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  #16 (permalink)  
Old 06-20-2012, 10:58 AM
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This build is off the internet from (Hot rod Magazine) As you can see they bought everything including the block If you start subtracting parts you already have and your own labor it cuts the cost dramatically, if you find a 283 or 327 small journal crank its already forged steal not cast as most large journal 327s were cast if you use the 350 you need inserts to install the 283 crank! I have never used this particular build but it gives you the proximity of an upper end price, you can install cast 64 cc # 461 or comparable heads and save a thousand dollars and still produce good power! Read my post on this thread about old reliable running stock heads no porting allowed And stock rockers , 460 hp at 7700 rpm with a single 4 barrel ( no tunnel ram) You can see this Hot Rods build is a little milder and to me the tunnel ram was wasted because a tunnel should have produced much more power!! When you run a 302 or any de stroked engine with a stick shift run the heaviest fly wheel and damper you can find! The reciprocating weight of the flywheel and damper at launches will keep torque up and keeping engine rpm up! Absolutely do not run a cheep damper they will grenade!!! Or cheep bolts to install fly wheel and pressure plate they will shear real quick!

Chris


The end is nigh ... for HOT ROD's Win Your Dream Engine Contest. It all began back in June '03. Sponsored by Edelbrock, Comp Cams, Performance Distributors, Speed-Pro, Milodon, and ARP, the idea was that readers would design an engine using any parts they wanted from the sponsors' catalogs. We've already covered the Ford (Dec. '04), the Pontiac (Jan. '05), and the Mopar (Oct. '05). At long, long last, it's time for Steve Hammonds' Chevrolet.

Out of 6,039 entrees, Steve caught our attention with a strictly old-school plan to duplicate his high-school sweetheart (his other sweetheart, he married the primary one): A high-revvin,' manual-trans, drop-the-clutch-at-6,000-rpm, bang-the-gears, small-journal 302-based engine, built using an early 327 4-inch-bore block and 283 3-inch-stroke crank. At 0.030-over, that yields 306 ci. As Steve puts it, "This was the basic engine in my '57 Chevy I had in 1973. It was replaced with a mild 350 and automatic trans to use as my daily driver. With a mortgage, car payments, a wife, and two kids, I don't have enough money to cure my insatiable appetite for cars and speed."

So we took pity on him. Besides, what's not to love about a screamin' 302? And more besides, he still has the original '57 waiting at home for reanimation. Anyway, it'll be easy: a Chevy just falls together, right? Not exactly.

Who would have thought we couldn't find a block? Apparently small-journal '62-'67 327s that clean up at 0.030-over don't grow on trees. Two locally obtained cores turned out to be rust-buckets. Local SoCal core-exchanges struck out. Then we discovered a huge nationwide core bank, A&A Midwest Enginequest, and the company answered our prayers with an engine so pristine it nearly cleaned up standard. Be aware that A&A doesn't sell directly to the general public, but you can contact it for general availability and then arrange to purchase the parts through your local machine-shop.

Dougan's assembled the engine per Steve's specs, just the way he would have done a no-holds-barred engine circa 1973: a classic dual-carb tunnel-ram, Comp Magnum mechanical cam, domed Speed-Pro forged pistons, and Edelbrock Victor Jr. heads. Well, maybe not the heads. The camel-hump era had nothing remotely close to high-flowing Victor Jr. heads (eat your heart out, Penske). But they did have cheap, high-octane fuel, and Steve will miss those 29-cent/gallon prices: Those big-E heads and the domed slugs produce a no-compromise 11.75:1 compression ratio, requiring 100-octane Rockett unleaded gas with 41 degrees of ignition advance.

Having flown in all the way from Woodstock, Georgia, Steve was sweating as Westech Performance made increasingly higher rpm runs in an effort to find the engine's power peak-which was finally nailed at 6,800 rpm, where it topped out at 409 hp. Heck, even the torque didn't ring the bell until 5,100, where 354 lb-ft was recorded by the SuperFlow dyno. But don't sneer at retro tech: The engine made 1.34 hp/ci, the highest ratio of any of the Dream Engines. And that also blows away the 360hp Trans Am 302s of the late '60s. Steve, get out those 4.56s!

Engine Builder's Specs
All dimensions in linear inches, except as noted.

Short-Block
Displacement: 306.1 ci
Bore: 4.030
Stroke: 3.00
Block deck height: Milled to 9.021
Piston deck height: 0.016 (below deck)
Piston volume: 17.9cc dome
Head gasket compressed volume: 8.9cc
Compression ratio: 11.75:1
Rod length: 5.7
Piston compression height: 1.805
Piston-to-wall clearance: 0.004
Main-bearing clearance (Nos. 1-4): 0.0029-0.0035
Main-bearing clearance (No. 5): 0.0026-0.0030
Rod-bearing clearance: 0.0026-0.0030
Rod side-clearance: 0.013-0.019
Crankshaft thrust clearance: 0.004
Piston-ring endgap: 0.020/0.018/0.026
Pressed piston pin-to-rod: 0.0008 minimum
Piston-to-head clearance: 0.055

Cylinder Heads
Valve size: 2.08/1.60
Combustion chamber volume: 64 cc
Port volume: 215/85 cc
Flow at 0.500 lift: 265/207 cfm @ 28 in H20
Flow at 0.600 lift: 281/217 cfm @ 28 in H20
Valvespring od/id: 1.509/0.697
Valvespring seat pressure: 135 lb @ 1.850
Valvespring open pressure: 325 lb @ 1.345
Valvespring coil-bind height: 1.100
Spark plugs: Autolite Racing AR3933, gapped at 0.035

Critical Fasteners
ARP head bolts: 60 lb-ft (Teflon sealant on threads, ARP lube under washer)
ARP main and oil-pump studs: Bottom hand-tight, back off 11/44-turn (oil)
ARP main stud nuts: 70 lb-ft (ARP lube)
ARP oil-pump stud nut: 60 lb-ft (oil)
ARP rod-bolt nuts: 40 lb-ft (ARP lube)
Pioneer balancer bolt: 75 lb-ft (oil)
Comp rocker-arm studs: 35 lb-ft (red Loctite)
Grade-8 cam bolt: 25 lb-ft (red Loctite)
ARP intake bolts: 30 lb-ft (RTV silicone)

Balance
Piston weight: 451.0 grams
Piston-pin weight: 130.0 grams
Ring weight: 48.0 grams
Rod-bearing weight: 44.0 grams
Bobweight: 1,641 grams

Camshaft
Type: Mechanical flat-tappet
Grind: Comp Cams Magnum 294S
Duration, advertised: 294/294 degrees
Duration, 0.050 tappet lift: 250/250 degrees
Lobe displacement angle: 110 degrees
Installed intake centerline: 105 degrees
Lobe lift: 0.356/0.356
Rocker arm ratio: 1.52:1
Valve lift at zero lash: 0.541/0.541
Valve lift at running lash: 0.519/0.519
Valve lash: 0.022/0.022 hot
Camshaft base circle: 1.150/1.150
Pushrod length: 7.900/7.900
Piston-to-valve clearance: 0.145/0.300

DREAM CHEVY 306 PARTS LIST
DESCRIPTION PN SOURCE PRICE*
LONG-BLOCK
Core 327 small-journal bare block EN-C327BA A&A Midwest $350.00
Core 283 forged-steel crank N/A Castillo's $125.00
Core 2.00-inch journal rods (8 required) N/A Dougan's $80.00
Speed-Pro forged pistons with pins (8 required) L2210AF-30 Summit Racing $411.12
Speed-Pro file-fit piston rings R-9342-035 Summit Racing $96.95
Speed-Pro Competition Series rod bearings 8-7065CH-10 Summit Racing $62.69
Speed-Pro Competition Series main bearings 138M-10 Summit Racing $55.99
Speed-Pro Competition Series cam bearings 2100M Summit Racing $35.69
Pioneer 6.72-inch-od SFI harmonic damper 872022 Summit Racing $149.39
Edelbrock head with valves (2 required) 77579 Summit Racing $1,139.00

VALVETRAIN
Comp Cams 294S Magnum cam and lifter kit CL-12-222-4 Summit Racing $195.95
Comp Cams Pro Magnum 1.52:1 roller rockers 1301-16 Summit Racing $265.69
Comp Cams Magnum double-roller timing set 2100 Summit Racing $32.95
Comp Cams dual valvesprings 925-16 Summit Racing $122.39
Comp Cams valvespring retainers 741-16 Summit Racing $59.99
Comp Cams valve locks 611-16 Summit Racing $24.88
Comp Cams valvespring locators 4771-16 Summit Racing $39.88
Comp Cams 51/416x7.900 Magnum pushrods 7693-16 Summit Racing $105.95
Comp Cams flat guideplates for 51/416 pushrods 4808-8 Summit Racing $21.88
Comp Cams 31/48x71/416 High Energy rocker studs 4500-16 Summit Racing $26.99

INDUCTION & FUEL
Edelbrock Street Tunnel Ram intake, complete 7110 Summit Racing $259.95
Edelbrock Performer 500-cfm carb (2 required) 1404 Summit Racing $449.76
Edelbrock throttle linkage kit 7097 Summit Racing $26.95
Edelbrock calibration kit (2 required) 1486 Summit Racing $47.88

OILING
Milodon oil pan, LH dipstick 30900 Summit Racing $139.88
Milodon oil pickup 18314 Summit Racing $34.88
Speed-Pro high-volume oil pump 224-4143 Summit Racing $26.95
Speed-Pro heavy-duty pump shaft 224-6146E Summit Racing $10.99
Silver Seal dipstick and tube TW6505CP Dougan's $7.00
Used stock bypass valve N/A Wrecking yard $10.00
Mr. Gasket spin-on oil-filter adapter 1270 Summit Racing $9.75

GASKETS
Fel-Pro head gasket (2 required) 1010 Summit Racing $73.90
Fel-Pro intake set 1206 Summit Racing $14.88
Fel-Pro RACE set 2702 Summit Racing $18.95
Fel-Pro one-piece oil-pan gasket, LH dipstick 1880 Dougan's $36.00
Fel-Pro Cork-Lam valve-cover set 1604 Summit Racing $27.95

HARDWARE
ARP main studs, small-journal, no windage tray 134-5402 Summit Racing $39.75
ARP head bolts, with stainless steel outer row 134-3603 Summit Racing $96.99
ARP Wave-Loc 1132-inch rod bolts 134-6401 Summit Racing $59.88
ARP oil pump mounting stud 230-7004 Summit Racing $6.50
ARP timing-cover bolts 200-1501 Summit Racing $9.95
ARP intake bolts 134-2001 Summit Racing $12.88
ARP valve-cover studs 400-7603 Summit Racing $18.88
Pioneer harmonic-damper bolt 859012 Dougan's $6.00
Pioneer oil-pan bolts 854001 Dougan's $15.00
Moroso distributor holddown clamp 26200 Summit Racing $7.95
IGNITION
Performance Distributors distributor & coil 14720 Performance Dist. $295.00
Performance Distributors Live Wires C9053 Performance Dist. $95.00
DYNO CONSUMABLES
Fram Autolite racing spark plugs (8 required) AR3933 Summit Racing $37.52
Lucas 10W30 synthetic engine oil (7 quarts) 10050 Summit Racing $48.65
ACDelco oil filter PF1218 Rock Auto $4.83
ACCESSORIES
Edelbrock Elite tall aluminum valve covers 4249 Summit Racing $71.95
Pioneer freeze plugs PE100BR Summit Racing $10.99
OEM Paints Chevrolet Orange/Red engine paint OE62020 The Paddock $26.95
Pioneer fuel pump block-off 839033 Dougan's $6.00
Used stock timing cover N/A Dougan's (Free)
Silver Seal timing tab 6544R Dougan's $5.00

MACHINE WORK & OTHER LABOR
283 crank: magnetic-particle-inspect, grind
0.010/0.010, heat-treat N/A Castillo's $327.00
Clean and inspect parts, deburr block, install freeze plugs and cam bearings, machine block, fit pistons and pins, resize rods, balance assembly, surface heads, valve job, assemble engine.
N/A Dougan's $2,667.00
TOTAL $8,467.72
*All prices are as of press-time and are subject to change.

PROVEN POWER
RPM LB-FT HP RPM LB-FT HP
3,000 305 174 5,100 354 343
3,100 302 178 5,200 352 349
3,200 301 183 5,300 351 354
3,300 301 189 5,400 351 361
3,400 302 195 5,500 350 367
3,500 306 204 5,600 351 375
3,600 311 213 5,700 350 380
3,700 315 222 5,800 347 383
3,800 318 230 5,900 343 385
3,900 321 238 6,000 339 387
4,000 325 247 6,100 335 390
4,100 328 256 6,200 334 395
4,200 333 266 6,300 332 398
4,300 336 275 6,400 328 400
4,400 340 285 6,500 326 403
4,500 344 295 6,600 322 405
4,600 348 305 6,700 320 408
4,700 351 314 6,800 316 409
4,800 352 322 6,900 310 407
4,900 352 328 7,000 302 403
5,000 353 336 HRM

Read more: http://www.hotrod.com/techarticles/e...#ixzz1yLYr0PVC

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  #17 (permalink)  
Old 06-20-2012, 12:03 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by against all odds
Ok, but how much would it cost, approximately, to have an engine like the one in the nova?

The other thing is, i feel, a more conventional "low rpm" chugger would be more reliable.

i want to race frequently at different tracks and have no or little maintenance. i would rather concentrate on racing as opposed to frequently tinkering on the engine. Or course some people love constantly working on the engine.


I love working on high performance engines!!! drive trains ,suspension, custom paint and body!!! I hate working on daily drivers!


This is a hot rod site! even though its changing to an everything sight!!

There is no such thing as race with little maintenance Unless you chug down the track like you go to the grocery!! Even grocery getters when ragged on at the track need a lot of maintenance! You can still have a lot of fun with a low rpm engine but I thought this thread was about high rpm. I would never suggest any one build an engine like these for daily drivers I run one 302 9500 rpm red line in my 77 vet never dinoed . I just built a 302 for my wifes 79 camaro that engine dinod max 421 hp at 6800 rpm on a 10 hr dino break in with a single 4 barrel red lines at 8500 rpm and am now putting a tunnel ram on it with 2 600 holleys! the vette runs mid 11s my wifes will probably never see the track! but these cars only drive to shows or get togethe'rs and short rod runs!! the vet has to run 110 octane or higher ,idles at 2800 rpm and takes almost 5 gallons of gas to go 20 miles! My wifes will be a little more street friendly!

You can also build a very dependable lower rpm (6500or7000rpm) , lower compression 302 and install it in a light car and have a lot of fun!
BUT ANY ONE WHO EVER PUT THEIR FOOT INTO A HIGH REVING DESTROKED SMALL BLOCK (GM, Ford, Chrysler, AMC, ETC) Will remember that feeling the rest of their life. You dont have to destroke you can build a 283 to high rev cheeper then destroking and the old 2 bolt mains could take the abuse! In a light car they screamed!

Chris
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  #18 (permalink)  
Old 06-20-2012, 12:12 PM
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Here is an artical on a 327 build.. i was going to build my 327 very similar but decided since mine is the year correct engine for my camaro i decided not to and build someting else....

http://www.chevyhiperformance.com/te...d/viewall.html
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Old 06-20-2012, 12:21 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by 67-4-fun
Here is an artical on a 327 build.. i was going to build my 327 very similar but decided since mine is the year correct engine for my camaro i decided not to and build someting else....

http://www.chevyhiperformance.com/te...d/viewall.html
Thats a great blue print and really good power at lower rpm ranges I wouldnt of changed either! Its silly to take a period correct classic numbers matching engine and changing it!


Chris
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Old 06-23-2012, 06:50 AM
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Do you guys really think that engine revs to 12,000rpm? I don't. Sure it's screaming and sounds incredible, but I'd say it's more like 9k-9500. I'd like to see a dyno video of that engine to verify. NEXTEL cup cars can't hit that mark and those guys have UNLIMITED budgets to work with. Titanium valves, exotic coatings to reduce friction, 2.2-1 rockers, massive lifters to control stability, anything and everything at their disposal.
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Old 06-23-2012, 10:12 AM
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Impressive , but totally backwards thinking.

My freind had a 65 4 speed 289 mustang. Shifted at about 7200. Similar solid cam build with a 5 series gear. My 440 cuda 4 speed would decimate it with only a 3.73 and hydraulic cam/ 9.5 compression shifting at 5800. Last thing he did before selling it was a paxton supercharger/cam/head change. I still pounded him.

My 440 dyno data is in my album.

Last edited by spinn; 06-23-2012 at 10:18 AM.
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Old 06-23-2012, 11:31 PM
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12,000 rpm possible if built correctly.. yeah i can be done... you have to understand, this is only a 3" stroke engine and small cylinders for lighter pistons.., I even read where this guy and an even shorter stroke crankshaft made with another engine..
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Old 06-24-2012, 08:33 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by 67-4-fun
12,000 rpm possible if built correctly.. yeah i can be done... you have to understand, this is only a 3" stroke engine and small cylinders for lighter pistons.., I even read where this guy and an even shorter stroke crankshaft made with another engine..
The pistons, crank and rods play a role in getting high rpm out of it, but the valvetrain and head flow play a much bigger role. A NEXTEL cup engine uses pistons lighter than what me and you can buy. They use Titanium rods, lightened cranks, and other exotic parts. Their stroke is similar. They use a big bore 4.185" and a 3.25" stroke. They still can't get 12k out of them.
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Old 06-24-2012, 09:34 AM
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Y block rpm's

Carroll Miller, The Texas oil man was a Y block expert. He beat the Ford racing team at bonneville back in late 50's. I have read that he put heads together then mounted them on a bare block then ran the cam with an electric motor and watched the valve train with a strobe lite. He could see what was hapening harmonic variations , change pieces to get the the RPM up, it only takes one valve doing a pogo bounce to lose power
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Old 06-24-2012, 09:45 AM
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I love it, great video, brings a tear to my eye. I grew up with a drag strip five miles from my house, now there is a strip mall there, one of the twenty or thirty strip malls within the same distance. Now the nearest strip to me is 60+ miles from me. double

Brian
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Old 06-25-2012, 05:20 PM
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Anyone who's spent much time drag racing knows there's no such thing as no maintenance, and eventually you'll break something. But you can run a relaible setup and probably make it last several seasons if you put it together right and don't have unexpected failures. Some things just break, even with the best assemblies.
From 1973-89 I ran my '71 Camaro with 427 almost every weekend at the drags, and drove it to work all week long for the first 10 years of those 16 yrs. I never had a major failure, and never rebuilt the engine in that time. Went through 3 rearends though, but only one that was a "tow me home" failure. The other two just got noisy.
I had the typical tuning to do, and rebuilt the tranny in the early years, but I had a lot of cheap fun too. Eventually retired the car in '89 when the engine just stopped running. 10 yrs. later I rebuilt the engine after sitting dead, but didn't find anything more than a worn out camshaft to cause it to stop earlier.
I'd expect an engine that turns 12,000 rpm's every run to probably not make it more than one season, even if it's built properly. Might even break before the end of the season. You're playing in rare air when you build them to run that high, but people who do so know the odds and still love to do it.
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