Carb issues I think - Page 6 - Hot Rod Forum : Hotrodders Bulletin Board
Hotrodders.com -- Hot Rod Forum



Register FAQ Search Today's Posts Unanswered Posts Auto Escrow Insurance Auto Loans Advertise
Hot Rod Forum : Hotrodders Bulletin Board > Tech Help> Engine
User Name
Password
lost password?   |   register now

Reply
 
LinkBack Thread Tools
  #76 (permalink)  
Old 05-18-2019, 04:41 AM
55 Tony's Avatar
Registered User
 
Join Date: Nov 2018
Location: Cocke County, TN
Posts: 1,345
Wiki Edits: 0

Thanks: 179
Thanked 227 Times in 201 Posts
Quote:
Originally Posted by Goneagain View Post
I may have a timing issue @950 it’s 45 degrees.

OMG, my timing abnormalities are spreading. That's about where mine is and it runs great that way except for a little pinging at about 35-40 mph and light throttle. Is that without vacuum or mechanical advance? Wouldn't 45° be for the next cylinder? 360/8 is 45 or is it half of that?

    Advertisement
__________________
Young enough to learn ... too old to remember.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Sponsored Links
Advertisement
 
  #77 (permalink)  
Old 05-18-2019, 05:17 AM
Goneagain's Avatar
Registered User
 
Join Date: Sep 2014
Location: North Idaho
Age: 64
Posts: 165
Wiki Edits: 0

Thanks: 71
Thanked 8 Times in 8 Posts
I’m not sure what’s going on last time I checked it I had [email protected] rpm with vac can connected. 19 initial. Starts easy not like it’s to advanced. Thinking of putting The distributor back to stock and try It without the crane advance kit. I haven’t even tried to adjust the vacuum can. Eliminate some variables. Haven’t had it on the road yet don’t trust it. Plus it’s raining

Last edited by Goneagain; 05-18-2019 at 05:25 AM.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
  #78 (permalink)  
Old 05-18-2019, 08:00 AM
36 sedan's Avatar
Registered User
 
Join Date: Apr 2016
Location: American Canyon, CA
Posts: 1,145
Wiki Edits: 0

Thanks: 678
Thanked 330 Times in 264 Posts
Quote:
Originally Posted by Goneagain View Post
I may have a timing issue @950 it’s 45 degrees.
Yes, you have a timing problem! Check to be sure your timing marks are accurate.

I believe (as it was suggested before) you are setting your initial timing with the mechanical advance already starting into its curve (advanced). This will give you tuning troubles.

IMHO, I would suggest you map your mechanical advance curve to know where it starts, finishes and how much it adds. Then adjust it accordingly. I would also map the vacuum advance and adjust it too.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
The Following User Says Thank You to 36 sedan For This Useful Post:
Goneagain (05-18-2019)
 
  #79 (permalink)  
Old 05-18-2019, 08:05 AM
36 sedan's Avatar
Registered User
 
Join Date: Apr 2016
Location: American Canyon, CA
Posts: 1,145
Wiki Edits: 0

Thanks: 678
Thanked 330 Times in 264 Posts
Quote:
Originally Posted by 55 Tony View Post
OMG, my timing abnormalities are spreading. That's about where mine is and it runs great that way except for a little pinging at about 35-40 mph and light throttle.
JMHO, Pinging is NOT good, slight, light throttle or not. Pinging is telling you the motor does not like the timing. Continued pinging can lead to motor damage. Fix the timing...
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
  #80 (permalink)  
Old 05-18-2019, 09:19 AM
55 Tony's Avatar
Registered User
 
Join Date: Nov 2018
Location: Cocke County, TN
Posts: 1,345
Wiki Edits: 0

Thanks: 179
Thanked 227 Times in 201 Posts
Quote:
Originally Posted by 36 sedan View Post
JMHO, Pinging is NOT good, slight, light throttle or not. Pinging is telling you the motor does not like the timing. Continued pinging can lead to motor damage. Fix the timing...

Yes I realize that. I had already retarded it some but still have to go back a little more. You can't hear it unless next to a concrete barrier like when going over a bridge and the sound bounces off it. It's not at all like a detonation knock (which I have heard plenty of), much much fainter, almost like solid lifters but a little higher pitch.
__________________
Young enough to learn ... too old to remember.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
  #81 (permalink)  
Old 05-18-2019, 09:33 AM
36 sedan's Avatar
Registered User
 
Join Date: Apr 2016
Location: American Canyon, CA
Posts: 1,145
Wiki Edits: 0

Thanks: 678
Thanked 330 Times in 264 Posts
Not trying to offend, disrespect or anything else. Really just trying to help;
JMHO. Pinging is detonation, it may be less than a severe knocking, but never the less in any form it can lead to damage. Look at your plugs, any peppering on the insulator is an indication of metal transfer (not what you want).

Timing and AFR is really important to longevity on the street.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
  #82 (permalink)  
Old 05-18-2019, 02:35 PM
55 Tony's Avatar
Registered User
 
Join Date: Nov 2018
Location: Cocke County, TN
Posts: 1,345
Wiki Edits: 0

Thanks: 179
Thanked 227 Times in 201 Posts
I appreciate your advice. What I meant was there is a difference between pre ignition and detonation and the knocking sound comes at different times in the combustion chamber for each.



I know neither is good for an engine. I drove a company car in the 80's that knocked 50 times louder than this. The boss said to just keep putting the cheap gas in it. It went 80,000 miles before getting traded in. It was getting a bit of a rod knock you could hear when revving the engine out of gear. I realize you mean well, but maybe you don't understand how little my problem is compared to a knock that is going to melt and break things. There is a huge difference. BTW, I'm working on a knock sensor gauge that should work with most any vehicle. Not good enough to control timing, just a warning gauge.
__________________
Young enough to learn ... too old to remember.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
The Following User Says Thank You to 55 Tony For This Useful Post:
36 sedan (05-18-2019)
  #83 (permalink)  
Old 05-18-2019, 03:48 PM
36 sedan's Avatar
Registered User
 
Join Date: Apr 2016
Location: American Canyon, CA
Posts: 1,145
Wiki Edits: 0

Thanks: 678
Thanked 330 Times in 264 Posts
Quote:
Originally Posted by 55 Tony View Post
BTW, I'm working on a knock sensor gauge that should work with most any vehicle. Not good enough to control timing, just a warning gauge.
WAY COOL! Keep us posted please
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
  #84 (permalink)  
Old 05-18-2019, 06:38 PM
36 sedan's Avatar
Registered User
 
Join Date: Apr 2016
Location: American Canyon, CA
Posts: 1,145
Wiki Edits: 0

Thanks: 678
Thanked 330 Times in 264 Posts
http://www.rockettbrand.com/download...e-Ignition.pdf
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
  #85 (permalink)  
Old 05-18-2019, 06:54 PM
Goneagain's Avatar
Registered User
 
Join Date: Sep 2014
Location: North Idaho
Age: 64
Posts: 165
Wiki Edits: 0

Thanks: 71
Thanked 8 Times in 8 Posts
Quote:
Originally Posted by 36 sedan View Post
Yes, you have a timing problem! Check to be sure your timing marks are accurate.

I believe (as it was suggested before) you are setting your initial timing with the mechanical advance already starting into its curve (advanced). This will give you tuning troubles.

IMHO, I would suggest you map your mechanical advance curve to know where it starts, finishes and how much it adds. Then adjust it accordingly. I would also map the vacuum advance and adjust it too.
I thought I had the timing down. Obviously not. I’ll check it again in the morning.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
  #86 (permalink)  
Old 05-18-2019, 07:10 PM
ericnova72's Avatar
More for Less Racer
 
Join Date: Jan 2007
Location: S.W. Lower Michigan
Age: 53
Posts: 18,769
Wiki Edits: 0

Thanks: 305
Thanked 3,653 Times in 3,039 Posts
Quote:
Originally Posted by 55 Tony View Post
Yes I realize that. I had already retarded it some but still have to go back a little more. You can't hear it unless next to a concrete barrier like when going over a bridge and the sound bounces off it. It's not at all like a detonation knock (which I have heard plenty of), much much fainter, almost like solid lifters but a little higher pitch.
This sounds to me like you need to richen part throttle, not take timing away...
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
The Following User Says Thank You to ericnova72 For This Useful Post:
36 sedan (05-18-2019)
  #87 (permalink)  
Old 05-19-2019, 03:27 PM
Goneagain's Avatar
Registered User
 
Join Date: Sep 2014
Location: North Idaho
Age: 64
Posts: 165
Wiki Edits: 0

Thanks: 71
Thanked 8 Times in 8 Posts
well carefully checking the timing with no vac advance
[email protected]
[email protected]
[email protected]
[email protected]
Then it ran out of gas. From my house its an hour round trip into town.

So 14 degrees mechanical advance with stock springs. for a total of 33degrees. maybe a little short.

At 950 rpm hooked up vac advance to manifold and got [email protected] 1400rpm So that's 31 degrees vacuum advance or do I factor in the mechanical.

I was going to try adjusting the advance limiter cam that came in the Crane kit (instructions are not real clear) but the starter solenoid gave up the ghost. Ill put a solenoid on tomorrow and try to figure out the vacuum advance.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
  #88 (permalink)  
Old 05-19-2019, 04:30 PM
ericnova72's Avatar
More for Less Racer
 
Join Date: Jan 2007
Location: S.W. Lower Michigan
Age: 53
Posts: 18,769
Wiki Edits: 0

Thanks: 305
Thanked 3,653 Times in 3,039 Posts
I think you just pinpointed the very issue.

19° @ 650 rpm...okay

21° @ 950 rpm...we wouldn't like to see it moving up yet, but just 2° isn't a deal killer

28° @ 1200rpm...that's a big problem!! 7° drops out right at the point you are trying to make everything STABLE.

You say you have to set the idle at 1200+ rpm in neutral to get it to idle in gear, this is the reason why. Just as soon as you drop it in gear and idle rpm goes to 950 rpm or less it drops a whopping 7° of timing.

We need to dive into exactly what distributor you are using, and what weights and springs are being used.
We ned to limit the mechanical advance movement to not start moving at all, or move just a degree or two, below 1200 rpm.

Until you can get rock steady timing below that 1200 rpm point, you'll never be able to get it to idle ingear….no matter what you do to the carb.

it could need different spring combo, different weights, heating and bending of the hook in the weight to tighten it up, epoxy limiting of the inboard side of the advance slot.

Can you post pics of the mechanism up close, cap off, rotor off??

Ignore the vacuum advance right now, we'll deal with that later, and it looks like you are very much going to be a candidate for ported vacuum, only using it for cruise speed mileage gains and not at idle at all.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
The Following User Says Thank You to ericnova72 For This Useful Post:
36 sedan (05-19-2019)
  #89 (permalink)  
Old 05-19-2019, 10:41 PM
Goneagain's Avatar
Registered User
 
Join Date: Sep 2014
Location: North Idaho
Age: 64
Posts: 165
Wiki Edits: 0

Thanks: 71
Thanked 8 Times in 8 Posts
As far as I know it’s stock except for the module
Attached Thumbnails
Click image for larger version

Name:	image.jpg
Views:	22
Size:	71.7 KB
ID:	443459  
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
  #90 (permalink)  
Old 05-19-2019, 10:44 PM
Goneagain's Avatar
Registered User
 
Join Date: Sep 2014
Location: North Idaho
Age: 64
Posts: 165
Wiki Edits: 0

Thanks: 71
Thanked 8 Times in 8 Posts
Another angle
Attached Thumbnails
Click image for larger version

Name:	image.jpg
Views:	19
Size:	65.6 KB
ID:	443465  
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message

Recent Engine posts with photos

Quick Reply
Message:
Options

Register Now

In order to be able to post messages on the Hot Rod Forum : Hotrodders Bulletin Board forums, you must first register.
Please enter your desired user name (usually not your first and last name), your email address and other required details in the form below.
User Name:
Password
Please enter a password for your user account. Note that passwords are case-sensitive.
Password:
Confirm Password:
Email Address
Please enter a valid email address for yourself.
Email Address:
Insurance
Please select your insurance company (Optional)

Log-in



Currently Active Users Viewing This Thread: 1 (0 members and 1 guests)
 
Thread Tools

Posting Rules
You may post new threads
You may post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are On
Pingbacks are On
Refbacks are On


Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
Summit Carb issues ntrue505 Engine 6 09-13-2015 04:52 PM
1971 Motorcraft 2100 carb issues Ethanman Engine 8 08-12-2015 11:33 PM
Edelbrock 1406 carb flow issues on rebuilt Olds 350? c-towndave Engine 4 08-02-2015 03:18 AM
Carb bog vs timing issues? Hacksaw Engine 18 12-31-2012 04:07 PM
Carb issues, advice needed DeputyDawg134 Engine 6 12-11-2007 12:42 PM


All times are GMT -6. The time now is 07:46 AM.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.8
Copyright ©2000 - 2020, vBulletin Solutions, Inc.
Search Engine Optimization by vBSEO 3.6.0 PL2
vBulletin Security provided by vBSecurity v2.2.2 (Pro) - vBulletin Mods & Addons Copyright © 2020 DragonByte Technologies Ltd.
Copyright Hotrodders.com 1999 - 2012. All Rights Reserved.