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Old 08-12-2007, 10:36 PM
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Who thinks I can squeeze more out of this 305? :D

Ok well I'm back to work on my 305 project. Some of you may remember that I started this project a few months ago after discovering that the 350 currently in my 84' C10 has a wiped lobe, and was basically running on 7 cylinders. Just for the record, that poor thing's still running. It just won't die.

Anyhow, now I'm working on an extremely low budget 305 build, maybe $600, not counting machine work. Fortunately I've been given a few parts to use. Here's what I've put together, along with projected power from Engine Analyzer Pro.

305 bored to 3.776"
$140

Federal Mogul Cast Pistons
$110

Port/Polished 882 Heads (8.63:1 Comp. )
$0

800 CFM QJet
$0

Stock Intake
$0

Summit Performance Headers
$90

Summit 1103 Cam
214/224
$53

1.5/1.6 Rocker Set
$52


After all of that, other parts like gaskets, bearings, ect, I'm just pushing my budget. I'm very happy with the output, over 1HP per cubic inch, but I'm trying to squeeze every last bit out of it. Any ideas would be most appreciated. I've already dialed in the spark curve, and tried different combos of carbs, but I can't seem to get much more than 340HP/332TQ.
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Old 08-12-2007, 11:05 PM
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get rid if the 882 heads. get some #416 or #601 305 heads. Home port them and add 1.94" intake valves. Other wise you won;t have any compression or power. Your 305 with 882 heads will be a dud.
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Old 08-13-2007, 01:18 AM
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As recommended, get rid of the 882 heads, if you use them it`ll have about 5:1 compression and won`t spin on ice. Next, all the cast pistons I`ve looked up by federal mogul are "destroked" pistons, meaning the compression height is 1.540, the correct height is 1.560 from the factory. These destroked pistons kill compression, quench and power. You have to add in, from the factory, the piston is down in the hole about .025, give or take a few thousanths, with the destroked pistons it`s .045 in the hole, when you account in the overbore, which makes it worse cause the piston is bigger therefore the space is bigger because it`s further down in the bore, account in the head gasket thickness of .041, plus the camshaft, with 305 heads the compression will be about 7:1 and it`ll still be a dead player. 305 heads have a 58cc chamber cause the bore is small, the 882 heads have a 76cc chamber and was used on a 350 and 400`s with a much bigger bore size, the more space is added, the less the compression ratio. If you get the correct pistons, 305 heads, with that cam, on it`s best day it might make 200 horsepower.
In the case point of Destroked pistons, what you don`t know will hurt you. but the piston company don`t want you to know that. If it were me, I would take the new cam, stab it in the 350 with new lifters, break it in with diesel oil and go on my way. I wouldn`t waste my time on a 305.

Last edited by DoubleVision; 08-13-2007 at 01:25 AM.
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Old 08-13-2007, 02:03 AM
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.000 deck the block

With your new pistons and rods, go to your machinist and ask him to "zero deck the block". Ask your machinist to surface the block deck to .000 deck/piston difference or in other words, the pistons are the same hight as the block deck. With .019 compressed thickness head gaskets (not thin shim or steel gaskets), you should be able to get real close to 10:1 CR with the correct heads should bump your HP numbers up a bit. Normally, a small block chevy can have as much as .045 deck hight above the pistons, your pistons are short. The average small block (350) has a block deck hight of 9.030 crank centerline to deck. Your machinist will check wrist pin centerline to top of piston plus rod length minus crank stroke. Then he/she will check the block crank centerline to deck surface and then with the numbers obtained,will determin exactly how much he/she can safely shave off the block deck. Lots of deck hight above the pistons easily eats up a point or two of your compression ratio. Be careful not to over cam the little 305 because the 882 castings are for 350 motors and have 76cc combustion chambers and no matter what you do, you will not see more than about 7:1 or 8:1 CR. A problem with putting 350 heads on a 305, asside from the chamber size is valve shrouding near cylinder walls in a 305 block. Standard 305 heads have I believe 58cc. chambers but they do not flow well and valve lift over .470 will just rob you of the HP that you want. Good luck with it!!!!

Last edited by mr27t; 08-13-2007 at 02:14 AM.
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Old 08-13-2007, 05:06 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by DoubleVision
If it were me, I would take the new cam, stab it in the 350 with new lifters, break it in with diesel oil and go on my way. I wouldn`t waste my time on a 305.

I second that, save your money for another 350 or a 383 if you need a new engine later on.

Don't get me wrong I like 305's , they are fantastic daily driver motors in a light car and can give strong performance and mileage but I wouldn't use one as a core for a performance build for a heavy vehicle. If I had a '78 Malibu or something and just wanted a little zip with good fuel economy I'd be all over a 305 with a 200-4R and some 3.42 gears but not for a full size pickup.
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Old 08-13-2007, 01:30 PM
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Alright thanks everyone. I decided to use the 305 because I already had the block and because my C10 is my daily driver. Luckily we just bought an old Ford so I guess I'll yank that 350 out and get to work on it. I'll save that 305 and put in in the ole' Buick. heh

I knew those 882's were turds, but they're free so I couldn't resist giving it a thought. I can probably dig up some 416 or 601's at the junkyard for a couple bucks.

Oh and DoubleVision, good call on those Moguls. They were, indeed, destroked.

I just hope that the 350 isn't too chewed up from the wiped cam lobe. I know the metal filings must be all over in that poor thing, but I've yet to lose a bearing. I guess I'll see soon enough.

Thanks again everyone.
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Old 08-13-2007, 01:39 PM
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The 350 should be good as long....

as you get it cleand up good. If it's the HP that your after so a 350 is a better choice, a 383 even better. Keep the rods and crank from the 305, there the same ones that are used in 350's, same stroke and all!
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Old 08-13-2007, 02:06 PM
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Are those actual dyno results? If so then that's REALLY good, especially with 8.6:1, those heads and that small cam.

I thought you were going to build a 334 at one time?
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Old 08-13-2007, 03:01 PM
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Nah, those results are just theoretical from Engine Analyze Pro. I wish they were real though.

And ya I was going to do a 334 build with that same block but I couldn't fit the 3.75" crank, block machining, and everything else within my budget. I may still do that if I catch a break though.
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Old 08-14-2007, 09:37 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by DoubleVision
............ it`ll have about 5:1 compression and won`t spin on ice. ..........
Well said.

tom
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Old 08-14-2007, 01:38 PM
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Use these pistons They have the right compression height spec.
H534CP40

Part Type: Pistons
Bore (in): 3.776 in.
Bore (mm): 95.910mm
Piston Style: Flat top, with four valve reliefs
Piston Material: Hypereutectic aluminum
Compression Distance (in): 1.560 in.
Piston Head Volume (cc): +5.00cc
Wrist Pin Style: Press fit
Pin Diameter (in): 0.927 in.
Piston Ring Thickness: 5/64 in. x 5/64 in. x 3/16 in.
Quantity: Sold individually.
Notes: Low-friction coated skirt.

Piston, Hypereutectic, Flat Top, 3.766 in. Bore, 5/64 in., 5/64 in., 3/16 in. Ring Grooves, Chevy, 305, Each $18 @ summit

Use a upgraded 416 head with Home porting and 1.94" valves Do the porting and rocker stud pinning yourself, then get the machinist to finish with 1.94" valves.
use a thin head gasket. Its ok to use the 350 steel shim gasket on a 305.
On a stock hight block you'll have a finished cr of between 9.6 (61cc) and 10:1 (58cc) depending on the finished cylinder head volume.

It is very easy to over cam a 305. Unless you'll be using a high rear gear ratio and and a high stall. keep the duration 210 or less.. The generic summit 204-214 112-.420-.442 cam works very well. 1.6 rockers will boost the intake lift to equal the ex lift and help the ported heads make power.

Here is my pick for a custom cam for your 305 with (long tube) headers, some gear and a stall(11") and a home ported 416 head like I would do.
comp cams CS 260AH-8 #12-310-4 advance to a 104 intake C/L
(Summit stocks this cam)
You can tell 'em its a "350" .

Last edited by F-BIRD'88; 08-14-2007 at 01:53 PM.
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Old 08-15-2007, 05:34 PM
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i've seen several 882 headed 350's run damn good.

before i did any porting, find some 993's or 441's & have them angle milled. the 993 & 441 will out flow the 416 & 601 heads easy.
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Old 08-15-2007, 05:50 PM
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Ok well the guy who gave me this block also has a set of 0.040" over 305 pistons with 5cc valve reliefs, free. They're the right compression height btw, I compared them to the ones that came out of this block, so I'm good to go on those. Gotta love free stuff.

The same guy also has set of heads that he rebuilt for a customer to use on a modified-stock car but he decided not to use them, so I can probably get them really cheap. I'm not sure what casts they are yet, I just know they've been ported and have extensive bowl work, along with 1.94" valves, new seats, plus screw in rocker studs with guide plates. I'll let ya'll know what the numbers are as soon as I know.
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Old 08-15-2007, 07:07 PM
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Since you already have the 350 why not use what 305 parts you can esp crank and rods if the metal scarred the 350 stuff up? headers will work too
Shane
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Old 08-15-2007, 07:32 PM
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I would if I could, but I can't take the 350 out of my truck, it's my only vehicle that runs and doesn't have to be started by popping the clutch. That gets a little hard to do around town, ya know? heh
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