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Old 08-11-2008, 07:51 PM
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welding technique

A little help guy's if you would. I'm practicing laying a bead on two pieces of 18 gague soft steel and using a 100 wire feed with gas but I keep burning a holes thru the bead. I have tried different settings of wire feed speed on the lowest power setting but I still keep burning thru. On top of that where it doesn't burn thru I'm not getting the penitration thru the bottom of the weld. Is this just a practice problem or is there something Im doing wrong? I am gaping the material about the width of the wireand have sped up and slowed my movements to see if that might be the problem but keep getting the same results. thanks Pops,.

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Old 08-12-2008, 02:52 AM
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You may need to pause and let the weld puddle and surrounding metal cool for a few seconds every 1/4 to 1/2 inch or so.. you cant always run a continuous bead on thin stock.

Dunc.
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Old 08-12-2008, 08:18 AM
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What kind of joint? Thin metal can be tough, try moving a bit faster and watch the edges since they will start to burn through faster. Also, tighten up that gap. As the person above me said, a continous bead might not work, which is okay because you do not want to warp it either.
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Old 08-12-2008, 08:30 AM
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On stuff that thin I stitch weld it. A bunch of spots. Or if you get good, 3/8 to 1/2" long beads. No gap. If you are using a Lincoln SP100, try the "C" heat setting with about 5 or 6 wire speed with .023" wire. You can also use a backer plate, a piece of brass, copper or aluminum works well, it also will act as a heat sink and help a little with warpage. None of those materials will stick to the steel. When using aluminum, a little aluminum will get picked up, but I've never seen it mess up a weld. With a backer plate you can use a higher heat setting than if you are doing the weld without a backer.


Hope this helps, Mikey
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Old 08-12-2008, 07:04 PM
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tack welds

Ok, I tried the tack welds and its working alot better. Now I need to figure how to cut these welds down a little. can you guy's tell me what is the best wire to use for this process? Is there a softer wire I should be using for mild steel? One that is easier to gring down and doesn't bead up so high or is this in the technique ? I have the lincoln wire feed 100 with ER70s-6 .025 wire. with gas bottle. sure is hard to grind. Dang it I knew I should have taken that welding class this year. Oh ya one more thing I'm still not real sure of the penetration it seems to be spotty on the back side of the welds. Do I need to leave it in the puddle a little longer ? I'm trying to do each tack the same but some go thru and some don't tks for the help Pops.
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Old 08-12-2008, 07:26 PM
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tack welds

I was just using a test piece of 16 gauge sheet and cutting it in about three inches and welding it back up. In welding it I would get a high-tack bead which is hard to grind down. Once it was ground down it looked really good on top but doesn't seem to go thru all the way. Is it not necessary to have a gap when butt welding thin sheet metal? Pops.
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Old 08-12-2008, 07:31 PM
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now that you are tacking the weld , you can turn the heat up a bit . that will have too effects 1 it will flatten the bead and 2 it will then burn in just a bit better.
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Old 08-12-2008, 11:25 PM
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Try angling the torch head closer to vertical, 10-15 degrees is about right. High weld beads can be caused by laying the head beyond 30 degrees from vertical.

Hard welds can be caused by welding high carbon steel, if the plate your welding is 1045 or better than this could be your problem. Also welding on top of a piece of material thats less conductive to heat can help to keep the weld red hot longer after the bead is layed which can keep it annealed. I have used a small piece of hard asbestos board to weld thin plate on.

You can also try shortening your stitches to half inch or less, keep the weld area at or below red heat and then move to the next stitch. Keep the heat input low and move often to get best results.
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Old 08-13-2008, 08:16 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by william r plise
.... Is there a softer wire I should be using for mild steel? One that is easier to gring down and doesn't bead up so high or is this in the technique ? I have the lincoln wire feed 100 with ER70s-6 .025 wire. with gas bottle. sure is hard to grind. ....Pops.

Here is link to the Esab website, they have a wire called "Easy grind", made specifically for bodywork applications.

http://products.esabna.com/EN/home/f...ategory_id.504

Here is a thread that might be of interest to you..

It mentions some technique, also there is some discussion about another wire type made by Harris, (I think), called "Twenty gauge", that is a cored wire that welds sheet metal flatter and produces softer welds in thin sheet.


Some folks like it some don't..Check it out.

Need Sheet Metal Welding Help


Later, mikey
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Old 08-13-2008, 11:41 AM
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welding practices

Quote:
Originally Posted by william r plise
A little help guy's if you would. I'm practicing laying a bead on two pieces of 18 gague soft steel and using a 100 wire feed with gas but I keep burning a holes thru the bead. I have tried different settings of wire feed speed on the lowest power setting but I still keep burning thru. On top of that where it doesn't burn thru I'm not getting the penitration thru the bottom of the weld. Is this just a practice problem or is there something Im doing wrong? I am gaping the material about the width of the wireand have sped up and slowed my movements to see if that might be the problem but keep getting the same results. thanks Pops,.
I've gone thru the same problems you are experiencing as I have learned to MIG weld over these past 8 years. Here are some suggestions that you may want to try:

1. Are you pulling or pushing when welding ? I have noticed that when I pull a weld, I have less chance of burning through

2. You may want to check your house voltage - I had a similar problem w/an old 110V welder & could not get the controls lower enough to weld 20 gage. My house hold current seemed to run 120 to 130 V most of the time. When I upgraded to a new 230V machine, I can now dial down way below the settings needed for welding 20 gage material & the problem went away.

3. I am a fan of the 20 gage wire that Harris use to make. I don't think you can get it anymore (jump over to the exterior-body site & look @ threads there). This wire was an 0.030 size, but had a core of some sort of flux material that allowed you to run lower wire speeds - as one guy told me its like running an 0.023 wire. But I think it is even better than that. I have been able to weld up 1/8 inch holes w/o backing plates w/this wire.

4. Try copper back up strips. Weld does not stick to copper, & you should be able to run correct settings to achieve proper penetration w/o blowing holes.

5. Relax - I did the same thing early on, & somewhat dreaded welding. Now I really enjoy it Try to get in a very comfortable position when welding. You'll find your welding will improve

6. Try butt welding or eliminate the gap between the 2 plates. I have never had much luck @ welding when any gap is present, unless I pulled the weld .

I hope this helps!

Mike.
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Old 08-13-2008, 12:31 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by powerrodsmike
there is some discussion about another wire type made by Harris, (I think), called "Twenty gauge", that is a cored wire that welds sheet metal flatter and produces softer welds in thin sheet.


Don't bother, it's history now.

Those idiots in marketing have let the best thing to ever happen to thin sheetmetal welding slip away, it is out of production now. They cited poor sales as the reason but they did little to promote the Twenty Gauge and even that name caused more than a little confusion. I have been welding thin sheetmetal for so close to 40 years now it scares me and nothing I have used come close to doing what the Twenty Gauge would do but I guess none of that matters now, dang it!
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