Hot Rod Forum : Hotrodders Bulletin Board

Title:

Message:

[QUOTE=BogiesAnnex1;4687455]Part nonsense part not.

I have doubts that Chevy ever used nickel in any production blocks regardless of magazine claims otherwise.

Thin wall casting mostly uses less material which saves both money and weight, I'm sure the OEMs worry about it in that order.

The factory 4 bolt main has more to do with spreading the forces over more of the web, the cap stability really comes from that not so much about more clamping force on the cap although that does happen. The aftermarket 4 bolt caps angle the outer bolts into the pan rail where there is more meat to bolt into. The help this brings is now the bulkhead is being somewhat supported by the cap instead of just supporting the cap as in the factory design as some of the loading is being transferred into the pan rail area beyond the bulkhead.

A good balance job and damper does a lot to relieve these center caps of having to deal with loads that would like to put the center of journal rotation somewhere besides the center line of the crank.

You will note that the GEN III and later SBC's use a main cap in girdle arraingement that was also found on the Allison aircraft engines of WW II. The other popular design used by Rolls Royce/Packard and many German and Russian engines of the era was cross bolted mains. The effort not only to stiffen the bottom end but to distribute the crank loads over a greater area of the block.

Bogie[/QUOTE]

Trackback:

Send Trackbacks to (Separate multiple URLs with spaces) :

Register Now

In order to be able to post messages on the Hot Rod Forum : Hotrodders Bulletin Board forums, you must first register.
Please enter your desired user name (usually not your first and last name), your email address and other required details in the form below.

User Name:

Password

Please enter a password for your user account. Note that passwords are case-sensitive.
Password:	Confirm Password:

Email Address

Please enter a valid email address for yourself.
Email Address:

Log-in

User Name		Remember Me?
Password

Additional Options
Miscellaneous Options Automatically parse links in text Automatically embed media (requires automatic parsing of links in text to be on). Automatically retrieve titles from external links

Topic Review (Newest First)

08-29-2019 08:59 AM

AutoGear

I remember scuttlebutt about some 4 bolt OEM blocks being as strong as their 2bolt siblings. This seemed to be centered around the 400SBC. The 400 block of choice was the 2 bolt around these parts, and then some were converted to aftermarket 4bolt (Splayed caps). Perhaps theres a grain of truth here but theres a lot of 'correlation does not equal causation' going on in that 'article'.

The EPA came down hard about NVH, and drove the OEMs to beat on transfercase designers about 20yrs ago. We saw a big shift in chains/sprockets vs gears, modernized casting designs and materials. Additionally, the luxury '4wd' segment pushed the goalposts out even farther, cuz God knows Biff and Buffy need bank-vault quietude, and push-button 4wd rollin through Beverly Hills in their 3-ton Dreadnought Class SUV

08-26-2019 08:53 AM

JeffB28

Out of the Archives we had this discussion: https://www.hotrodders.com/forum/hec...ck-142976.html

08-25-2019 09:58 AM

curtis73

He is full of crap on a lot of issues.

First, we need to delineate what "strength" we're talking about. There is a big difference between how strong the main webbing is and how much power it can handle without deforming/exploding.

Many of the 2-bolt blocks had additional webbing, which means the webbing is stronger, but there are only two bolts holding the main caps in place. Depending on the casting, the general (very general) accepted guideline is that in order of weakest to strongest it goes A) 2-bolt, B) 4-bolt, C) a 2-bolt block machined for 4-bolt.

08-09-2019 09:46 AM

BogiesAnnex1

Quote:

Originally Posted by rivvgs

so I have been told, I have read and been told by my machinist. that the 4 bolt blocks of the 2 piece main seal era where the largest portion of 4 bolt block originate. often have more core shift issues.when over boring a cyl core shift can greatly effect the thickness that is safe to bore. I am not sure why but the latter blocks tend to have less issues

Casting techniques have changed a lot. Cores are formed around hard foam patterns that are not removed prior to the pour so there isn't a disturbance of the core for pattern removal anymore. Castings are done with higher head pressures which improves distribution, lessens pits and holes, increases density. The process is highly automated which is more consistent than humans doing this hot and dangerous work. My maternal grandfather worked as a overhead crane operator at Jones and Laughlin, as a young man he got me in for a tour, that and me working in a slaughter house, packing, mechanic, truck driver and candy making companies over my summers and holidays really raised my GPA in school. Which brings me to taxpayers covering college tuition; sitting around with my buddies the subject of what did you do on class breaks came up; "anybody go to Cancun?". The answer was everybody either caught up on studies and/or worked to make money. So when I see hordes of vacationing students on TV, I'm not too inclined to pour more tax dollars into free college for these folks because they borrowed their way through school. Trading your time for debt is a life lesson the young need to learn.

Bogie

08-09-2019 07:17 AM

BigMo

Quote:

Originally Posted by joe_padavano

But, but, it's on the interwebs so it MUST be true...

[emoji106]

Sent from my SM-G900V using Tapatalk

08-08-2019 07:14 PM

rivvgs

although there are less compressive loads, and slower piston speeds. they never made a 4 bolt main 327. research the top OEM hp gen1 small block.many a 7500 rpm 327 roamed the streets

08-08-2019 07:08 PM

rivvgs

Quote:

Originally Posted by OC_

https://westcoastengines.com/2-vs-4-...into-the-myth/

To me, it seems like this guy is all over the place. He says the EPA was enforcing NVH standards. Thats BS, the epa doesn't care about noise vibration and harshness at all!

I think hes trying to say that out of SBC blocks manufactured in the 80's and 90's, the 2 bolt main ones are better.

08-05-2019 06:16 PM

64nailhead

No

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

08-03-2019 10:57 AM

Rip VW

Ah it is a good life it is Mr Bogie. I am setting out on the porch just finished a small plate of Blueberry muffins followed up with a gallon of good Coffee. The sun is shining and there is a light breeze blowing and I can hear the ocean waves crashing on the shore..

Ahh as a good friend of mine used to say.. Tis a good life as long as you don't weaken!!

08-03-2019 10:24 AM

BogiesAnnex1

My wife is big on lean protein from fish, I prefer North Lake Tavern pizza and a pitcher of PBR. She and my cardiologist say this isn't good for me, but you know somtimes you have to feed your soul as well as your body.

I've been sitting here on the patio with my pittie, who is chasing horse chestnut seed pods falling into the yard, and a pot of coffeee while sneaking a Hostess cherry pie all morning while typing these responses. The summer sun is just peaking above the trees accross the street. I'll head for the shop pretty soon. Life is good.

Bogie

08-03-2019 07:02 AM

S10xGN

Eating bacon is bad for you this week, but wait a month and it'll be the "latest and greatest" superfood.

Russ

08-03-2019 06:12 AM

ProStreetRob

Through the decades there have been numerous articles on 10 bolt rears are better than 12 bolt, T350's are better than T400's, 2 bolt mains are better than 4 bolt, bla bla bla... Usually they come from people with 2 bolt engines, 10 bolt rears, and T350 Transmissions, LOL

There's Pro's & Con's on everything, which one is; smaller, lighter, quicker, stronger, cheaper to build, etc... Bottom line is if your making BIG POWER you want something that can hold it, and if your making low to moderate hp then you don't need the biggest & baddest. I make 649 RWHP (about 750HP at the crank) so I'll stick with my 9.9" Rear, Tremec TR6060, & 6 Bolt Mains Thank You

08-02-2019 10:58 PM

BogiesAnnex1

The EPA cares about external noise. The total is capped at so many db at some distance. Obviously everything is making noise but the big contributors are tires and exhaust. I don't see stiffening or strengthening the engine as having a big effect.

However, the motorcycle companies play pretty hard here so they can devote more of the db allocation to exhaust tone than rotating assembly and valve train rattle or gear whine. The Twin Cam and Milwaukee 8 Harley's have a fake timing cover who's purpose is to soak out cam drive noise leaving more space for exhaust noise. I fixed my Twin Cam so I transmit both cam gear whine and loud exhaust which I'm sure far exceed the EPA's miserly limits. But I'm deaf in one ear (exhaust side) and can't hardly hear with the other so with that counter balancer engine I need a lot of noise to hear if it's running.

Bogie

08-02-2019 09:37 PM

OC_

Quote:

Originally Posted by techinspector1

"He says the EPA was enforcing NVH standards. Thats BS, the epa doesn't care about noise vibration and harshness at all!"

If you'll do a search on the web, you'll find out differently.
.

I did. I didn’t find anything. Please show me what you found.

08-02-2019 06:38 PM

joe_padavano

But, but, it's on the interwebs so it MUST be true...

This thread has more than 15 replies. Click here to review the whole thread.

Posting Rules
You may post new threads You may post replies You may not post attachments You may not edit your posts BB code is On Smilies are On [IMG] code is On HTML code is Off Forum Rules

Reply to Thread

Register Now

Log-in