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ReClear or Repaint?

6K views 51 replies 8 participants last post by  adantessr 
#1 ·
So I am doing this on the cheap, I am not going for a showroom shine. I just want a decent looking car (1 color!).
I used a purple HF gun and DupliColor Lacquer paint and clear.
The paint seems to be OK, the clear looked OK until after I sanded it with 1500 then compounded it with Macguiers ultimate. After a day it then turned 'white'.
LOTS more sanding got most of it to be no longer white. I really do not want to sand the entire car this much. SO....
Can I just use 800 and reclear? (the current clear is less than 2 months old)
I recently learned I was probably holding the gun too far away so it was not a smooth coat. (and the gun was not set up properly it seems)
OR
Should I just 600-800 and shoot a layer or 2 of paint then clear to 'start over'?
Image
1) As it looked when I got it
2) Hood after 1500 and compounded
3) Door same
4) Close up of hood
5) Door wet (when it dries it looks like image 3)
6) Hood as it is now (sort of, a little spot now shows as white after a day but tolerable I guess)

I think my issue is totally in the clear but would like to have it be metallic green always, not only when wet...hahaha
 

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#2 ·
If you have enough on it to sand and re clear and are willing to give it another shot, use some cheap catalyzed clear instead of the air dry stuff and that will give the look you want. DC clear can be polished up if you apply tons of it, but you can only keep it decent looking like a year or so if you try hard.
 
#3 ·
There should be plenty to sand and reclear, initally I put 4-5 coats 15 minutes apart. But that is assuming I got it on evenly in the first place which I don't thin I did.
I know if I kept sanding the doors etc I can get to look good but that is just too much work since I did the hood 5-6 times with 1000-1500-2000 ....looks OK now, and really is smooth as a glass surface. But a couple spots remain and I think I burned through a spot or 2 now so I am not afraid to 'start over' or just reclear.
Just going for the best advice I can find.
 
#4 ·
I also meant to say that I was told I might have had the gun too far away so it probably was almost dry before it even hit the car.
So I should hold the gun closer to the surface about 6" and that using lacquer like before will just 'melt' into the existing clear and leave a solid surface. But I do not want to waste my time if this is only a guess. If it doesn't work then I would have to scratch/paint/clear to fix that.
 
#6 ·
you borked the job when you went for that crap... Your best cause of action now is to use an acrylic enamel with a hardener after sanding everything off smooth.

this paint is pretty good stuff, and will be about the same as what you wasted on the spray can, in a quart can of dupli color

Restoration Shop

I do appreciate your comment but you are off.
My question was should I reclear or repaint. The job is not 'borked' as you put it since if you look at the images above you can see I fixed the hood with lots of work of sanding down the clear.
I am not delusional in thinking that $18/qt paint is going to make a show car, I did say I don't care, I just want 1 color, and that color is not white over green.
The door is already half the white gone after some more sanding. Just lots of work and if I can respray more clear to 'melt' and blend then I will do that.
The issue is in the CLEAR. it looks good when wet so the paint is fine.
I included a close up and you can see how spotted the clear is.

I know it can get results though......
 

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#7 ·
sand entire car and spray with single stage urethane. forget the clear. Just make sure the urethane does not lift the existing paint. I painted my truck with single stage and wet sanded and buffed and it look very good. However it does not go out in the rain and is garaged. It has lasted 18 years. Clear is required for show cars and is the best but unless you have a show car not necessary. If you clear put on altleast 4-5 coats as once you sand through you have to start over. Just my two cents.
 
#10 ·
If it doesn't wrinkle the lacquer, you'd be OK. Technically, most basecoat is lacquer. But in a "for best results" world, using the lacquer is indeed a no-no and has to come off to put a nice job down. I was thinking more along the lines of just clearing from the side molding up with a couple quarts of urethane clear. And carefully spotting color if you broke through. Because just by using urethane clear you would have shine immediately without buffing. 2 or 3 coats, done. Buff when you feel like it.
 
#11 ·
OK so now I am a little confused.
You are suggesting just redoing the clear with Urethane and not lacquer.
The other guy is suggesting just using a single stage I assume to repaint it and it should shine (if sprayed properly) without the need for all this.

Paintforcars.com has what I would want (the green metallic) for $80 for the gallon. Would this not be better than trying to fix what I have?
 
#12 ·
It looks to me like you got the color down OK, so I was thinking least arm work to fix. You know you have to sand the rough parts flat in any case. Clear or single stage is your choice and eighty bucks is hard to beat.

The single stage suggestion is valid and I may be adventurous in saying you could spray urethane clear over that... if it would "let" you on a test piece without wrinkling. But any paint could potentially do the same.

Its really a matter of what you're comfortable with attempting, and my suggestion of urethane clear is just how I think I would approach it. I want hardener in anything the sun sees, and urethane clears can dry pretty quick and contain less solvent than lacquer. But they are high.

Trouble with my idea is you have to buy the stuff and try it to find out. But same with the single stage. If it was me and I was trying to get lasting shine but was happy with the color... and whats on there isn't dirty yet... why not?
 
#13 ·
I see what you mean, but if I have to sand it flat I am afraid I will cut through to the base since it does appear it went on spotty and didn't run and merge into a single coat of clear.
I got the hood looking nice but I also see one area that is not metallic at all, and I feel it is because I sanded into the base.
If I were to try to fix the clear I would hand sand, if I were to 1 stage it I would use 600 or 800 on a DA.
But you are right, either way I need to spend the money. I might go with the 1 stage. if the clear doesn't work then I will still need to buy the 1 stage so why spend more money? I can test with 1 stage, if it works then great, if not then I know I need to sand to surface again.
 
#14 ·
The Dupli color paint shop is an overpriced garbage lacquer paint which is the problem. It never ends well and when it's done, options are limited. The solvents in urethane will melt lacquer so if you go urethane, you have to get rid of every bit of lacquer or your going to end up with a mess.. All is not lost though, because you can put an acrylic enamel over urethane without much issue. Either Paintforcars or TCP Global will produce far better results than what your getting with Duplicolor. I have used paintforcars epoxy in the past. That starfire stuff and it was garbage but the paint is probably ok. The Restoration shop from TCP global is my go- to paint. Fairly cheap with decent results. Keep in mind with a single stage paint a solid color will come out better than a metallic
 
#15 ·
Well you said all is not lost...how so?
You mentioned putting enamel over urethane but I have lacquer...so how is it not lost?
(I knew it was kind of garbage, and I think it was my application, not the paint actually....if you see one of the images i did it right on the roof area or I was just lucky!)
But what is my solution to fix this? Just sand it all the way down and start over with a urethane 1 stage or something? (I am not afraid of the work, I do know that there is nothing I can do that can't be fixed short of blowing up the car that is!)
 
#16 ·
Meant to say acrylic enamel over lacquer. Not acrylic enamel over urethane ( you shouldn't do that either ).

Acrylic enamel was designed to go over lacquer primer as that is what was available way back when it came out.. Urethane is a better longer lasting paint, but without removing the lacquer it's out as an option. Acrylic enamel is lightyears better than a lacquer, you could get what you have smooth enough, and then shoot it with a few coats of single stage acrylic and be done with it. Just get a good face mask with multiple cartridges due to the isocynates in the hardener/ activator

The reason that Duplicolor lacquer is complete trash is because you can't lay it on heavy enough to cut and buff it out to the deep gloss that real lacquer can be. The failing clear is due in part that it needs clear to gloss at all. Dupli has many bad reviews on this stuff but excellent marketing so it still sells.
 
#19 ·
Yeah, that's what I meant to select, I was on the other page for the other acrylic that does not work with lacquer and just did a search.
But OK.
So I know I said it but I want to be sure...
Hit it all with 600. Scuff it good, all over (don't want to miss a spot!) .
Should I do an 800 as well or just the 600?
Now to make sure my gun is set up properly...I am buying a 2nd air gauge to place at the gun side--I have 1 from pump to tank and 1 from tank to hose already-- and I assume this should spray "HVLP - 1.3-1.5mm – 8-10 psi at the cap" means WHEN TRIGGER IS DEPRESSED right? Not built up pressure before spraying. (that was from the tech sheet of the paint you linked)
 
#20 ·
if it is smooth as it is, you can use a green scotch brite and be good to go. I always go to 600 grit though.

Just set your gun up accordingly with it's instructions and make sure you have enough cfm to run it. I didn't read which gun you have but some of them are air hogs and can cause issues. I actually use a Stanley bostich gravity feed gun. 90% positive it is made by Campbell Hausfeld ( as is many of the HF guns ). Takes little air and gives good results.. Just adjust until it sprays out nice. you can spray out on anything flat. construction/ poster paper works good
 
#21 ·
Well I have the cheap HF purple one, I figured why spend the money on something I am only going to use once! And many have said for 1 or 2 cars these guns are great. Not more than that but for my use it should be fine. However I will buy a new one just to make sure ($9.99 I can afford).
The Compressor ...well, it is only 21 gallon 2.5HP but I figure if I spray in small bursts and do 1 part at a time I should be OK. I can't do anything about that, anything more than that one is too expensive for a 1 time use item as well.
 
#22 ·
IIRC isn't air pressure on that gun like 50 PSI? I used to have a couple of those and the CH variants before buying the slightly more expensive Bostitch gun. As long as your compressor is oil lubricated it will be fine to keep it running. If it makes around 5 SCFM@ 90 PSI it will work
 
#25 ·
Yeah, it's an oil compressor.
The gun might say that but the paint tech sheet was saying 10psi at the gun.
Do I not go by what the paint sheet says to get the spray right?
I know these things are cheap and it seems most have different values.
If I add the air pressure to the bottom of the gun I can fully open the air adjuster knob on the gun itself since the added valve will actually control the flow...?
 
#23 ·
Not so
I am not a professional painter just a guy that wanted a decent tough paint job. I sanded and then used an epoxy primer thinned out as a sealer to cover the existing gray paint on an old navy truck. I then applied a solid color single stage over it. I do not know what the existing paint was probably enamel. I am not one to advise you on your situation, only saying that the single stage worked for me. As far as I understand the only difference between clear and single stage is the single stage has color.Clear may have some uv protection. I used Omni paint. Go to a auto paint store ask them. You apparently have a mixture of different paints so I can not advise you on compatibility. I only suggested single stage as no one mentioned it. On the many car shows on tv some have used single stage and got very good results. I painted my mustang with solid color base coat and clear coat and all the while I was wet sanding was worried about sanding through. That is why if I do it again I would put on 5 coats of clear. I did go through is some places and repaired with single coat. 10 foot paint job. You can tell when you go through as the water gets colored and the spot will be dull.


Maybe as others have said just spray with acrylic enamel and be done with it. I feel your frustration.
 
#24 ·
@alwill923
I appreciate your advice and if I have to paint again I will try a single stage. I am thinking that I might be better off doing just that. Another 2-3 cans to redo what I have is going to cost the same as a good paint, if I had more experience the duplicolor might have gone better.
You are mistaken though that I do not have a mixture of paints. I sanded to surface, primed and used Duplicolor throughout so it is all lacquer.
 
#26 ·
go by what the gun says. The gun you have is not a true HVLP, nor does your compressor produce enough air to run a true HVLP.. To remain in VOC compliance, they put that requirement in the tech sheets since HVLP is actually required to remain in VOC compliance. Tune the gun according to it's instructions and check the spray out, then shoot the car
 
#27 ·
I know the compressor is a little low for paint a car but I figure I should be OK for small bits. like a door first. etc... I don't plan on the entire car at once, I know I am seriously limited. All in all the job I have is not horrible for NO experience and low end equipment, just too much work to straighten it out. (If I don't wet sand/compound it is green and looks OK but no shine of course and it isn't white)
I was looking at a slightly better gun too, figure another 50 for a better quality like a Rockwood is better than HF.
If I have the gun I'll find reasons to use it! hahahaha
 
#30 ·
It's a big misconception that Hvlp guns use less air. Yes, they use a lower pressure at the cap, but they need TONS of volume. Using a small compressor you'd be better off with a high efficiency/compliant or conventional gun but you won't find one for $40. The old school Sata-jet hvlp knock-offs are air hogs.

The bigger gun in this kit is not a bad spaying gun. I had to have a gun in the middle of a job when I dropped mine. It atomizes nice at lower pressures. It's kind of a midsize gun. It's like a Devilbiss Finishline knock-off and would do better with the smaller compressor though it's still hvlp.
https://www.harborfreight.com/2-pc-professional-automotive-hvlp-air-spray-gun-kit-60239.html

The touch up gun is not too bad either.

I'll second the Duplicolor in the can is junk. Fine line tape pulled it right off the primer. I don't trust it's adhesion. It just weird stuff as far as automotive paint goes.
 
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