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Old 07-13-2020, 07:59 PM
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Profiler Heads - are they worth waiting for?

So, after a good deal of discussion here, I had decided to buy a set of Profiler heads.
Based on their claimed flow numbers, I felt that the extra cost compared to ProMaxx would be worth it, to get the maximum performance from the cam and etc that I've chosen.
However, I ordered them through Summit on March 2 of this year... so before they could be shipped, we were suddenly under lockdown.
I contacted Profiler in mid-March, to find out if they were still working, and what the outlook was for getting these heads at some point.
At that time, I was told that they were involved with building ventilators, you know since New York was going to need 30,000 of them... I think I heard that they ended up using 1,000...
So I waited patiently, as the expected ship date kept getting pushed forward.
On April 24, Summit sent me a notice that the expected ship date had been changed to 5/9/2020. So I waited patiently until a couple of weeks past that date. I haven't had any updates from Summit since April 24...
Sometime in mid-May or so, I started contacting Profiler.
I was told "a couple of weeks".
A couple of weeks later, I was told "beginning of next week".
At the end of "next week", I was told "Monday".
The week after that I was told "a couple of days".
The week after that I was told "tomorrow, they just need guide plates".
Last Monday July 6, I was told "they're all done, they just need to be shipped".
A week later (today), I still have no notice of any shipment.

So, now that all my whining is done (for now), my question is:
Are these heads really worth going through all this B.S. runaround?
Does anyone have first-hand experience that shows that their heads really flow as they claim?
If their numbers are just B.S., and I'd get the same performance from another brand in the same (or lower) price range, I'd be strongly inclined to tell Profiler to get stuffed.
I understand if you can't fulfill an order due to circumstances, and you just say so.
But when I keep getting told something different every f-ing week, it gets to the point where it's really pissing me off.

So if anyone has some first-hand knowledge of whether these heads even live up to their claims (or don't), I'd really appreciate some information on your experiences.

Thanks!

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Old 07-13-2020, 10:01 PM
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No first hand experience here, but just as couple places you can look at for independent flow testing that shows Profiler isn't embellishing the heads flow capability at all.

Stan Weiss' - Cylinder Head Flow Data at 28 Inches of Water -- DFW / FLW Flow Files for use with Engine Simulation Software
Stan Weiss' - Cylinder Head Flow Data at 28 Inches of Water -- DFW / FLW Flow Files for use with Engine Simulation Software

This guy knows a lot about them:
Chad Speier Racing Heads - SRH HOME

The ATK head is the ProFiler casting without the raised exhaust port location.
https://www.high-performance-engines...eads-s/173.htm
Thought I'd throw the link out there in case you might find them ready to ship and can tell Profiler direct to stuff it.
The Jegs head is ProFiler too, but they don't seem to have anything listed right now?

Call Profiler and tell them if they can't get them to you in a week after all this run-around, your going to cancel the charges
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Old 07-14-2020, 01:09 AM
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As always, thanks for the input Eric.

Looking at that chart, it's sort of confusing in the Profiler 210 section.
I'm looking at the .500 column.
A couple that say "gasket matched" are right around Profiler's claim of 283 cfm with the 2.08 intake valves. Profiler only shows numbers for 2.08
One of the "gaket matched" examples has 2.055 intake, and the other has 2.08. Interesting that the 2.08 one is lower cfm than the 2.055 one...
However, when I look at the 195 section, the out-of-box examples seem to be very close to Profiler's numbers for the 195.

So, assuming that those numbers are correct, I think I'll wait a little longer to see if Profiler actually ships them in the not-too-distant future...
Other similar heads seem to be around 273 cfm max at.500...

In the meantime, I have to swap my new 4L60e in (again...), file my piston rings (again...), degree my cam and etc.
So, hopefully Profiler will get those heads to me by the time I'm done with the other stuff.

Also, at this point Fontana Dragway has NOTHING on their calendar (thanks China!), so I'd be a fool to rush things too much.

Thanks a bunch for the input and links Eric!

Last edited by SoulSurfSD; 07-14-2020 at 01:28 AM.
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Old 07-14-2020, 06:49 AM
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Call Chad Speier to get them. You won't have to wait as long....He's a master WD.....
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Old 07-14-2020, 07:15 AM
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what part number are you looking for?
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Old 07-14-2020, 07:24 AM
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Amazing heads for the money. Chad Speier is a GREAT option
PBM-Erson has em still listed as in stock on the website
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Old 07-14-2020, 10:31 AM
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Whatever heads you get, test them for valve leaking if buying them 'assembled'...
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Old 07-14-2020, 12:14 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by lmsport View Post
what part number are you looking for?
The part number is 176-2170P-04-93
It's the 70cc chamber version of the 23-degree as-cast All American series for SBC.
So, the price range I'm looking at is $1300-1400.
I ended up paying $1300 and change from Summit, since I got $100 off the order, and Free Shipping.

It seems that Chad Speier only has CNC stuff now, so it's a much higher price range.

PBM-Erson only has 64 or 72cc, and 2.055 intake valves.
I ordered 70cc chambers, and 2.08 valves...

If I just couldn't get these from Profiler, I could go with a 64cc chamber, but with my current pistons I'd have to go with a longer duration cam, to lower the dynamic compression from 8.75 to 8.5, so that I don't run into detonation issues on CA pump gas.

Thanks for all the input guys, I tried to answer all of the responses in this post. Sorry if I missed anyone...
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Old 07-14-2020, 12:20 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by BuzzLOL View Post
Whatever heads you get, test them for valve leaking if buying them 'assembled'...
Yep, I'm planning on making a "donation" to my local machine shop, and have them check everything.
In retrospect, I may have been better off getting bare heads, buying the valves, springs, etc. and having the shop do the assembly...
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Old 07-14-2020, 12:58 PM
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You could always put a WTB post on speed-talk or yellowbullet.com
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Old 07-29-2020, 10:37 PM
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I just figured I'd update this thread...

So I called Profiler again on the 15th, expecting to hear that my heads had finally shipped.
The guy told me "they're being assembled"...?!
Keep in mind that this was after I had been told the previous week that they were done, and just needed to be shipped.

I was a little hot under the collar at that point, and although I wasn't really rude, I gave him a quick rundown on all the things that I had been told over the preceding weeks (and months).
I guess that finally lit a fire under his arse, and within a couple of days I was told they were shipped.
I received them the following week.

I don't know how they run things around there, but my particular experience was perplexing at best...
I'm really wondering if they prioritize orders that have been placed directly with them, over orders that have been placed through a third party... I ordered from Summit.

So, if you really want their heads, you might want to call them and ask for a ship date, and compare that to what a third party site says.
I got them cheaper through Summit than I would have direct, due to a discount and free shipping.
But if you're in a hurry, you may want to see if ordering direct will get them to you faster.

Now I hope they live up to expectations...

Thanks for all the input!
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Old 07-30-2020, 03:58 AM
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Because of the Virus shutdown, there may only be one or two people working at Profiler... in fact, they're prolly supposed to be shut down... just trying to operate under the radar... while working wearing masks...
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Old 07-30-2020, 06:58 AM
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The performance auto industry is in a weird spot. Personally, we blew through 6mos of inventory in 8 weeks and now we are scrambling because stuff shipped from Italy and its in some weird Customs vortex and I cant figure it out. I also have orders for stuff we cant assemble at the moment, going back 3 months.

It may very well be that they're down to the last few sets of heads and trying to figure out who gets what...its very frustrating to have to make those decisions on the fly. Regardless, this isn't standard procedure for them at all. But in our little 10 person firm I have a machinist whos now helping in shipping because of Covid. You got a screaming deal on a set of performance heads, yes long lead times suck, yes the guy on the phone could have been more forthcoming...trust me. But, when you strap those bad boys on...it'll be worth it, I promise.
Thanks for your update though, its always appreciated!
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Old 07-30-2020, 10:05 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by BuzzLOL View Post
Because of the Virus shutdown, there may only be one or two people working at Profiler... in fact, they're prolly supposed to be shut down... just trying to operate under the radar... while working wearing masks...
I bought a set directly from Profiler more than 3 years ago and had the same run around. I had a thread here similar to SoulSurfSD. I was told that the delay was because I ordered 185 runners rather than the 195/210 (different castings).

In the end it was worth it, but I waited almost 3 months I believe. I viewed them like many body shop owners that look at cars in their driveway as a checkbook deposit - 'ooh, I need some money, I better finish a car.'

I would guess that Profiler views backorders as a savings account.
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Old 07-30-2020, 04:31 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by 64nailhead View Post
Quote:
Originally Posted by BuzzLOL View Post
Because of the Virus shutdown, there may only be one or two people working at Profiler... in fact, they're prolly supposed to be shut down... just trying to operate under the radar... while working wearing masks...
I bought a set directly from Profiler more than 3 years ago and had the same run around. I had a thread here similar to SoulSurfSD. I was told that the delay was because I ordered 185 runners rather than the 195/210 (different castings).

In the end it was worth it, but I waited almost 3 months I believe. I viewed them like many body shop owners that look at cars in their driveway as a checkbook deposit - 'ooh, I need some money, I better finish a car.'

I would guess that Profiler views backorders as a savings account.
Yes, one of the hardest things as a business owner is telling someone it's gonna take awhile. I never take money up front, unless I know I'm going to start on it right away and finish it quick! But that's not usually the case. I'm small, one man band. So I always tell people I'm 3 weeks booked. It's scary, because they could go somewhere else. But guess what, they chose you for a reason. Profiler heads are amazing. I'll probably put a set on my next build. But I will probably purchase them from someone like Chad speier, and it looks like Scott Foxwell is going out on his own now too...
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