under, from down under... and they don't seem to honor any warranties. I think either the AFR or Victor Jr's would be great. I think the AFR heads are ported from the factory, so that would be why they have the high flow numbers, but I also know that the Victor Jr's have great flow rates without the extra porting. If you can get a good deal on either set, go for it... Let us know how it turns out.

Rick

Going under doesnt make them a bad head. Infact the Pro-Topline is a great head at a great price. The problem was they were saying there heads flowed more then they did. They would list 305cfm when they were only flowing 275. The figuers they posted were too good to be true. Which is why they went under. I would be pissed buying a set of 305cfm heads and only getting 275cfm.
However with that in mind it doesnt make the heads bad at all. In fact For the price its still a heck of a deal. They still have very good flow rates, and are a great head. These heads would of really taken off if the company had been more honest about flow rates. But like I said just because they lied about flow rates doesnt make them a bad head. These heads have lots of good things about them and a great product to work with.
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Old 03-10-2004, 09:07 AM
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Pro Toplines are very good heads. The main reason they are going under (bankruptcy) is because they were doing so well, they bought another company and was spending way to much money. Finacialy they had problems (bad spending habits) and that is what the problem is. It has nothing to do with the quality of the cylinder heads. I don't think they will be going out of business, and if they do we will see a new name and the same heads.

Of course the AFRs flow more than most out of the box heads, but that's because they are ported from the factory. This is not a bad thing, but they are over rated/over priced (IMO). Still a very good head, but I know of Trick Flow heads that out flow the AFRs. Flow is not everything though.

You didn't give any details on what these heads are going on so I don't see how anyone could make a suggestion. We don't know the engine size or the intended use of the car. You may not even need that much cylinder head or you might need more.

Just something to think about.

Royce
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Old 03-10-2004, 12:13 PM
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Quote:
Originally posted by camaroman7d


You didn't give any details on what these heads are going on so I don't see how anyone could make a suggestion. We don't know the engine size or the intended use of the car. You may not even need that much cylinder head or you might need more.

Just something to think about.

Royce
Engine is going to be 383 at next winter and buying the heads for that (now engine is 355cid). Comp ratio is measured now with 882 heads to be 10,5:1. Mechanical Roller cam (number: 12-704-8) and hoping to push over 500 horses out of it when its 383. Converter is about 3000-3200rpm TH350 automatic and Toyota transfer case and the tube framed Jeep weight is going to be close to 1500kg. Axles made by Volvo with 100% diff locks and 6:1 gear ratio. 35" off road tyres/paddles and 4wd and going up (sometimes roll down) really steep sand and dirt hills

So it needs to be strong/torque from 3000 up to......well up where it pulls easily. Maybe that gives you some ideas

Thanks for the answers so far. This is great to hear real life experience from the parts. Here in Finland lives only 5 million people and there ain't so many guys building these Chevy engines

Jare

PS: You can see some pics of the Jeep project from the begining to these days (new pics at the end of forum):

http://www.pirate4x4.com/forum/showt...threadid=98946
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Old 03-10-2004, 12:41 PM
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I can tell you that I have used them all in my years. As far as the AFR and the Vic Jr. heads go, I feel that either one represents a quality product and they perform very well. I generally use more Vic Jr heads because I am on the east coast and I have an Edelbrock supplier that delivers the heads to me where the AFRs get sent UPS so I have a shipping charge. Aside from that, I say use whichever you please.

As far as the ProTopline heads go, they are fine but just do not expect to take them out of the box and use them. We bought 2 pairs of the big Chevy heads for a pair of marine engines and my cylinder head man was stunned to find that these "ready for assembly" castings had seats that were no more than .005" wide on some seats. I buy these heads at what I feel are the best price available but when you factor in the extra work that has to be done, it is not such a great deal anymore. As a side note to that, they talked me into trying another set and I got a set of the aluminum small Chevy heads to see how they looked. They are on the Serdi now getting the seats re-cut.

One more thing. Always pressure test new heads! I got burned by World Products on an engine that I put their heads on. We had been using their heads since they started in business and never had a problem. I had the customer call and tell me that he noticed he had water in the oil after his initial break in. After checking the obvious items, I had him pull the motor and bring it in. One of the heads were leaking from the unused center valve cover bolt hole. World said that they would replace or repair the head. The problem is, I was stuck with the labor, gaskets, bearings, etc. They only cover their product and not the damage it causes. I found out that this is pretty common with all the companies. I just thought I would relay that to you. I pressure test every new casting now.
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Old 03-10-2004, 01:25 PM
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Machineman great info thanks!!

Friend of mine bought Pro Topline aluminum heads to his small chevy and they are still in machine shop. There were different size chambers, valve heights vary and some other things too. So cheap price ain't so good at the last point. Maybe he just should have stayd with his camel hump heads

Jare

PS. Here's four video clips of the sport where this motor is going. First one is from Norway, 2003 Champion with 355 chevy dynoed 488 horses. Other two are from 454 powered (~600-650HP) Jeep from Sweden. These guys drives in same class where I'm suppose too. Last one is of Special class winner 2003 from Norway. He has 840 dyno horsed 540cid Chevy under the hood. Thank god I don't have to race against him.....yet

http://fullmoon.serveftp.org/frogner...ross%20046.mpg

http://www.evsatersel.se/rooster/fil...8/bana6_as.WMV

http://www.evsatersel.se/rooster/fil...6/bana5_as.WMV

http://www.otc-mc.org/~087/vormsund/VormsundFilm13.MPG

Last edited by Jare; 03-10-2004 at 02:21 PM.
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Old 03-10-2004, 01:42 PM
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Ask Joe Sherman what cyl. heads he used to win the Engine Masters Challenge.... AFR 215 cc raised runner ... You get what you pay for.
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Old 03-10-2004, 07:22 PM
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I've heard nothing but good words about AFR heads. I've been running a set of Vic Jrs on my 347 for a year now, and they're truly fantastic as well. I haven't done anything with them (as far as port work, etc), and they're extremely responsive. Needless to say, I'm quite happy. As far as heads for my other car, if I had to choose between the Vic Jrs and the AFRs, I'd probably be torn, much like you are right now.
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Old 03-11-2004, 12:42 PM
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I would go with the AFR's. You can get a set with the street porting for $1,250. A set of unported Victor Jrs will cost you $1100. So you are paying $150 for 100% CNC ported combustion chambers, 100% CNC ported exhaust runners, and 70% CNC ported intake ports. That is alot of porting and flow improvement for $150. A set of CNC ported AFR's will outperform a set of unported Victor jr's hands down. With a set of 195cc AFRs on a 383, you could easily make over 500 hp with the right cam on pump gas.

Good luck
Adam
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