Welding diff - Hot Rod Forum : Hotrodders Bulletin Board
Hotrodders.com -- Hot Rod Forum



Register FAQ Search Today's Posts Unanswered Posts Auto Escrow Insurance Auto Loans
Hot Rod Forum : Hotrodders Bulletin Board > Tech Help> Hotrodding Basics
User Name
Password
lost password?   |   register now

Reply
 
LinkBack Thread Tools
  #1 (permalink)  
Old 02-23-2013, 07:31 PM
bigdog7373's Avatar
Of course it's fast
 
Last photo:
Join Date: May 2010
Location: florida
Posts: 2,673
Wiki Edits: 0

Thanks: 13
Thanked 48 Times in 48 Posts
Welding diff

So as some of you know I'm slowly building my 78 firebird to be a t/a clone with a modern import kinda twist (it's gonna be sick, don't worry). Well i am going to be going with a posi rear when i drop in the Ls powerplant. But for now the one-wheel-wonder open diff is driving me crazy. So i was thinking i'd just weld it. My question is that when i swap out the internal stuff i won't need to keep any of the old stuff correct? Cause all you weld is the spider gears and the posi unit replaces them i believe. Just making sure I'm not doing anything stupid here lol. Thanks in advance.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Sponsored Links
Advertisement
 
  #2 (permalink)  
Old 02-23-2013, 07:47 PM
vinniekq2's Avatar
Registered User
 
Join Date: Jun 2012
Location: BC,Canada
Age: 56
Posts: 6,746
Wiki Edits: 0

Thanks: 236
Thanked 619 Times in 602 Posts
do you have traction bars? welded rear ends dont last long. something will break. If you buy a posi carrier and new sides and spiders then you wont ruin anything with a weld
dont break any axles
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
  #3 (permalink)  
Old 02-23-2013, 07:48 PM
327NUT's Avatar
Registered User
 
Last photo:
Join Date: Dec 2004
Location: So. Utah
Age: 67
Posts: 3,179
Wiki Edits: 0

Thanks: 0
Thanked 58 Times in 52 Posts
If this is going to be used on the street DON'T weld the spiders. Not going to go into the why....there's plenty of info by doing a search......not safe.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
  #4 (permalink)  
Old 02-23-2013, 07:53 PM
bigdog7373's Avatar
Of course it's fast
 
Last photo:
Join Date: May 2010
Location: florida
Posts: 2,673
Wiki Edits: 0

Thanks: 13
Thanked 48 Times in 48 Posts
I have friends running welding diffs on the street and the only time they have trouble is rain. My wipers don't work so i don't drive in the rain anyway lol. Problem solved. It's only temporary until i get a locker or posi. It doesn't get driven much anyway, i just need to see how she handles drifting so i can see how horrible the suspension is. That's what i want to do with her anyway, and some road course.
.
Thanks vinnie. I don't have traction bars. It's all stock.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
  #5 (permalink)  
Old 02-23-2013, 08:05 PM
vinniekq2's Avatar
Registered User
 
Join Date: Jun 2012
Location: BC,Canada
Age: 56
Posts: 6,746
Wiki Edits: 0

Thanks: 236
Thanked 619 Times in 602 Posts
The reason I asked about traction bars:
preload right side and leave 1 inch gap on left side.or maybe 1 1/4,both tires will drive the car sometimes.all has to do with the correct tune for weight transfer and torque applied to your f body

welded gears will put you all over the road even in the dry,around all corners,this is why 327 says its unsafe,because its not very safe

the welds usually break leaving the diff full of junk thats hard to take apart for rrepairs.
If you break an axle and the welds are all super strong,you have no way to take the diff apart to change the axle.
If you were on a closed circuit it would be dangerous,,,

find someone that has a spool equipped car and ask if you can drive it
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
  #6 (permalink)  
Old 02-23-2013, 08:10 PM
bigdog7373's Avatar
Of course it's fast
 
Last photo:
Join Date: May 2010
Location: florida
Posts: 2,673
Wiki Edits: 0

Thanks: 13
Thanked 48 Times in 48 Posts
Quote:
Originally Posted by vinniekq2 View Post
The reason I asked about traction bars:
preload right side and leave 1 inch gap on left side.or maybe 1 1/4,both tires will drive the car sometimes.all has to do with the correct tune for weight transfer and torque applied to your f body

welded gears will put you all over the road even in the dry,around all corners,this is why 327 says its unsafe,because its not very safe

the welds usually break leaving the diff full of junk thats hard to take apart for rrepairs.
If you break an axle and the welds are all super strong,you have no way to take the diff apart to change the axle.
If you were on a closed circuit it would be dangerous,,,

find someone that has a spool equipped car and ask if you can drive it
My friend has a 240 thats welded. It was a little strange to drive but i didn't think it was nearly as bad as everyone makes it out to be. That's just my opinion though, plus it's a much lighter car so that might mean something.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
  #7 (permalink)  
Old 02-23-2013, 08:36 PM
vinniekq2's Avatar
Registered User
 
Join Date: Jun 2012
Location: BC,Canada
Age: 56
Posts: 6,746
Wiki Edits: 0

Thanks: 236
Thanked 619 Times in 602 Posts
If that works for you,,,seriously? look into buying a mini spool
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
  #8 (permalink)  
Old 02-23-2013, 08:41 PM
LATECH's Avatar
Hotrodders.com Moderator
 

Last journal entry: Motor - vator
Last photo:
Join Date: Jul 2010
Location: Northeast Pennsylvania
Posts: 5,070
Wiki Edits: 0

Thanks: 190
Thanked 240 Times in 223 Posts
Go to www.randysringandpinion.com and get an eaton LSD.
Fun AND Safe.
__________________
Fact is stranger than Fiction
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
  #9 (permalink)  
Old 02-23-2013, 09:07 PM
bigdog7373's Avatar
Of course it's fast
 
Last photo:
Join Date: May 2010
Location: florida
Posts: 2,673
Wiki Edits: 0

Thanks: 13
Thanked 48 Times in 48 Posts
Quote:
Originally Posted by LATECH View Post
Go to www.randysringandpinion.com and get an eaton LSD.
Fun AND Safe.
I don't have the money for one right now. Like i said I'm putting stuff together and I'm going to sort it out in a few months when i have the funds to gather parts. It's a slow moving project. I was just looking to get sideways a little and have some fun with the car. That's what i bought it for.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
  #10 (permalink)  
Old 02-23-2013, 10:45 PM
BOBCRMAN@aol.com's Avatar
Member
 
Last photo:
Join Date: May 2002
Location: Holly, michigan
Posts: 7,954
Wiki Edits: 0

Thanks: 13
Thanked 218 Times in 207 Posts
Quote:
Originally Posted by 327NUT View Post
If this is going to be used on the street DON'T weld the spiders. Not going to go into the why....there's plenty of info by doing a search......not safe.
Correct. that little trick cost me many thousands of dollars back in the early eighties.
Your insurance won't cover you in an accident. "Knowingly operating a defective vehicle" Been there!
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
  #11 (permalink)  
Old 02-24-2013, 09:38 AM
Registered User
 
Last photo:
Join Date: Oct 2011
Location: Indiana
Age: 63
Posts: 98
Wiki Edits: 0

Thanks: 2
Thanked 1 Time in 1 Post
Bigdog7373. You have above the advice from some of the best minds on the Hotrodders web site. That being said, I have a 27 T roadster, 450 HP, 2280# with driver, with a Frankland quickchange rear end in it out of my old Late Model stock car. It still has the spool in it. Everybody told me it wouldn't work on the street, but I didn't want to spend the money to replace the spool with a diff until I tried it. Now, obviously I don't drive it in the rain, it being a roadster, but I have never had a problem with it, except the rear tires chirp a little in a very tight low speed turn. I have even had it on the dragstrip. It launches straight as an arrow. I am leaving the spool in it. I never had a welded diff, but I have welded up a lot of them for the circle track street stock guys. Never had one break. I am not advising you to weld it up, but I don't see a problem with it as a temporary measure.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
  #12 (permalink)  
Old 02-24-2013, 10:04 AM
S10xGN's Avatar
Gotta love a turbo!
 

Last journal entry: Body on Frame today.
Last photo:
Join Date: Aug 2004
Location: Port Neches, TX
Age: 60
Posts: 1,561
Wiki Edits: 0

Thanks: 0
Thanked 49 Times in 47 Posts
Let me add this to the above. The car in question ('78 Firebird) has C-clip axles. What do you suppose will happen when one of those axles breaks? And that will eventually happen with a welded diff, horsepower or not. Also, if both tires are not exactly the same diameter, those axles will always be in a torsional bind even when going straight down the road.

Russ
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
  #13 (permalink)  
Old 02-24-2013, 10:24 AM
bigdog7373's Avatar
Of course it's fast
 
Last photo:
Join Date: May 2010
Location: florida
Posts: 2,673
Wiki Edits: 0

Thanks: 13
Thanked 48 Times in 48 Posts
Quote:
Originally Posted by S10xGN View Post
Let me add this to the above. The car in question ('78 Firebird) has C-clip axles. What do you suppose will happen when one of those axles breaks? And that will eventually happen with a welded diff, horsepower or not. Also, if both tires are not exactly the same diameter, those axles will always be in a torsional bind even when going straight down the road.

Russ
They'll become the same diameter quite quickly then.
I don't get why people say it's so horrible and deadly but then if you talk to the drift guys who daily drive with welders and they say its fine.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
  #14 (permalink)  
Old 02-24-2013, 10:46 AM
vinniekq2's Avatar
Registered User
 
Join Date: Jun 2012
Location: BC,Canada
Age: 56
Posts: 6,746
Wiki Edits: 0

Thanks: 236
Thanked 619 Times in 602 Posts
One thing to consider,small thing,is the suspension tuning is very stiff in a drift car.They are set up to break traction.Before you start drifting you need to tune front and rear suspension.You might need to change steering geometry.You may also need to make your car turn sharper.Most drift cars also have premium tires.Its not a cheap sport.
As far as welding the diff as apposed to a mini spool,which one makes more sense? If I hate the mini spoon,I can take it out.You only gamble $100.บบ and you can resell it.
Ive used positracs with over stuffed clutch packs,(never used a spool) and the car was drive able. When I drag raced my 67 Camaro,I took the positrac rat trap out.All for different reasons.
Post a video of your first drift and another one when you are good at it.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
  #15 (permalink)  
Old 02-24-2013, 11:00 AM
Valkyrie5.7's Avatar
www.generationhighoutput. com
 
Last wiki edit: Painting chrome wheels
Last journal entry: Stopping my journal entries here
Last photo:
Join Date: Feb 2010
Location: Phoenix
Age: 27
Posts: 893
Wiki Edits: 15

Thanks: 147
Thanked 69 Times in 60 Posts
I will never understand someone coming on here for advice and then disagreeing with people when it's not the answer that they wanted. If you weld that diff, you're putting your life as well as anyone else on the streets at risk if it goes south.

You've already made it clear that you want to perform this to test out it's "drifting capabilities" which to me amounts to you wanting to jerk around on the street with all those guys in the little hatchback Nissans. If you're going to be exclusively driving the vehicle at events, then by all means, weld it and don't drive it on the street until you have a LSD.

If the tires catch traction while your swinging around sideways like a maniac in a parking lot like I've seen those rice grinders do, then you're not going to be able to stop whatever happens next. It's a bad idea, don't do it.

Dude, sometimes we just don't have in the budget to do the things we want to do. Try to follow this quote when it comes to that kind of stuff:

"Patience is bitter, but its fruit is sweet."
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message

Recent Hotrodding Basics posts with photos

Quick Reply
Message:
Options

Register Now

In order to be able to post messages on the Hot Rod Forum : Hotrodders Bulletin Board forums, you must first register.
Please enter your desired user name (usually not your first and last name), your email address and other required details in the form below.
User Name:
If you do not want to register, fill this field only and the name will be used as user name for your post.
Password
Please enter a password for your user account. Note that passwords are case-sensitive.
Password:
Confirm Password:
Email Address
Please enter a valid email address for yourself.
Email Address:

Log-in

Human Verification

In order to verify that you are a human and not a spam bot, please enter the answer into the following box below based on the instructions contained in the graphic.




Currently Active Users Viewing This Thread: 1 (0 members and 1 guests)
 
Thread Tools

Posting Rules
You may post new threads
You may post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are On
Pingbacks are On
Refbacks are On


Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
welding on a G.M. diff. housing. jcarter Suspension - Brakes - Steering 13 12-12-2009 08:05 PM
Butt welding vs Spot welding 69ChevelleAddict Body - Exterior 19 05-04-2008 01:47 AM
How much will the diff take? "70" Cougar Transmission - Rearend 2 01-11-2008 08:13 PM
Diff ID \help Stroker56 Transmission - Rearend 3 02-22-2006 01:54 AM
7.5 GM diff madhat Transmission - Rearend 1 06-17-2003 07:17 PM


All times are GMT -6. The time now is 08:17 AM.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.7
Copyright ©2000 - 2014, vBulletin Solutions, Inc.
Search Engine Optimization by vBSEO 3.6.0 PL2
Copyright Hotrodders.com 1999 - 2012. All Rights Reserved.