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Old 07-08-2013, 05:16 PM
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Vortec CSFI Rating

Does anybody know the CFM rating on the 96/01 CSFI used on the vortec V-8's ?

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Old 07-08-2013, 10:50 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jokerZ71 View Post
Does anybody know the CFM rating on the 96/01 CSFI used on the vortec V-8's ?
I think maybe hog would know, maybe he'll chime in.
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Old 07-09-2013, 12:30 AM
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I'm not sure but the system it replaced was around 490 cfm at 1.5 in/Hg for the SBC and something around 650 cfm for the BBC TBI.

The CSFI is said to support a max of 400 hp, that takes somewhere around 550-600 cfm from a carb rated at 1.5 in/hg. The SCFI is a lower rpm deal, don't expect good flow at higher rpm.

You prolly know this already but most guys replace the poppet valves w/mini injectors to get some reliability out of the setup.
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Old 07-09-2013, 04:20 AM
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I'm not sure but the system it replaced was around 490 cfm at 1.5 in/Hg for the SBC and something around 650 cfm for the BBC TBI.

The CSFI is said to support a max of 400 hp, that takes somewhere around 550-600 cfm from a carb rated at 1.5 in/hg. The SCFI is a lower rpm deal, don't expect good flow at higher rpm.

You prolly know this already but most guys replace the poppet valves w/mini injectors to get some reliability out of the setup.
I have the upgraded injector setup.I knew the TBI was rated @ approx 500,so,I was gessing maybe 600 to maybe 650 for the CSFI.The Ramjet is about 1000.I have done searches everywhere & there doesn't seem to be an actual CFM #.The poppets are supposedly 19 pph.The upgrade @ 58 psi is spose to be 24pph,but, I can't seem to find actual airflow on the stock unit.I know it's restrictive with the spider in the middle of airflow.My son wants to swap his 6.2 diesel for a 350.Trying to determine which setup.I have both available w/ wire harnesses & cotrollers.From what I'm hearing is that even with mods to either'that you start gettin into WOT lean conditions after about 350 HP.I don't know that to be fact,but,if true,wouldn't that suggest that fuel rather than air would be the bottleneck?

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Old 07-09-2013, 07:50 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jokerZ71 View Post
From what I'm hearing is that even with mods to either'that you start gettin into WOT lean conditions after about 350 HP.I don't know that to be fact,but,if true,wouldn't that suggest that fuel rather than air would be the bottleneck?
I know very little about that setup even though one came on a Vortec engine I bought a while ago. If what you say is the case, I agree- it sounds like a lack of fuel rather than air. Traditionally (using hard parts), upgrading the injectors and/or upping the fuel pressure helped w/leanness.
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Old 07-09-2013, 11:05 AM
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Upgrade to the Marine intake. No EGR provisions so you would have to tune out the EGR, but with that manifold, it becomes MPFI and the sky is the limit... You can also swap in a 411 ECU and use a 2002 Chevy van tune ( was still 5.7L then ). OR, you can also swap in a LS based Vortec truck V8 with a standalone harness and have more power and tuning than you could ever need.
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Old 07-09-2013, 12:36 PM
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I've kinda kept up with the marine intake swap & I can appreciate the work dedication that went into bringin it about.They are harder to come by now & have gotten pricey.For a lil bit more I can piece together a Ramjet setup.I love my EFI,but,I really don't like the look of the CSFI or the marine setup.I want something I guess kinda Old School looks with the Performance of the EFI.I've thought about installin injector bungs in a carb intake & using somethin like the Edelbrock elbow to mount my TB.I can't afford one of those turnkey units.
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Old 07-10-2013, 11:14 AM
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I don't know what the cfm rating of the intake manifold itself is, but the t-body is 73mm unit at its smallest point.

Ramjets are fine, they do take more work to install in a Vortec 305/350 application. The bare intake itself is $500-$600 new without anything else included.
Marine intakes are around $900 new and come with, fuel rails, 8 fuel injectors, IAT/MAP sensor, T-body, FPR, TPS and other things. They are certainly becoming difficult to source. GM is hoarding them for their own production of Vortec 350 marine/industrial engines.


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Hog
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Old 07-10-2013, 11:20 AM
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Oops, the CSFI spider is rated at roughly 23lb/hr at 63psi fuel pressure.

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Hog
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Old 07-10-2013, 12:30 PM
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I priced everything out for the Ramjet based on the assumption that I could use my distributor & PCM.It's been awhile,but,I think it came in @ around $1000 not including tuning.I think there were some fit problems with A/C compressor needin to be moved or @ least modified.You would think as many 350's as GM sells that they would be trying to market the marine intake or some version of it as a Hi Po alternative to the stock unit.Do you know much about the cast iron intake that CFM Tech sells?
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Old 07-10-2013, 12:42 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jokerZ71 View Post
I priced everything out for the Ramjet based on the assumption that I could use my distributor & PCM.It's been awhile,but,I think it came in @ around $1000 not including tuning.I think there were some fit problems with A/C compressor needin to be moved or @ least modified.You would think as many 350's as GM sells that they would be trying to market the marine intake or some version of it as a Hi Po alternative to the stock unit.Do you know much about the cast iron intake that CFM Tech sells?
GM wouldn't market the marineintake for CSFI replacement because of emissions. In fact they went the other way and market the HT383E which is a larger engine for use with STOCK CSFI intakes.

Yes, I have heard of the cats iron intake CFM Tech sells. Isnt it $400 and a carb intake.
There are some Edelbrock intakes that I like better, but so long as you can plumb the intake for fuel rails and injectors it will theoretically work.

peace
Hog
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Old 07-10-2013, 01:03 PM
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Yep.The intake is $400 & already has injector bungs.I love the E'brocks.Just can't afford it.LOL.I love that elbow you can get thru them.I would like to use somethin like that on an aluminum dual plane bored for injectors.I've seen articles where ppl are doin it,but,you hardly ever see any followups to say how it worked out.LOL.Maybe it didn't.As for the HT383E,it is way overpriced for the gains in stock form.For that matter,so is the Ramjet 350.A guy I work with saw a 30 HP gain after tuning on an HT383E with the stock CSFI & a set of shortys.He says it also burns average 2 quts of oil between changes.GM told him that wuzn't excessive.My 283K Goodwrench crate only uses half a quart between changes.
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Old 07-11-2013, 12:54 PM
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I have heard of many problems with the HT383, ZZ383 and HT383-E crate engines using a lot of oil. They all use the same exact longblock.

I agree they are all overpriced, but I can also see how they sell a lot due to the simplicity of the installs.

GM even stats that the HT383-E kit requires PCM tuning for max results. The tsock 1/2 ton pipes are only dual 1 7/8" with crimps that bring that diameter way down in the bends.
1/2 ton on left, 3/4 ton on right, both from L31 350 applications.



Even on a stock 350 L31 a PCM tune nets big gains, esp when combined with exhaust mods. Mild PCM and 24621hkr Competition series Hooker headers, dual 2 1/2" stainless, dual 2 1/2" cats into dual 4" exits that go out before the passenger side rear tire along with a mild 87 octane PCM tune that only leaned out the WOT fueling a tad dropped my 1/4 mile by just under 1 second.

So that same lame PCM tuning on a 383 wouldn't be any better, but at least GM talks about PCM tuniung in the GM Performance PArts (now Chev Performance Parts) Catalogue.

2 quarts every 3,000 miles is too much. I could understand 1 quart every change. The p/n 282 and 283 Goodwrench longblocks are a steal at $1900-$2000 brand new.
A Ramjet 350 crate is a 283 longblock with the marine cam, Ramjet injection manifold and electronics and 1.6:1 roller rockers and it adds another $3000 to the price.
Heck add another $1000 and a brand new LS3 with an ASA cam and enjoy 525hp from 376 cubes.
But I digress.
If you are into GEN 1 stuff, the Goodwrench L31 is hard to beat.

peace
Hog
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Old 07-11-2013, 02:01 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jokerZ71 View Post
I would like to use somethin like that on an aluminum dual plane bored for injectors.I've seen articles where ppl are doin it,but,you hardly ever see any followups to say how it worked out.LOL.Maybe it didn't
I cannot think of a single dual plane multiport intake available on a factory engine. Largely because it doesn't work. Instead just develop a "tunnel ram" style of intake like GM has used on just about every multiport EFI engine since the 90's.
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Old 07-11-2013, 03:27 PM
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I've saw 2 articles of someone using a dual plane for the conversion.Both big block Fords.Most conversions use single plane.#1 it's a lot easier becuz the runners are the same hgt. #2 They claim that since it's dry flow instead of wet,that it doesn't effect performance as with a carb.The lower runners had a weld added then machined so that all the bungs were the same hgt.Both articles went into great detail about the work,but,never any followup on how they performed.They look awesome,but, looks won't getcha down the rd.

Last edited by jokerZ71; 07-11-2013 at 03:33 PM.
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