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Old 02-15-2013, 10:04 AM
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whats your favirote polish

what is your favirote polish for after the cutting stage?

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Old 02-15-2013, 12:25 PM
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I've been using 3M's perfect it polishing kit for years and have tried about everything out there and have the best results with this kit. About 3 years ago I purchased a new kit, it came with 3 foam pads (that's all I ever use, I find that a wool pad can generate to much heat), 3 bottles of polish, coarse medium and fine, several micro fiber, a spray bottle of swirl remover (not to big a fan of swirl remover, I like to get them out in the fine polish by adding a bit more water to the foam pad) cloths, detail spray and what I like best an adapter that allows you to use booth sides of the foam pad. The polish is also color coordinated to the color of the pad...so you never screw up by using fine polish on a coarse pad.

The kit sells for just over $200 but it's worth it...I can get about 4 or 5 complete cut and buff jobs out of 1 kit...of coarse it depends on how large the vehicles are and the darker the color the more polishing it takes to get rid of swirl marks.

This works for me and I would highly recommend it to anybody doing any amount of cutting and buffing.

Ray
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Old 02-15-2013, 12:57 PM
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It is a lot like women, red heads or blonds?

I have use Meguires for years and find nothing better. Click here The Power cleaner compound is by far the best in my opinion (I know, stupid name). click here

Mequiars is like Evercoat to me, I have always been happy with them and if they made TV's I'd buy one.

We use the 3M system here at work day in and day out (I am not in detail so I am not using it) so it is a fine product as well, you can't go wrong either way.

Ray, have you ever tried the Power cleaning compound? You can not believe how little you use, no compound shower using this stuff. And the "Unigrit" wet paper Mequiars distributes, holy crap that stuff blows away everything I have ever used (I am old school no DA for me).

Brian
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Old 02-15-2013, 01:19 PM
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LOL...I'm old school as well...the last time I used a DA was about 2 1/2 years ago, my wife wanted me to change the color on her Caddi. She decided on a Wednesday on the color and told me that that color would match her shoes and purse...but she wanted to wear her new shoes and purse on Saturday and I should hurry and get her car painted or it would ruin her Saturday (Women, you can't live with em and....pass me the beer nuts). I laughed a bit on the outside and was a lot more POed on the inside. For the first time in a few years, I dusted off my DA and started sanding.....16 hours later, her car did match her shoes and purse and her Saturday wasn't ruined. I was lucky that the car was straight to begin with but like I said...I'm old school and the work I do for my customers doesn't see a DA.

I haven't tried Meguire's Power Cleaner but, the "no compound shower" does sound intriguing. I don't mind getting the spatter all over myself but it can be a beach to get off if you don't get at every nook and cranny right away. I'll give it a try. I've tried the "Unigrit" paper and still prefer my 3M. I'm not always happy with 3M's prices but, for consistency in product and quality, I don't mind paying a bit more for most of their items, for example. I feel that their panel bond adhesive is second to none. I've tried others and not nearly as reliable for dry times and advertised strength.

Ray
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Old 02-15-2013, 01:23 PM
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3M in 3 steps , then Meguires swirl remover, Then 3M machine glaze and then I hand glaze I use no wax! I found the Finnish outstanding! I've tried them all and this process works for me! But everyone has their own process and what works and you like is not the same for everyone! We all have opinions, a professional goes through more steps then a guy in his back yard garage and they usually look for a quick product that is mediocre in comparison with a professionals many step process.

Jester.

Quote 69 "I'm old school and the work I do for my customers doesn't see a DA."

Man I thought I was the last old skool guy!!! LOL

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Old 02-15-2013, 01:46 PM
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3M in 3 steps , then Meguires swirl remover, Then 3M machine glaze and then I hand glaze I use no wax! I found the Finnish outstanding! I've tried them all and this process works for me! But everyone has their own process and what works and you like is not the same for everyone! We all have opinions, a professional goes through more steps then a guy in his back yard garage and they usually look for a quick product that is mediocre in comparison with a professionals many step process.

Jester.

Quote 69 "I'm old school and the work I do for my customers doesn't see a DA."

Man I thought I was the last old skool guy!!! LOL
Nope Jester, there are a few of us left and I hope the new guys coming into the trade pick up the habit that feel is a good one...to hard to keep things straight no matter how good you think you are of how long you've been doing it. I put my DA in the bottom of the tool box along with my air file and my silicone wax in the early 90's when I got off flat rate and did more of my own work.

I don't wax anything either...I feel that it can suffocate the clear and cause it dull out over time....if you put enough clear on and take care of your finish, you can polish it for years and it always keeps coming up glossy.

Ray
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Old 02-15-2013, 02:22 PM
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I use the Mequires paste wax but not until after at least 90 days. But right after the power compound, Mirror glaze #7, on yeah, there is nothing like Mirror glaze for the best finish in my opinion.

Getting back to the air tools, I do use a "DA" an old DAQ ND for metal finishing (using no filler). And an nice "Orbital" Dynabrade like you would for cutting clear to buff, but I don't use it for that. It actually isn't as tight a revolution as they have now but when I bought it, it was THE thing. I still use it for a number of uses. On the "in line" air sander, damn if I haven't owned one since I was about 17! No kidding, I traded off my air board for an air chisel that I still have today. I lived without one for darn near 20 years until I used a Hutchens 3800 and had to own one. For large panels it is a nice tool to get you close enough to block by hand. It's an orbital sander, not an inline.



Brian
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Old 02-15-2013, 05:48 PM
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Have to agree with you Ray on this one I also use the 3M kit and find that it works very well, have been using the 05973 compound for years and just recently switched to the "new" kit with the 06085 compound that I think really does outperform the old 05973. The only difference is I do like the wool pad better than the foam personally. And yes do all my sanding by hand, wet or dry. No D/A just too scuff bare steel with 80 grit, thats about it. Nothing like hand sanding for the ultimate finish , whether blocking or cutting and buffing.
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Old 02-15-2013, 06:12 PM
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Have to agree with you Ray on this one I also use the 3M kit and find that it works very well, have been using the 05973 compound for years and just recently switched to the "new" kit with the 06085 compound that I think really does outperform the old 05973. The only difference is I do like the wool pad better than the foam personally. And yes do all my sanding by hand, wet or dry. No D/A just too scuff bare steel with 80 grit, thats about it. Nothing like hand sanding for the ultimate finish , whether blocking or cutting and buffing.
Glad to hear that another guy only uses the DA for roughing up metal...it sure shows in your work my friend. I've seen some guys do respectable work going from DA to paint but for that true arrow straight body, hand blocking can't be beat.

I still find wool pads a bit to aggressive on edges and that's why I stick to foam pads but, I know a lot of guys swear by wool. I find them a little harder to keep clean as well, especially with the coarse compounds. I have used wool pads and had good results...I just caught one to many sharp body lines and burnt through. The last one that it happened to me on was a 1970 Monte Carlo. The front fenders have a bit of a dish from the hood to the top of the fender, a sharp body line and then down....I was concerned when I started and all it took was one pass with the polisher that was to close to the body line and it had to be repainted. Wool will cut faster no doubt and if that works for people that's all that matters.

Yes Brian...I do have an air board exactly like the one that's in your picture and it got a fair bit of use when I was on flat rate...much faster than dragging a long board across a caved in box side. I did recently use it for a early 1923 Ford Model T Hack/Train Station Cab I'm finishing though...it worked great on the Oak for the roof and the side panels...LOL. Seriously, it worked fantastic for that...the 4 fenders, running boards, cowl and hood where all hand blocked and that's all that there really was for body on that old wagon.

Ray
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Old 02-15-2013, 09:49 PM
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Originally Posted by MARTINSR View Post
I use the Mequires paste wax but not until after at least 90 days. But right after the power compound, Mirror glaze #7, on yeah, there is nothing like Mirror glaze for the best finish in my opinion.

Getting back to the air tools, I do use a "DA" an old DAQ ND for metal finishing (using no filler). And an nice "Orbital" Dynabrade like you would for cutting clear to buff, but I don't use it for that. It actually isn't as tight a revolution as they have now but when I bought it, it was THE thing. I still use it for a number of uses. On the "in line" air sander, damn if I haven't owned one since I was about 17! No kidding, I traded off my air board for an air chisel that I still have today. I lived without one for darn near 20 years until I used a Hutchens 3800 and had to own one. For large panels it is a nice tool to get you close enough to block by hand. It's an orbital sander, not an inline.



Brian
I've been wanting to try one of those orbital block type sanders. I have to say inline sanders with a regulator are time savers though. You can do door bottoms and rockers, and some rear quarters in no time. I hear so many people(not you) assume in line sanders are hack, but they're really not. I'll do anything that's quicker as long as it doesn't sacrifice results. As long as I know the panel will be show straight in two primer applications and blocks and feels straight as can be before primer, whatever tool is used to get there is no different than using an air ratchet to get a bolt off quicker.
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Old 02-15-2013, 10:05 PM
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I've been wanting to try one of those orbital block type sanders. I have to say inline sanders with a regulator are time savers though. You can do door bottoms and rockers, and some rear quarters in no time. I hear so many people(not you) assume in line sanders are hack, but they're really not. I'll do anything that's quicker as long as it doesn't sacrifice results. As long as I know the panel will be show straight in two primer applications and blocks and feels straight as can be before primer, whatever tool is used to get there is no different than using an air ratchet to get a bolt off quicker.
Well here we go highjacking the thread. But the simple fact is any air tool like an inline sander can be used to knock down your work until you are close then block the rest to perfection.
I have to tell you, I may just blow your mind with what I can do with an 8" orbital ND900. I can get large panels REAL close using that tool, my absolute favorite filler cutting tool.

Brian
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Old 02-15-2013, 10:16 PM
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hand sander over here too. I'll get it to 2000 and switch to trizac at work. At home I'm not buying those expensive pads and the off brands or fake trizac(cheaper knock offs) all have sucked in my opinion. tried the Rhino and wasn't even sure if it did anything.

Maquiers compound 3M polish, swirl remover, and glaze. Around show car time it's like afro sheen around here or car manicure.
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Old 02-16-2013, 05:54 AM
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I agree with booth of you, Henry and Brian...air tools in a time sensitive arena like flat rate or the boss on your butt asking if your done yet, will save lots of time. What I'm saying is that when time constraints aren't a concern and getting a car perfectly straight is the major objective, hand long boards and short blocks offer a precise alternative. This is not to say that you can't get a panel straight with air tools, you can...with the type of work I do now I don't do much work with respect to pulling large dents or laying filler over a complete box side...if it would come to that I would recommend the panel be replaced and a skim coat of whatever product be applied and hand blocked.

I waited many years to do the kind of work I enjoy and rarely do collision damage anymore (I still do the odd one for customers I've done restoration or custom work for in the past but nothing major). Brian...I have to admit, many years ago I saw an old man...back then I thought he was about 80 years old and I saw him doing the "old man shuffle" with an 8 inch sander in his hand...he attacked a Dodge Dart rear quarter (and we all know how flat those panels are)...All I saw was a cloud of filler dust and I swear to God, when he was done that rear quarter was as straight as an arrow. So, again, I have to agree that it can be done, I just prefer hand tools...that's my comfort zone.

And to the OP...sorry about the Hi-Jack...it might be interesting to start a thread about this topic.

Thanks guys.

Ray
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Old 02-16-2013, 08:42 AM
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my point is it's a misconception that in line files are hack. It also doesn't mean you're piling it on too thick either. Look at American Hotrod...those guys use them. Is that not show car work? I use them and our team got builder of the year for Autorama and 2nd place in Pomona. I just did a rocker in like 20 minutes a week ago. Not piling it on, just skimming . The last guy I heard knock them said it on video, then he has a video of him fixing shipping dings on a brand new hood and sprays it with SLICK SAND, yet the filler was still poking up after sanding the primer. That tells me a lot about how valuable his opinion is.

With that said, man, if I did work in a little cheap warehouse(which I hope to do at some point) there are A LOT of things I'd do differently, but different ways to sand aren't what would change. Most likely more extensive rust repairs instead of just what the customer pays for, but on the higher ends we do we fix everything. Just not on every job.

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Old 02-16-2013, 09:40 AM
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Henry I would not for one minute suggest that using air tools for sanding was hack work...it's not. For me, it's a matter of preference and the only difference is that you may use an air file to rough out your body work and I do it with my long board. Hack...not a chance nor would I suggest that it was. You do good work and I respect you for that.

One thing I will say though about air files versus long boards on large flat panels like a hood is the fact that you have less control of the weight of the air board versus a long hand held board. I have found in the past (and one of the main reasons I don't like using them any more) is because of the heavier weight and the speed at which it knocks down filler, it's much easier to over sand. A long board is slower but, I feel you have more control.

I hope you don't take offence to my opinion as none was intended. As I mentioned in "#13 permalink" about the elderly man that straightened out a Dodge Dart rear quarter panel with an 8 inch Hutchins Mud Hog"...I never got as good as that man with his air tool and really I don't feel that it's an art that I care to master. I'm only concerned about how straight my panels are using the tools that I feel I have somewhat mastered.

With all due respect.

Ray
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