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  #121 (permalink)  
Old 08-05-2018, 06:18 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by John long View Post
I would want no more than that. I might choose 1/2" less.

I love it when the proportions are so good, you have to look again and ask yourself is it chopped or not. Of course this is like us choosing the color the customer should paint it. Our opinions are kind of irrelevant.

John
Perhaps our opinions are irrelevant. But yours and mine happen to agree on the chop though. Acceptance is relevant to a point, to most folks. If theres uncertainty, opinions are the go-to for an answer. Not enough opinions here to spot a pattern.

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  #122 (permalink)  
Old 08-05-2018, 07:06 PM
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Subtle chop is always best. Too much rake looks like ka ka.
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  #123 (permalink)  
Old 08-05-2018, 07:23 PM
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Originally Posted by 123pugsy View Post
Subtle chop is always best. Too much rake looks like ka ka.
What does the example pic look like, mierda o bien?
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  #124 (permalink)  
Old 08-05-2018, 07:43 PM
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I'm not really into chopped tops and don't see the point of a rake, or care for it, but that car needs the roof a little lower to look right...
The early 30's cars remind me of Abe Lincoln with his top hat..
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  #125 (permalink)  
Old 08-05-2018, 08:26 PM
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I think they were built with them kinda hats in mind, yep.
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  #126 (permalink)  
Old 08-06-2018, 04:36 AM
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What does the example pic look like, mierda o bien?

Can you post side by side pics?
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  #127 (permalink)  
Old 08-06-2018, 05:24 AM
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The problem with most top chops is the builder wants the world to know what he has done. Chopping a car is a lot of work to do and have nobody notice... Even though the car will look better.

Had I had it to do over, I would have chopped the Merc less. 3 1/2" was a bit too much.

John
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  #128 (permalink)  
Old 08-06-2018, 06:19 AM
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Pugsy, of what? Two chop heights?

First thing I'll want to look at concerning the chop is a 3/2. Thats what I need to see to know if I like it, which matters naught anyway but I could stop asking questions if thats set in stone. I see raves about things that look wrong to me like rear side window shape lookin fugly and not enough rake making it look uphill to the windshield.

John, you know I answer to one person up there. Thats the only one I feel the need to please. Big Mike has more experience with 30s Ford than the rest of us combined and has done chops. We have learned to accept his suggestions as near-gospel no matter what and it proves to be a good thing time and time again but I see unexplored options all over the place. I mean its not like theres anything new under the Model A sun, I can't do anything that hasn't been done. But you know I often see things in different light and sometimes thats a good thing. "Because thats what looks good." (3/2) can be reason enough for me, but for me to be sure I agree, I have to explore.

Exploration has shown me that most anything off a 32-4 is welcome on a 30-1, like roof front, windshield, cowl vent. Does the man like pivoting windshield with visor, or tilt-out with no visor? I'll need to find out, and provide a means from which to select if theres a decision to be made.

And then theres stuff like moving the cowl forward to flush doors instead of cutting the body. Heck you can just swap sides with the doors to suicide them with stock hinges. Its a simple old car but theres a lot to consider for sure. The order of operations is what my mind needs to sort first, so I am pushing to establish the list of operations now. I gotta start running with it but lack direction. Usually if I plug parameters into my noggin on this side of town, I'll have my idea by the time I get to the shop and can walk in with a purpose rather than an "OK, umm... lets see.". Creative thinking is best done before stepping into the shop full of distractions.
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  #129 (permalink)  
Old 08-06-2018, 07:34 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by idrivejunk View Post
Pugsy, of what? Two chop heights?

First thing I'll want to look at concerning the chop is a 3/2. Thats what I need to see to know if I like it, which matters naught anyway but I could stop asking questions if thats set in stone. I see raves about things that look wrong to me like rear side window shape lookin fugly and not enough rake making it look uphill to the windshield.

John, you know I answer to one person up there. Thats the only one I feel the need to please. Big Mike has more experience with 30s Ford than the rest of us combined and has done chops. We have learned to accept his suggestions as near-gospel no matter what and it proves to be a good thing time and time again but I see unexplored options all over the place. I mean its not like theres anything new under the Model A sun, I can't do anything that hasn't been done. But you know I often see things in different light and sometimes thats a good thing. "Because thats what looks good." (3/2) can be reason enough for me, but for me to be sure I agree, I have to explore.

Exploration has shown me that most anything off a 32-4 is welcome on a 30-1, like roof front, windshield, cowl vent. Does the man like pivoting windshield with visor, or tilt-out with no visor? I'll need to find out, and provide a means from which to select if theres a decision to be made.

And then theres stuff like moving the cowl forward to flush doors instead of cutting the body. Heck you can just swap sides with the doors to suicide them with stock hinges. Its a simple old car but theres a lot to consider for sure. The order of operations is what my mind needs to sort first, so I am pushing to establish the list of operations now. I gotta start running with it but lack direction. Usually if I plug parameters into my noggin on this side of town, I'll have my idea by the time I get to the shop and can walk in with a purpose rather than an "OK, umm... lets see.". Creative thinking is best done before stepping into the shop full of distractions.

Figurin out what to do and what to do first is something that's ingrained into my brain more and more. In the past, I've been jumping into stuff and screwing up everything. After planning the house in such great detail, I'm seeing how the planning pays off.


Two shots meaning the stock and the shopped pics.
I'm not finding many raked pics on google. That will obviously angle the window...hmm...how will that look?


But ya, as you mentioned, the boss's ideas always come out good and from the pics of your shop's projects, no doubts on the outcome of this one either...just nice to hash out ideas/thoughts.
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  #130 (permalink)  
Old 08-06-2018, 11:33 AM
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I have shown the blue screen one to everybody here and nobody had a single complaint. That is significant.



Slick is making headway on the Cat front end. I am continuing to build my jig thing.



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  #131 (permalink)  
Old 08-06-2018, 11:42 AM
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The chop looks pretty good to me.
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  #132 (permalink)  
Old 08-06-2018, 11:51 AM
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The chop looks pretty good to me.

I agree it looks much better,,Non chop looks more like a T roof.
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  #133 (permalink)  
Old 08-06-2018, 06:58 PM
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I reckon it is tricky to say until you see side by side but I purposely posted the chop pic by itself because it won't always be parked next to a gennie for comparison. What you can see is that the original roof is about flat on top, but not so's you'd ever notice...

The windows get taller toward the front, like a shark face on a P40. All I did was tilt the lid (roof + door tops) until the door window appeared rectangular, then lowered it until my eye did not "read" it as stock height. Stopped there. I intended to mark increments on the car and set up a reference pic for getting specific with window shapes, to plan my cuts via computer chop which is actual C.A.D., in a way. It will keep.

I'll get to what I actually worked on today, but wanted to say first thing I did (after pondering it on the way across town) was to write up a question and option list to start filling in my unknowns. That works great, by the way. Writing up the complex stuff for boss man. Anyway, I presented that and announced my intent to cut a side off the car today.

That didn't happen, but I did stick to my plan from Friday and got a mildly pleasant reward for it at the end of the day.

Also at the end of the day, I went ahead and popped the question important to me. Well, one of them anyway. Boss was on board with the making one big side panel idea from first mention. The one where I attempt to make one big piece that can be cut up to make a door skin, quarter patch, and cowl patch. From the belt down.

Since then, I've waffled and mentioned buying door skins. So I outlined the risks and expressed the will to do it either way, and some tenative confidence that I will succeed. Well, dude who has done all the 30s car stuff was in favor of the big panel to begin with and still thinks it could be a win. So what I'm saying is the response was favorable and when the day feels right...

...just wait and see.

Slick wanted to be sure you saw the Cat CAD happening here. He will use some 3/16" thick, 4" wide flat stock. I can think of a couple other ways to do that, but figure this design would adequately serve as a crush cap in a collision and allows the use of stock bumper brackets. Simple but pretty.

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  #134 (permalink)  
Old 08-06-2018, 07:40 PM
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Today I created a lower half for the body support & alignment structure I built last week. Using 80" long, 1 x 3" 14 gauge tubing I made side beams that attach via roughly sliced brackets of angle stock with one side drilled. Lateral beams were next, then a piece of upright (exactly plumb) angle was used near the B pillars, just ahead of the spot where the top side beams pass over the lower. To space the height of the two boxes evenly, side-vs-side. It could use one in the center just ahead of the trunk.

But then, the prevailing plan was to remove the unboltable, slightly adjustable lower box and square it on the floor like I did the top half. But that sounded like more work so I did a quick check first.

Happy to report that the lower half of the support structure went together squarely in the car, so there was no need for that step. I can now get consistent comparative measurements on all corners of my structure. THAT was a welcome suprise!

So yay, good deal. All within a max of less than a quarter inch, X-measured between dash / post (top, front) reference point and that one in the pics at the tail. That is an acceptable amount of variation for me to proceed.

This is the part where I got a little hoot from the wreck fixer in me. Looking at variations of the body, from the structure. Whoa, Nellie! Yeah its a typical Model A, bent. The tail panel is on crooked and that kinked quarter is mashed pretty good.

My next step is to align and level body on frame then add tabs to the support structure at some body mount holes. THEN, I can correctly establish a master center line and reference it for proper positioning of the floppy loose, previously incorrectly positioned during floor repair, driver's side B pillar... bottom.

Then I can go hawg wild measuring any point on the body, and have lots of options for cutting and fitting plus body shell handling with the support. So I'm pleased, and anxious to get going. Its about time to shop sheetmetal. Thats another good brownie point list.






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  #135 (permalink)  
Old 08-06-2018, 07:47 PM
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I should add, for body guys, that my setup here is for measuring from the inside corners of the big beams. In case you wondered, or thought it was the bolt heads maybe.
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