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Old 10-13-2008, 08:00 AM
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Water pump elec vs mech

Hello
I fired up my engine for the first time this past week to break in the cam. I had hoped to be able to go to the track with the car this fall for some test passes, so I had put on an Moroso elec pump I have which did not require me to try fitting pulleys
I have a new Moroso mech pump to use on the street, but I have to fab up alt brkts and pulleys will require some work to align properly
The Moroso pump flows 19 gpm, but the motor got warm so I had to break in the cam in two segments
Has anyone ran a similar electric pump on the street? I know the bigger electric pumps flow a lot more water..35-37 gpm and some even more
I am fabbing up the brkts for the mech pump now. It has a new alum rad, but no shroud for the electric fan plus the motor was at 2,300 rpm with no highway air running through it. It has 11.5: 1 comp (427) and was not running too lean. lots of oil pressure even when hot., plugs look good, nothing in the oil
thanks
Tom

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Old 10-13-2008, 08:02 AM
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Old 10-13-2008, 09:38 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by henny496
Hello
I fired up my engine for the first time this past week to break in the cam. I had hoped to be able to go to the track with the car this fall for some test passes, so I had put on an Moroso elec pump I have which did not require me to try fitting pulleys
I have a new Moroso mech pump to use on the street, but I have to fab up alt brkts and pulleys will require some work to align properly
The Moroso pump flows 19 gpm, but the motor got warm so I had to break in the cam in two segments
Has anyone ran a similar electric pump on the street? I know the bigger electric pumps flow a lot more water..35-37 gpm and some even more
I am fabbing up the brkts for the mech pump now. It has a new alum rad, but no shroud for the electric fan plus the motor was at 2,300 rpm with no highway air running through it. It has 11.5: 1 comp (427) and was not running too lean. lots of oil pressure even when hot., plugs look good, nothing in the oil
thanks
Tom
I run the CSR unit on my car,aluminium radiator,and the Flex-a-lite part #FLX-240.My car has pretty good compression."14-1",468 CI and a big cam shaft. That combo has never let me down YET.one time I got stuck in traffic,it was pretty hot outside and it got to 210,but I was stuck at quite a few lights.other than that that set up has worked flawless for me.
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Old 10-13-2008, 10:16 AM
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Thanks very much for your reply. The Moroso pump I have flows half what you probably have. I just wonder how much a mechanical pump flows or cools at the same rpm as the Moroso unit
thanks
Tom
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Old 10-13-2008, 10:30 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by henny496
Thanks very much for your reply. The Moroso pump I have flows half what you probably have. I just wonder how much a mechanical pump flows or cools at the same rpm as the Moroso unit
thanks
Tom
Mechanical pumps vary, but 10 gallons per minute per 1000 RPM is a pretty reasonable average.

Bogie
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Old 10-13-2008, 10:38 AM
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for a new motor/cam break in.....
keep a garden hose turned on with a sprayer nozzle handy....
just a mist of water onto the rad will cool it down alot....

to early to tell if lack of pump gpm was the "source" problem,,,, may well have been a steam pocket on the intial start up or just break-in friction.....
can be stat flow restriction, or to much or to little bypass flow diverting flow from the rad

try no stat and clamp off the bypass hoses after the stat is open so there is 100% pump flow thru the rad to evaluate what 19gpm actually does yield for cooling with the present rad....
do some experimenting first, you can flow to much to fast thru a rad....

just food for thought:
"more than one way to skin a cat" example:
for FL traffic and summer heat, I have a $6 Ace Hardware manual shut off valve on the heater hose for more rad flow/less bypass to help when the AC is running,,,makes a 15* difference and the interior stays cooler/less load on the AC....

based on the info so far (11.5CR), I definitely would add a good oil cooler if you haven't yet,,,,that will take alot of load off the rad and help protect the motor by cooling the rotating assembly directly!!! (instead of the oil transfering the heat to the block to be picked up by the coolant)
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Old 10-13-2008, 10:42 AM
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Thanks for that info. If that is correct then at 2,000 rpm the mech pump should be the same as the Moroso electric pump I had on
I bought the electric pump is used though, the Moroso mech pump I have is new. I ran this motor many years ago(different water pump), it has just been freshened up
The only other difference is that I have a restrictor washer in the thermostat where before I ran it without anything and with a smaller rad
thanks
Tom
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Old 10-13-2008, 10:47 AM
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Thanks Red 65, I guess I was a bit slow typing my response
I do have a new Moroso accumulator that I had not put on yet. I could do that for this winter
I do have a lot of new parts around. I did not buy everything new from a speedshop, some guys bought stuff and never used them, so I got quite a bit at a good price over the past 7.5 yrs doing this build

I had wondered about the washer in the thermostat also . I was writing that as you had responded
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Old 10-13-2008, 11:41 AM
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My 2 cents:

Mechanical = tried, true, effective, reliable, and they give you warnings before they fail.

Electrical = limited life, fail at odd times without warning, additional draw from the alternator negates a tiny bit of their gains.

On the track, electrics are great. On the street you couldn't pay me to have an electric. Our last club cruise in 2 of the 7 electric-pumped street cars showed up on a flatbed. I know that isn't representative and probably a fluke, but there is just no real reason for them on the street IMHO.
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Old 10-13-2008, 12:07 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by curtis73
My 2 cents:

Mechanical = tried, true, effective, reliable, and they give you warnings before they fail.

Electrical = limited life, fail at odd times without warning, additional draw from the alternator negates a tiny bit of their gains.

On the track, electrics are great. On the street you couldn't pay me to have an electric. Our last club cruise in 2 of the 7 electric-pumped street cars showed up on a flatbed. I know that isn't representative and probably a fluke, but there is just no real reason for them on the street IMHO.
I hope you just didn't jenx mine! Mine has been on for 3 years with no troubles.I have some buddy's that have problems with the proform unit's.
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Old 10-13-2008, 12:12 PM
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Hello Curtis
I only had the electric on since it was supposed to be going to the track this year for a few passes. I am hoping the heat problem is due to the small gpm Moroso electric pump and will go away once the mech pump is on..dunno
As with everything else on this car though, stuff just does not bolt on without having to make or modify parts. I ordered a new lower pulley but I will probably have to space it out since I have a motor plate on the car. The alternator won't fit with conventional brkts, so I have to make some and mount another alt pulley in front of the water pump pulley
This means the crank to water pump should use an idler pulley for any belt tensioning device. This takes more time and now they are saying we may have snow late next week
I am just hoping the mech pump will fix this and I have not wasted precious time( Honey-do list on the yard is not getting any shorter and that has to be done as well before it gets worse for weather)
thanks
Tom
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