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Old 02-21-2007, 07:58 PM
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One of the best painters I know, for last few years has been wanting to write a book on basics of paint for the beginner and a general section on show jobs.
We have found a publisher and a writer.

Reason is he feels all the books out there are too general or copies of 15 year old tech manuals and out dated and he vows to be more technical and more pictures and not as vague.

If your a new painter what are your ideas?

For part two if you are an experience painter and wanted to do a show car for first time, any ideas.

There will be no custom paint as that is a paint in its own and this guys back ground is collision to multi million dollar cars.

Any ideas, I will pass along.

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Old 02-21-2007, 08:51 PM
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As a beginner at body work and painting probably the most frustrating thing to deal with is the fact that everybody has their own way of doing things and there is no set in stone way to do it. It is difficult to establish your own steps to take to get the job done with good results. That is one of the reasons that I like this board, it has a ton of very good information with a little bit of "not so good" information. As I gain a little experience of my own it is now a little easier for me to recognize the good information and add it to my own "bag of tricks".

I would really enjoy reading a book like the one you are working on. Just to see exactly what one proven professional does on a regular basis would be great! If I know the author knows what he is talking about and has a proven track record I would soak up the information like a sponge. I like to read the magazines about paint and body work but they just can't cover all of the steps, a detailed book with pictures and graphics would be a million times better. I have also read some auto body textbooks but they seem to be based on the production body industry, something that right now I am not that interested in (they also are not very reader friendly). This book would be a great reference to look back on when you run into a problem or are unsure how to do something because as a beginner, I have to do a procedure a few times to make it stick in my brain.

As I have read your "steps to a perfect paint job" I think the book could just expand on those steps for a large portion of the contents. If he could include a step by step process for the metal work, rust repair, filler work, etc. that would be a great start.

I really hope this book does get published because the more I think about it the more excited I am to read it!!

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Old 02-22-2007, 12:37 AM
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I'm not a professional painter.

Sounds good barry, have him take it from the right way to run air lines, paint is only as good as the air that is driving it.

If theres any thing I could help him with let me know, I would donate free time for it. Constructive criticism, I would like to look at some of it if he wants a hobbist opinion.


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Old 02-22-2007, 05:58 AM
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It needs to be written in a way that the reader has no chance of misunderstanding the instructions given. Also a very thorough troubleshooting section with cause and repair techniques-what to do when things go wrong. It should start with the basic antiquated lacquer systems and go through to todays urethanes wich would be good to give the reader some history and complete the learning experience. Interesting project, I'm sure with your help it'll be the best written paint book available. Bob
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Old 02-22-2007, 08:51 AM
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I have several books that have been written by so-called experts on the subject. Every one is too general and spend too much time on disassembly, detailing, fixing old paint or marketing the new skills and not enough "nuts and bolts" of actually acquiring the skills.

I have learned more from the likes of MartinSr, BarryK, Baddbob, Shine and others here then all of the pubs I have put together.

Barry, it's a great idea and needed now for us oldies with acrylics and lacquers abilities but are now newbies that need the new high tech products skills. Just as long as the KISS** formula is adhered to as well for people like me that read directions only after everything else has failed !!


** Keep It Simple ,S#####
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Old 02-22-2007, 11:17 AM
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The reason why you have learned a lot from the forum posts is that they are little bites here and there. The hard part about the book is if you don't "leave out details" missed in other books the book will be four inches thick and an overwhelming. It's a tough call what to leave out and what to include. If you don't want it to not too "general" you would have to use particular products and qoute verbatum the tech sheet. You are then using products that the manufacturer may not be happy you are using in your book.

Plus, if you go into great detail about a product that info could be outdated in a very short time. That could also limit the places where the book could be marketed if you were to praise a product of a competitor. It is a hard, line to walk. I know, I have spent some time on research of this stuff myself.

I would love to see how this one turns out.

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Old 02-22-2007, 12:26 PM
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I'd buy it for sure!

I'd like to see something on (affordable) gun comparisons, test panels sprayed with the same mix but different tip sizes (and benefits thereof), spraying in tight areas, spraying in a 2 car garage (no booth), getting clear to lay flat w/o needing to buff (daily driver paint job), affordable breathing gear, which paints require which types of respirator, and good cleanup methods for a start.

Thanks, Barry (and all of you) for being here for us "newbs"

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Old 02-22-2007, 02:27 PM
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Hey, a bunch of great ideas!
He started outlining the book two years ago and
and basically agrees with everything you guys point out.

No lacquer or enamel covered, very short on items like compressors and Da but point out why and what to expect from a $175 da vs $20 and same with a paint gun.
I like his approach as its meat and potato's on how to fix a quarter (as one example) with closer attention paid to exact procedures and exact grits and not so politically correct as blocking primer with 10,000 grit so you don't get scratches.

Most of these books are written to satisfy the writers ego, that he knows all.
The idea here is a hose wife should be able to fix the quarter start to finish and know what to do every step of the way.
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Old 02-22-2007, 04:15 PM
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The problem with a book like that is that there are o many ways of doing some of the stuff. There will always be some "Self defined expert" that will say "That's not right!". Most of the books I have seen on paint and body are just a lot of pages with very little real life info.Kind of like a lot of posts I see on the different forums I go to. They are written to satisfy someone's ego.

How many times can you read, "Gun adjustment is very important, make sure your gun is adjusted properly. Adjust the gun where it is spraying in a cigar pattern, and atomizing properly"? They never really tell you how to adjust it and what "atomizing properly" is. Someone that is reading the book tries their best to adjust the gun where they think it should be, and end up with a mess.

I think it needs to be very specific with stuff like that. It should also, as mentioned, have a very specific "Trouble shooting section". Photos of what a problem is, and how to correct or avoid it. "I get orange peel, what is causing it? Gun adjustment and improper mixture" are a common answer. The problem is that the novice doesn't know how to fix that. That kind of thing needs to be addressed, even to the point of how to produce it to match the rest of the car.

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Old 02-23-2007, 11:52 AM
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I just painted my son's car after not having painted for 30 years. I purchased two books and in retrospect would have liked more information on the following subjects:

1. Appropriate temperture ranges for fast/medium/slow reducers/catalyt and importance of matching.
2. Importance of good lighting and suggested setups.
3. Safety and safety equipment sources. Proper use of safety equipment.
4. Methods to repair mistakes (sand throughs, burn throughs, drips, dust/hair, etc.)

I got confused on a catalyst temperture range and got help from BarryK. Thank you. I would buy such a book.

The paint job turned out OK and I know I'll do a much better job next time.
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Old 02-23-2007, 09:54 PM
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I would:

1. Assume the book is going to be used by home hobbyists. This means we are going to shoot ISO laden paint (as most is these days) in our 2 car garages - NOT PROFESSIONAL PAINT BOOTHS. If we had access to booths, we would use them, and/or we would just pay someone else - we don;t have access, and we don't have the cash so show us how to make the best possible booth w/o spending a fortune for the best results. If a hobbyair setup is an absolute necessity - say so, but don't tell us to go to a professional paint booth. Showing us what works best in a $50K paint booth does us little good.

2. Focus on single stage urethanes and base clear jobs only - especially the latter.

3. Decide if you aer going to focus on "everyday" cars or "old cars". Most of us (on this forum) are probably into old cars. That means rust, and rust repair techniques - show us how to weld in a quarter skin (this gets asked ALL THE TIME), and don't forget the inevitable outer wheelhouse replacement that inevitably accompanies it.

4. Compare paint guns in 3 price ranges ($100, $250, $500, etc.). All HVLP or Compliant...if I see another book showing me a 30 year old Devilbiss suction feed I'll puke.

5. Discuss self etching and Epoxy primer, definitively recommend one or the other and explain why.

6. Discuss thinning and reducing, etc. - why, when and what to do when certiain things "happen" (i.e. orange peel, urethane peel, runs, dry spray, dirt nibs, inadequate booth ventilation and the problems that can cause,etc.).

7. As others have stated, don't talk about dissassembly, etc. For heaven's sake, we are spending a fortune on paint, paint guns, etc. and are contemplating painting our cars...pretty sure we all know how to unbolt parts (and even put the bolts in little tagged baggies).

I actually have 3 books right now (all are typicall yon the shelf at Barnes and Noble):

1. Paint and Body Handbook by Taylor/Hofer
2. Pro Paint & Body by Richardson/Horvath
3. How to Paint your Car on a Budget by Pat Ganahl

Of these 3, the last (#3) was published most recently and is probably my favorite. The first 30 pages are a bit of a waste, but there is some good stuff in there and the color photos are nice (probbaly explains why it was $25 insteead of $18 like the others). As a matter of fact, I think this book is what most of us just needs another 30 or 40 pages (maybe replacing the first 30)!

Just my .02
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Old 02-24-2007, 04:48 AM
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Some very well made points.

The first part would be for the guy that never painter or is learning.
He may not know what lacquer, enamel or acid etch is so there was no plan on mentioning?
Reason is focus on step by step the proper way as to not confuse him with with items that don't apply.

OK the Devilbus MBC 30 cap will be left out.LOL
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